The reality of hiring millennials....

I got home a couple of hours ago from the United Brotherhood of Carpenters national training center in Las Vegas Nevada. I am a mentor and my student (Supt in training or mentee) is 6 months away from completing the 18 month Superintendent Training Course. I went through as a "mentee" about 13 years ago when the program was just starting out, think I was in the 3rd class. It was much less structured, and honestly, it was more fun. I'll add a little more flavor to that later.

Anyhow, one of the industry issues we covered was how to deal with "millennials". Every Supt mentor in this group is Gen X or older, about half the mentees were millennials. There was an awkward point when this topic was brought up, with the mentees in the room when the mentors were asked to describe the young people coming up through the ranks.

Our instructor, Richard Ryan who is an instructor at OU asked that we watch this video when we get a chance as it might change our thought process a bit. We all know this, but it was worth hearing, whether we like it are not, WE (meaning managers) will need to rely on these people in the coming years to produce and eventually take our positions. And we owe it to our employers, society and this young people to figure out how to get them where they need to be, or at least the ones who show they want to advance.

If your struggling with millennials, check this vid out.


[video=youtube;hER0Qp6QJNU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hER0Qp6QJNU[/video]

I'm getting ready to leave to Vegas tomorrow. I should be there before 10am. I am a millennial but I see things a little bit differently. I hope I do well this week.

I've had to have training in my industry as well. Unfortunately, I end up doing much of their work when I have hired them in the past. I learned to hire smoking hot ones so I feel better about giving away my hard earned money. All of my education was geared around stroking their egos and being extremely cautious when asking anything from them.

BHC Vic said:

I'm getting ready to leave to Vegas tomorrow. I should be there before 10am. I am a millennial but I see things a little bit differently. I hope I do well this week.

Click to expand...

Vic, the guy I am mentoring is older than I am (I am 47), but my company had 3 guys that have worked for me in the past and are still working for the company that were in that class I spoke to that are in their early 30's. Yes, we come across millennials that get it like, just like you, but you have to understand, witch I'm sure you do, that the people in your court, training you and believing / sponsoring you, were not raised or trained the same way and it is fucking hard to set that aside.

I feel that you will do well, as you give a shit and have proven you will make required sacrifices, hard sacrifices (family time), to advance and be successful at the career path YOU have chosen.

Dealing with generational differences with your own employer is tough, dealing with them when your the guy in charge and your sphere of influence includes project owners, their consultants and jurisdictional agencies and your own companies owners just adds an entirely different layer to leadership. I hope you appreciate my honesty, it's not meant to knock you, but I see your passion in your posts for the pride you take in what you do and it's obvious you want more. I don't know what advise your are getting from your company leaders, even though we have never met, I feel the need to offer advise as a brother in the union.

This site used to have several people that trashed the trade unions. To those people, take a look at some of the following pics I took yesterday of the investment the United Brotherhood of Carpenters has made (with union dues, no government help or aid) to build a world class training facility to ensure union UBC workers are the most highly trained and skilled workers in the market. The union contractors didn't put a nickel in to this amazing facility. They do get to take advantage of sending their employees for the training being offered though.

For those that have no idea what it is, it is a national training center for advancing skill-sets including for the following trades workers - Carpenters, floor covers, Interior finishes, Lathers, Mill workers and Cabinet makers, Millwrights, Pile Drivers and residential framers. The CITF also offers several courses for trade leadership. The employer only has to pay the wages for the time away from work, the CITF covers everything else. Airfare, room and board, food, open bar a couple nights out of the week.

The center has been added on to several times over the last 15 years, again, with union member dues. The center contracts with the best and the brightest to teach and certify.

Here are a couple of pictures I took today of one of the buildings. The CITF outgrew the 200+ dorm rooms so they purchased the Marriott Hotel across the street. This is the hotel I stayed in, it was frigging nice! Kitchen, separate living room, shower / toilet room, bedroom with two queen sized beds. HDTV's with all the channels in the living room and bedroom, full size kitchen etc. Pool, BBQ, gift store, free breakfast and happy hour.


Since the CITC is full up most nights they are building a new hotel adjacent to the old Marriot hotel.

Not sure why the huge plumb bob photo is showing?

Anyway, that huge plumb bob is part of the newest building, here are a couple more pics of it.

I'm loading the pics right off my phone and for some reason they are not wanting to load in a logical order. The photos of the high bay shop shop a divers tank for under water welding certification as well as a chamber for treating the bends, lots of the latest in concrete forming products, elevated highway scaffolding / deck form work, to the left is a mock up of a typical solar power array, farther to the left is an area that allows a scaffold set up to be built up through the roof (65'+), the roof has a powered panel that opens up etc.

This is just one of the buildings, they have 5.

Couple more random pics.

Those photos are impressive.

For many years I was anti union, and spouted off all of the well known "facts" like the members were lazy and inefficient.

It wasn't until my business grew into a firm with $35M in annual revenues building data centers that I came to respect trade unions and realized I couldn't do what I was doing without them.

In particular, my partnership with union electrical contractors was critical to success. A data center with a 4 kilovolt 10 megawatt electrical service isn't something a guy with a few years of on the job training can handle. It required true journeymen, apprentices in a regimented training program, and supervisors that understood my deadlines and goals.

The IBEW has always had some of the best training centers in the trades, and I've had the good fortune of working with some very talented guys.

That is a very impressive looking facility and I get the principle behind it. I wonder how their pension fund it doing.

Love the video. I knew pretty much all the things this guy spoke about. But never truly put it together like he did. The dopamine and addiction, was enlightening. The comment about never being satisfied with life, made me think of a key family member. Some light bulbs turned on in my head. Ihave shared it with several people. Thanks.

How this got on to Unions.. ??? In the past, speaking from experience here. Some key unions in the US were to slow to change in a global business competition scenario. Those Unions forced alot of companys to close down and move to other countrys. Watched it with my own eyes. Remember this comments is based on the past, not the present. I think they have realized the error of the past and most have corrected it.

Unions have to realize, either you have a competitive product that can sell or you dont. If the cost of labor is the reason why your products/services dont sell, then a company has to do what it can to stay in business. Alot of these issues go far and beyond what company's can control. Yes its US Policy, trade relations with other countries, goverment 101 issues. Which exceeds my Paygrade. I am just small business guy to get kids through college try to save for retirement, medical insurance, and most importantly, Have some fun with friends and family on occasion.

Which is why I love boats. Speaking of boats.. testing one at 10AM today.. Eliminator 236 might be mine in a day or two... No cell phone, instagram, facebook can put a smile on my face better than a new boat. Thats my dopamine...

What he said about technology pertains to pretty much everyone in the work force today, not just Millennials. I'm as guilty as the next guy, though I do make a conscious decision to not take my phone(s) into meetings or if I do they stay in my pocket.

Something else that is at play with the younger "kids" is the fact there are more generations in the work force now than any other time in history. We span from the Greatest Generation all the way to the Millennials. That has never happened before. There are more of the Millennial generation now than everyone else combined, so we're seeing similar frictions as when the Boomers came of age. Us Gen-X'ers are stuck in the middle, but if the Boomers (finally) leave the work force I think some of the friction will ease. There is to much of a parent/child relationship there IMHO...

This is where the apprenticeship model comes into play. What better to give someone a sense of "worth" than helping them master a trade or skill. It fills the gaps the video points out. Plus it gives a sense of community and belonging to a group. There is a lot to that.

I like the analogy of the climbing the mountain. Dead on accurate. The kids don't want to learn how to climb, they just want to have the success of being on the summit, with no risk of the fall.

Instigator said:

That is a very impressive looking facility and I get the principle behind it. I wonder how their pension fund it doing.

Click to expand...

Our pension fund is good. We aren't back at 200 credit years yet but our leaders are very very smart. I have a lot of notes about the fund at home from one of the foremans meetings, but im sitting at the airport headed to the training center right now.

Thanks for posting the video he nailed it.

That video was great. He really nailed it.

Also the union training center was very impressive. I have to admit that I had no idea they trained people to that level. It looks like a definite alternative to 4 years of college. So how does a young person finishing high school get into one of these programs? Can they just sign up at the training facility?

In thinking about some of the different opinions on unions. I think that there is a big difference between unions with train technical workers and the auto workers unions that represents people screwing on lug nuts and thinking they have the right to tell the auto makers how to run their business. The unions doing the technical training have a tough job. In today's world any trade job is getting more technical every day. I would expect that any trade would now take longer to complete an apprenticeship just because there is more to learn.

Or I would also think that the trades may be becoming more specialized.

bocco said:

That video was great. He really nailed it.

Also the union training center was very impressive. I have to admit that I had no idea they trained people to that level. It looks like a definite alternative to 4 years of college. So how does a young person finishing high school get into one of these programs? Can they just sign up at the training facility?

In thinking about some of the different opinions on unions. I think that there is a big difference between unions with train technical workers and the auto workers unions that represents people screwing on lug nuts and thinking they have the right to tell the auto makers how to run their business. The unions doing the technical training have a tough job. In today's world any trade job is getting more technical every day. I would expect that any trade would now take longer to complete an apprenticeship just because there is more to learn.

Or I would also think that the trades may be becoming more specialized.

Click to expand...

The carpenters union here in so cal is looking for guys. It's helps to know someone so you can quickly have a company sponsor you. Basically out of highschool you would go to the hall, sign up, and call companies off of the list and find one to sponsor you. When I start my next job I will be looking for apprentices so I will post up about it. Our program is a 4 year program, based on work hours and school credits. I'll pop back in later. Taking off now

Sleek-Jet said:

What he said about technology pertains to pretty much everyone in the work force today, not just Millennials. I'm as guilty as the next guy, though I do make a conscious decision to not take my phone(s) into meetings or if I do they stay in my pocket.

Something else that is at play with the younger "kids" is the fact there are more generations in the work force now than any other time in history. We span from the Greatest Generation all the way to the Millennials. That has never happened before. There are more of the Millennial generation now than everyone else combined, so we're seeing similar frictions as when the Boomers came of age. Us Gen-X'ers are stuck in the middle, but if the Boomers (finally) leave the work force I think some of the friction will ease. There is to much of a parent/child relationship there IMHO...

This is where the apprenticeship model comes into play. What better to give someone a sense of "worth" than helping them master a trade or skill. It fills the gaps the video points out. Plus it gives a sense of community and belonging to a group. There is a lot to that.

Click to expand...

That is true, but what the video did not go into is the other side of millennial employment. It is hard for a company to invest in someone that does not want to put the time in, or will bail for the next gig. Just because you got a degree does not mean you will waltz in and get a title or salary.

What is scary is that the employment landscape is changing, and millennials will be moving toward a contract or on demand employment model. They will need to master skills around marketing themselves, teambuilding, and adding value, communication and interaction in order to further their employment.

LargeOrangeFont said:

That is true, but what the video did not go into is the other side of millennial employment. It is hard for a company to invest in someone that does not want to put the time in, or will bail for the next gig. Just because you got a degree does not mean you will waltz in and get a title or salary.

What is scary is that the employment landscape is changing, and millennials will be moving toward a contract or on demand employment model. They will need to master skills around marketing themselves, teambuilding, and adding value, communication and interaction in order to further their employment.

Click to expand...

It isn't anything different than in the past. Change is inevitable, I don't think it's "scary". Things will be different for sure, but even now "college" is starting be seen not as the automatic path to a successful career that it has been.

I think the trades and the unions are on the cusp of something pretty exciting.

How much are you paying for union dues in the Carpenters Union per month? I am curious to compare it to the dues we pay for the BMWE union in the Railroad.

Sleek-Jet said:

It isn't anything different than in the past. Change is inevitable, I don't think it's "scary". Things will be different for sure, but even now "college" is starting be seen not as the automatic path to a successful career that it has been.

I think the trades and the unions are on the cusp of something pretty exciting.

Click to expand...

It is COMPLETELY different than the past. Legislation is essentially disincentivising companies have full time workers. At the same time automation is changing how the human labor force is used.

We are going towards "on demand" employment model for much of the country, and many people will have multiple jobs at a time. Not all jobs will go this way, but if you want to be a web designer or programmer, you likely won't land a full time job in the future.

I agree that in the coming years, kids will start heading back into some of the trades. Unions have there place in certain trades, and are literally killing other employment sectors. This is coming from someone who's parents had a union income growing up.

LargeOrangeFont said:

It is COMPLETELY different than the past. Legislation is essentially disincentivising companies have full time workers. At the same time automation is changing how the human labor force is used.

We are going towards "on demand" employment model for much of the country, and many people will have multiple jobs at a time. Not all jobs will go this way, but if you want to be a web designer or programmer, you likely won't land a full time job in the future.

I agree that in the coming years, kids will start heading back into some of the trades. Unions have there place in certain trades, and are literally killing other employment sectors. This is coming from someone who's parents had a union income growing up.

Click to expand...

Change is nothing new.

MOISTURE MISSLE said:

How much are you paying for union dues in the Carpenters Union per month? I am curious to compare it to the dues we pay for the BMWE union in the Railroad.

Click to expand...

Now that was a fast flight. It's 20 a month and then there's supplemental dues out of our hourly package. I forget that number though

Sleek-Jet said:

Change is nothing new.

Click to expand...

Change is constant. The problem is when people are not equipped to or refuse to adapt to it.

And there are few consequences for those individuals because society leaves fewer and fewer behind, the burden is carried by others in society.

I've got a union laborer working for me now through labor ready. The kid says he's number 300 and some on the waiting list and would rather work than sit home. What I don't get is how the union would drop him to the bottom of the list if they found out. At least he'd rather be productive than sit at home and collect unemployment. If anyone needs a union laborer, you wouldn't be disappointed in this one[emoji106]

Joker said:

I've got a union laborer working for me now through labor ready. The kid says he's number 300 and some on the waiting list and would rather work than sit home. What I don't get is how the union would drop him to the bottom of the list if they found out. At least he'd rather be productive than sit at home and collect unemployment. If anyone needs a union laborer, you wouldn't be disappointed in this one[emoji106]

Click to expand...

I'll let my buddies w Clark and Raymond know. My company isn't signatory w the laborers union. It's a little touchy between our two unions but it's getting better

I found the video to be excellent. Thanks for the posting.

ive seen this video before. pretty good take on the issue. at my company we have issues with millennials. they claim they are being harassed when you ask them if they need help with a task, etc. They cannot show up on time, and have an excuse for everything when they are questioned about their actions (or lack-of). my co is shutting the doors on my plant this year. we have gone out of our way to bring in over 20 companies actively hiring for a job fair, brought in the unemployment people to help them create a resume. when it came time for the resume writing sessions, they all wanted to be paid for it, and they wanted someone else to write them for them. they are doing nothing proactively for their future, they think someone is going to do it for them.. we had 2 employees quit and got jobs with another company, making more money even.. both have been fired by that company. one didnt even make it a week, the other lasted a month. they both bitched that they couldnt use their cell phones, stand around and bullshit with others, complained they had to actually work and be productive and were held to a standard.

jones performance said:

ive seen this video before. pretty good take on the issue. at my company we have issues with millennials. they claim they are being harassed when you ask them if they need help with a task, etc. They cannot show up on time, and have an excuse for everything when they are questioned about their actions (or lack-of). my co is shutting the doors on my plant this year. we have gone out of our way to bring in over 20 companies actively hiring for a job fair, brought in the unemployment people to help them create a resume. when it came time for the resume writing sessions, they all wanted to be paid for it, and they wanted someone else to write them for them. they are doing nothing proactively for their future, they think someone is going to do it for them.. we had 2 employees quit and got jobs with another company, making more money even.. both have been fired by that company. one didnt even make it a week, the other lasted a month. they both bitched that they couldnt use their cell phones, stand around and bullshit with others, complained they had to actually work and be productive and were held to a standard.

Click to expand...

I think that the other side of the coin of what was said in the video and what you (and others) have experienced. There is a vast difference between wanting to work for a purpose or make an "impact", and expecting to be paid and recognized for underachieving/not working.

Not even gonna watch that vid...

To lump all kids/humans into the same boat, just because of the date of their birth, is just fucking ludicrous to me. :thumbsdown

Parents create good humans. At least once a month, I have the same group of Eagle Scouts hanging out at my house. Are they all the same? Fuck no.

There are two twins. One wants to be in law enforcement, one wants to a computer/electronics engineer.

My son wants to be a fire fighter.

The others all have various goals, and none of em are looking to get into construction.

Everyone of em are hard working kids, that I am loving watching grow up. It's an honor to be part of their circle.

I went into Dickie's BBQ the other day to pick up stuff for fathers day. My daughter works there. She is 17. It's summer job for her, but already they have her doing management training positions. The manger tells me she is the best worker they have, and proceeds to tell me what a great job I did as a parent. Made me smile, but to me, it's more up to how she is than anything I ever did.

Did I create these humans that want to work hard to get what they want? Maybe. Parents have a HUGE influence over how their kids behave, I see that in the real world every day.

But honestly....

I think Martial Arts had the biggest effect on my kids. They learned they had to work HARD to achieve their goals. The confidence it gave them knowing they can handle themselves in ANY situation, has had a profound effect on them.

Boy Scouts was huge as well. My friend who trains Boy Scout leaders told me: Scouts is a program designed to create good humans, disguised as having fun.

Having a particular birthday has nothing to do with who you are. Fuck that millennial bullshit. :thumbsdown:thumbsdown

rivermobster said:

Not even gonna watch that vid...

To lump all kids/humans into the same boat, just because of the date of their birth, is just fucking ludicrous to me. :thumbsdown

Parents create good humans. At least once a month, I have the same group of Eagle Scouts hanging out at my house. Are they all the same? Fuck no.

There are two twins. One wants to be in law enforcement, one wants to a computer/electronics engineer.

My son wants to be a fire fighter.

The others all have various goals, and none of em are looking to get into construction.

Everyone of em are hard working kids, that I am loving watching grow up. It's an honor to be part of their circle.

I went into Dickie's BBQ the other day to pick up stuff for fathers day. My daughter works there. She is 17. It's summer job for her, but already they have her doing management training positions. The manger tells me she is the best worker they have, and proceeds to tell me what a great job I did as a parent. Made me smile, but to me, it's more up to how she is than anything I ever did.

Did I create these humans that want to work hard to get what they want? Maybe. Parents have a HUGE influence over how their kids behave, I see that in the real world every day.

But honestly....

I think Martial Arts had the biggest effect on my kids. They learned they had to work HARD to achieve their goals. The confidence it gave them knowing they can handle themselves in ANY situation, has had a profound effect on them.

Boy Scouts was huge as well. My friend who trains Boy Scout leaders told me: Scouts is a program designed to create good humans, disguised as having fun.

Having a particular birthday has nothing to do with who you are. Fuck that millennial bullshit. :thumbsdown:thumbsdown

Click to expand...

You should watch the video. That is not really the point the guy is making, and by extension I think he agrees with you. He pretty much said that the general parenting style of millennial parents did not work as intended. The parents are not bad people, it was a bad combo of participation trophies, and instant gratification/technology to overly simplify his point.

If you instilled a good work ethic and forced your kids to lead a balanced lifestyle.. they will bypass all the Millennial BS.

You hit the nail on the head.. it is about teaching a kid perseverance and confidence, not enabling them and creating a narcissist.

Well I hired a Millennial recently. About 26 years old, brought him in as a intern to feel him out..

Then offered him a full time job after a few months..

Kid rocks to far.. But he is a ReCon Marine, with every kind of Military Training you can imagine... Y



So, My advice, if you are having problem with the average Millennial.. then try to get former Military peeps..

On Average, they all have people skills, take direction well, show up on time, and are focused getting the task done and moving on to the next task.

The facts are that the parents of the millennial's bear a measure of responsibility for their offspring. We were seeing the first of them trying to apply for LEO obs when I was near the end of my career. After 3 days of doing Oral Boards with them I told the HR Director, with whom I got along, that this was going to screw up law enforcement for decades.
Gen X'ers wanted to know the why of everything, and many times the why is self explanatory, in that we have learned doing certain things is liable to get ya shot. So we train to not do them. Training the gen x people is not that bad, you must lay down the law and the consequences for deviating from policies and procedures, and put up with a bit of whining. Once you show that whining isn't gonna fly they did ok. When you can reach a place where their sniveling makes them look stupid, they stop, or go away of their own accord.
I could see in the Oral Boards that the millennial's were gonna be a whole new ball game. They do not do well in a para military setting, and frankly it is good the the academy process can wash most of them before they ever get to an agency hiring process.
When I became an FTO and got involved in the training mission the stats ion trainee success were about 1 in 50 applications, I am told that number is closer to 150 today.
I would really quiz a kid before endorsing a LEO career, it isn't what it once was....but ex military or otherwise if they have their act together agencies are crying for good people.

I had one guy that worked for me in the navy that was a whinny little bitch. Everytime I would give him a job to do he would whine, cry, and moap about doing. After a few months I got tired of it. I just ignored him for about 10 minutes while he did all that. Then I just turned to him and asked him if he was done. He said ok, then went to work. Never had a problem out of him after that.

rivermobster said:

Not even gonna watch that vid...

To lump all kids/humans into the same boat, just because of the date of their birth, is just fucking ludicrous to me. :thumbsdown

Parents create good humans. At least once a month, I have the same group of Eagle Scouts hanging out at my house. Are they all the same? Fuck no.

There are two twins. One wants to be in law enforcement, one wants to a computer/electronics engineer.

My son wants to be a fire fighter.

The others all have various goals, and none of em are looking to get into construction.

Everyone of em are hard working kids, that I am loving watching grow up. It's an honor to be part of their circle.

I went into Dickie's BBQ the other day to pick up stuff for fathers day. My daughter works there. She is 17. It's summer job for her, but already they have her doing management training positions. The manger tells me she is the best worker they have, and proceeds to tell me what a great job I did as a parent. Made me smile, but to me, it's more up to how she is than anything I ever did.

Did I create these humans that want to work hard to get what they want? Maybe. Parents have a HUGE influence over how their kids behave, I see that in the real world every day.

But honestly....

I think Martial Arts had the biggest effect on my kids. They learned they had to work HARD to achieve their goals. The confidence it gave them knowing they can handle themselves in ANY situation, has had a profound effect on them.

Boy Scouts was huge as well. My friend who trains Boy Scout leaders told me: Scouts is a program designed to create good humans, disguised as having fun.

Having a particular birthday has nothing to do with who you are. Fuck that millennial bullshit. :thumbsdown:thumbsdown

Click to expand...

I was hoping to make it all the way through the responses before commenting, but couldn't get past your post. Of course the video isn't directed at your children, it's directed at the majority of the generation known as " millennials" and offers introspective to the other generations as to how to deal with them. If you don't work anymore, and don't give a shit about trying to relate to the people that will soon be a larger decision making majority than all other generations, it's your right to stick your head in the sand. If your children are as you described, they will have the same difficulty as the rest of us dealing with them. I have two kids, 11 and 14, I am trying to raise them right as well, but you know what? They are influenced almost as much by friends, teachers, coaches, bus drivers etc as me and my wife influence them.

If your looking for a pat on the back for doing a great job raising your kids, great job being a dad. Unfortunately, you did not raise all of the millennials.

spectra3279 said:

I had one guy that worked for me in the navy that was a whinny little bitch. Everytime I would give him a job to do he would whine, cry, and moap about doing. After a few months I got tired of it. I just ignored him for about 10 minutes while he did all that. Then I just turned to him and asked him if he was done. He said ok, then went to work. Never had a problem out of him after that.

Click to expand...

This makes me laugh!

I used to do that same thing with my daughter when she was little! (like five or six maybe) She would have a tantrum about something, and I'd send her to her room, and tell her don't come out till you are done crying.

She would come out in about 10 minutes with a big smile on her face...

"you done now"?

"yeah"

"ok good"

We all talked about this over dinner a few weeks ago, and had a good laugh about it!!!!

rivermobster said:

This makes me laugh!

I used to do that same thing with my daughter when she was little! (like five or six maybe) She would have a tantrum about something, and I'd send her to her room, and tell her don't come out till you are done crying.

She would come out in about 10 minutes with a big smile on her face...

"you done now"?

"yeah"

"ok good"

We all talked about this over dinner a few weeks ago, and had a good laugh about it!!!!

Click to expand...

That's exactly how I treated him. Just like a 3 year old. Nobody else could get him to do shit. I tried everything until then. Then I just said fuck it why not.

IROCDave said:

I was hoping to make it all the way through the responses before commenting, but couldn't get past your post. Of course the video isn't directed at your children, it's directed at the majority of the generation known as " millennials" and offers introspective to the other generations as to how to deal with them. If you don't work anymore, and don't give a shit about trying to relate to the people that will soon be a larger decision making majority than all other generations, it's your right to stick your head in the sand. If your children are as you described, they will have the same difficulty as the rest of us dealing with them. I have two kids, 11 and 14, I am trying to raise them right as well, but you know what? They are influenced almost as much by friends, teachers, coaches, bus drivers etc as me and my wife influence them.

If your looking for a pat on the back for doing a great job raising your kids, great job being a dad. Unfortunately, you did not raise all of the millennials.

Click to expand...

Wasn't looking for a pat on the back. I was just trying to point out that someone's birthday has nothing what so ever to do with who they are!

As for your kids...

Watch their homework like a hawk. The libtard teachers will try and spin all kina crazy stuff into their heads! I saw it happen frequently when I'd look at my kids homework. We would talk about what the Real point of the assignment was, and what I thought they (the teachers) were trying to get across. It made them open their eyes.

Keep em busy. Don't give them time to be influenced! Set an example for them, and let your life and how you lead it, be all the "influence" they need.

And get em in Martial Arts. It lets you sleep well at night, knowing they can take care of themselves, and it teaches them they have to work to get what they want.

This what my kids took...

[video=youtube;q6gwmaS9N6s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6gwmaS9N6s&index=5&list=PLNBpDWevaYqI5rstm2hqIwWDfHizJsDF3[/video]

I am a millennial in the workforce (mfg). Having worked with other "kids" in this company as well as others. I can first tell you there are two types. The type that everyone thinks. In other words the typical stereotype. This is the kid who expects to be made vp of basket weaving because they have a physc degree. Or the one who whines about doing work and that they have no concept of how to achieve those "dreams" they have. The other type can sound similar. They also want to be vp but more ask how can I get there. All millennials are guilty of wanting to know how long. They like a plan and a agenda of life.

As for me I take on everything I can to show I can do it. Some things I would like recognition for but may not get it. I want to be vp of ops at my company. I ask questions I learn. I challenge the way of doing things and offer new ideas. One thing that does bug me but I have no control over, is due to the high amount of millennnial work force there are a lot of people for limited jobs. Companies know this. I am dealing with it now. I have been at my company for 5 years. I have a really good positive ppv. I work hard and always show up on time. Does this warrant me getting a raise. Yes and no is my answer. It is expected of me to generate a positive ppv and show up on time and work hard. However when I generate so much ppv (money at the bottom line) that I keep the company profitibale for 5 straight years. I know I am capable of more. My company is keeping my salary low (imo) to keep my humble. This has an adverse effect as I know I am great employee (asset) to the company because of this I know I can take my skills and go somewhere else willing to pay me more. I want to give my company the chance to keep me, but I do not see that chance anymore.

Moral of the story is a lot of millennials feel expandable because there are a lot of us. This is true, however when you get a good one (like me) you need to keep them and pay them to continue to be an asset for your company or they will leave. Millennials are power hungry

Sorry of this is all over the map. I have the thoughts in my head and I not the best at writing them down

Bpracing1127 said:

I am a millennial in the workforce (mfg). Having worked with other "kids" in this company as well as others. I can first tell you there are two types. The type that everyone thinks. In other words the typical stereotype. This is the kid who expects to be made vp of basket weaving because they have a physc degree. Or the one who whines about doing work and that they have no concept of how to achieve those "dreams" they have. The other type can sound similar. They also want to be vp but more ask how can I get there. All millennials are guilty of wanting to know how long. They like a plan and a agenda of life.

As for me I take on everything I can to show I can do it. Some things I would like recognition for but may not get it. I want to be vp of ops at my company. I ask questions I learn. I challenge the way of doing things and offer new ideas. One thing that does bug me but I have no control over, is due to the high amount of millennnial work force there are a lot of people for limited jobs. Companies know this. I am dealing with it now. I have been at my company for 5 years. I have a really good positive ppv. I work hard and always show up on time. Does this warrant me getting a raise. Yes and no is my answer. It is expected of me to generate a positive ppv and show up on time and work hard. However when I generate so much ppv (money at the bottom line) that I keep the company profitibale for 5 straight years. I know I am capable of more. My company is keeping my salary low (imo) to keep my humble. This has an adverse effect as I know I am great employee (asset) to the company because of this I know I can take my skills and go somewhere else willing to pay me more. I want to give my company the chance to keep me, but I do not see that chance anymore.

Moral of the story is a lot of millennials feel expandable because there are a lot of us. This is true, however when you get a good one (like me) you need to keep them and pay them to continue to be an asset for your company or they will leave. Millennials are power hungry

Sorry of this is all over the map. I have the thoughts in my head and I not the best at writing them down

Click to expand...

This is just a observation -

You need to begin to look for another job in your field if that is how you feel. Do you go in every day and tell your bosses thanks for underpaying you and keeping you humble? That is a litmus test for management. They are conditioning you to accept lower wages, and lower raises over time.

If the work you feel you are doing and the value you are providing to your company is greater than what you are being compensated, it is time to call their bluff. They will either pay to keep you, or let you walk. The best way to do that is with an offer for another position. When you discount or give something away you diminish its value. You are giving them a discount on your productivity. Early in a career that is needed and part of the game, to gain experience and build a resume, but at some point you have to change that trajectory for yourself.


Again, just my opinion. There are many many factors that go into staying at a job besides pay, but I saw my brother go through this same scenario. It took awhile, but he found a better position making better money. The best time to look for a new job is when you have a steady one.

Today there is little incentive to stay at a company for an extended period. In my opinion people should be testing the employment market every few years, if nothing else to make sure where that are at is still best for them.

I'm condensing several different posts questions and or comments, just cause I hate typing and going backwards to address every point or question.

The trade unions should never be looked at through the same lens as teachers, auto-manufactures, public utilities, DOT and even the aerospace industry unions.

Tradesmen work their ass off for what they are paid, construction is one of the most vicious free market industries in the US. Union General Contractors and sub contractors compete against large non union contractors on most RFP's. The trade unions know they need to have an elite work force to meet the demand. I really don't like electricians, but I trust them and know they know what they are doing. Plumbers are a close second to electricians in my mind, but I trust them as well. Steel erectors are the last of the dying breed of total cowboys, but I trust them as well, and by trust, I know they wont cut corners and let a partially erected building collapse because of ignorance or arrogance. These guys take their job seriously and flat out want cut corners. If your a union basher, go spout your bullshit to a steel erector, you will more than likely get your ass beaten to a pulp. I don't care how big or bad you think you are, it will happen. To this day they protect their union and their reputation. And they should, there is a reason you dont see many non union erectors. It takes a special breed of people to do the shit they do day in and out.

Back in 1991 when I entered the Carpenters Union, it was made perfectly fucking clear by every journeymen carpenter that I didn't know shit and I needed to shut up and take the direction they provided. And I did. I also learned to be hyper attentive and jump in any time an older worker was performing a difficult task, weather they wanted help or not. I worked around a lot of old timers and they set my shit straight quickly and often. The common saying was " your making big money and you better earn every fucking nickel, there's another person standing in line to take your job". The slacker BS is controlled by the journeymen in the union, the union stresses that the scab outfits are nipping at the heals of the union and if you want to keep working you need to outwork, outsmart and out train them. While in apprenticeship the school monitors your work hours, tests you, and if your late marks you down, if your late more than once they will boot your ass out of the union. That was what it was like for me in 1991 and all through the 90's.

Part of our problem with kids coming out of HS in the last 30 years is that trade schools have been overshadowed and frowned upon by the "my kid needs a degree".

Why? So he / she / you can owe 120K when they are 22 YO AND have not earned a nickel in 4 years? I would venture to say that almost half of HS graduates have very little interest, or not ready and or just are not interested in sitting in a classroom for another 4 - 6 years. The trades are the perfect place for these people ( I am one of "these people"). Why not join a trade union and make good money while you learn on the job, start the timer to be fully vested in a solid retirement program, have your own above average healthcare and learn hard life lessons early and get on with life?

It's hard work, but that is what makes it great. As you get older you perform the more technical stuff, you have control over millions of dollars worth of decision making on the fly and the best part is this. At the end of every day, you can walk away, turn around and look at what YOU made / assembled / built and know that it will be there after you are gone.

The wages are decent during apprenticeship and the pay scale quickly ramps up so there is a lot of incentive for the aprenti to work the required hours and complete schooling.

The unions are hurting for workers right now. That doesn't mean anyone can just hop in and drag ass, but it does mean people are being given the oppertunity to prove they want to make a career out of the trade they choose.

For the " automation is coming and you neanderthals will be out of work" Fuck off, you have no idea what it takes to build. Buildings are not Toyota Camry's, everyone one is custom, one off entities. Machines cant construct buildings because they cant adapt on the fly and they will NEVER have the knowledge and adaptability that an experienced tradesman has. Like some dumb as a fucking rock college kid is going to program "project X" to go build shit with teh same dexterity as a human being in the rain, wind, heat, snow all the while looking at the latest RFI, ASI, CCD, CCDI etc and interpreting all the missing data and moving forward with the interpreted intent. Never going to happen. If you think so, you obviously don't know shit about big time commercial construction.

I don't give a shit what the employment landscape looks like, or what generation you are. You bust your ass and give 120%....give an actual shit about your work....somebody who is accountable for the end deliverables is gonna notice and hang on to you / develop you / promote you. People can spin it all they want, but at the end of the day if you can't get the job you were hired to do done, what good are you? There is no replacement for hard work. Glassdoor that bitches [emoji3]

Bigbore500r said:

I don't give a shit what the employment landscape looks like, or what generation you are. You bust your ass and give 120%....give an actual shit about your work....somebody who is accountable for the end deliverables is gonna notice and hang on to you / develop you / promote you. People can spin it all they want, but at the end of the day if you can't get the job you were hired to do done, what good are you? There is no replacement for hard work. Glassdoor that bitches [emoji3]

Click to expand...

You just threw a rock through it.

LargeOrangeFont said:

You just threw a rock through it.

Click to expand...

Bout time!

It's mind blowing watching the landscape change. The sad thing is you can't teach people to give a shit. And if they don't give a shit nothing is gonna prop them up, it's like trying to build a custom home on a bad foundation.

Bpracing1127 said:

I am a millennial in the workforce (mfg). Having worked with other "kids" in this company as well as others. I can first tell you there are two types. The type that everyone thinks. In other words the typical stereotype. This is the kid who expects to be made vp of basket weaving because they have a physc degree. Or the one who whines about doing work and that they have no concept of how to achieve those "dreams" they have. The other type can sound similar. They also want to be vp but more ask how can I get there. All millennials are guilty of wanting to know how long. They like a plan and a agenda of life.

As for me I take on everything I can to show I can do it. Some things I would like recognition for but may not get it. I want to be vp of ops at my company. I ask questions I learn. I challenge the way of doing things and offer new ideas. One thing that does bug me but I have no control over, is due to the high amount of millennnial work force there are a lot of people for limited jobs. Companies know this. I am dealing with it now. I have been at my company for 5 years. I have a really good positive ppv. I work hard and always show up on time. Does this warrant me getting a raise. Yes and no is my answer. It is expected of me to generate a positive ppv and show up on time and work hard. However when I generate so much ppv (money at the bottom line) that I keep the company profitibale for 5 straight years. I know I am capable of more. My company is keeping my salary low (imo) to keep my humble. This has an adverse effect as I know I am great employee (asset) to the company because of this I know I can take my skills and go somewhere else willing to pay me more. I want to give my company the chance to keep me, but I do not see that chance anymore.

Moral of the story is a lot of millennials feel expandable because there are a lot of us. This is true, however when you get a good one (like me) you need to keep them and pay them to continue to be an asset for your company or they will leave. Millennials are power hungry

Sorry of this is all over the map. I have the thoughts in my head and I not the best at writing them down

Click to expand...

I dont know what industry you are in, but if it's construction, I would tell you to chill the fuck out. 5 years in any industry seems to be when you really start learning the company protocols. VP of Operations is usually an owners position in my industry and that takes 20 years + of hard work to get to that. Again, I don't know what you do for a living, but if it's commercial construction, you need to simmer down, you need to earn it, and 5 years is a drop in the bucket, you haven't earned shit yet.

What Millennials need to understand is when you get really good at your job, the saddle is put on you for another decade or more of proving yourself. By saddle, I mean your packing the company on your back for 10 - 20 years before owners will consider offering you a seat at the table. You know why that is? Because that is how it was offered to them. And that is the issue with millennials. They think they can short cut that process. I would counter WHY do you think you can do this? Are you the smartest person to ever work for your company? Are there other people that are older and have been performing at the same level as you? If yes, what makes you better than them other than you have a bigger mouth. I don't know you, but what I posed as questions are what us non millennials are seeing from that generation in the work place.

Bigbore500r said:

Bout time!

It's mind blowing watching the landscape change. The sad thing is you can't teach people to give a shit. And if they don't give a shit nothing is gonna prop them up, it's like trying to build a custom home on a bad foundation.

Click to expand...

70% of the population has always been unemployable. You just see more of them now because of social media and technology.

IROCDave said:

I dont know what industry you are in, but if it's construction, I would tell you to chill the fuck out. 5 years in any industry seems to be when you really start learning the company protocols. VP of Operations is usually an owners position in my industry and that takes 20 years + of hard work to get to that. Again, I don't know what you do for a living, but if it's commercial construction, you need to simmer down, you need to earn it, and 5 years is a drop in the bucket, you haven't earned shit yet.

What Millennials need to understand is when you get really good at your job, the saddle is put on you for another decade or more of proving yourself. By saddle, I mean your packing the company on your back for 10 - 20 years before owners will consider offering you a seat at the table. You know why that is? Because that is how it was offered to them. And that is the issue with millennials. They think they can short cut that process. I would counter WHY do you think you can do this? Are you the smartest person to ever work for your company? Are there other people that are older and have been performing at the same level as you? If yes, what makes you better than them other than you have a bigger mouth. I don't know you, but what I posed as questions are what us non millennials are seeing from that generation in the work place.

Click to expand...

And it is the complete opposite in any kind of tech job. If you sit in the same place for 10 years, you've lost skill, marketability, and wages. unless of course you've been rising through the ranks, at which time you should be looking for the newer, better paying position now that you have a complete and impressive resume.

LargeOrangeFont said:

70% of the population has always been unemployable. You just see more of them now because of social media and technology.

Click to expand...

This is true.

Thank the internet for giving that 70% the chance to gather in droves and broadcast.

Jesus...... reading all this shit I don't know how most of you can wipe your ass. There has to be A LOT of broken arms from patting yourselves on the back. And of course mostly from the Union guys.

LargeOrangeFont said:

70% of the population has always been unemployable. You just see more of them now because of social media and technology.

Click to expand...

BNAG!!!

There it is. Nothing has changed. This is the way it's ALWAYS been! lol

The way I pose this to my kids is...

Think about your average class room. How many straight A students are in there?? How many stoners? How many Jocks? How many people just passing the time? How many people that actually CARE??

Now multiply that out to the real world. Get the picture?

Same shit, different decade. The only thing that Really changes is your view/perspective on it!

rivermobster said:

Wasn't looking for a pat on the back. I was just trying to point out that someone's birthday has nothing what so ever to do with who they are!

As for your kids...

Watch their homework like a hawk. The libtard teachers will try and spin all kina crazy stuff into their heads! I saw it happen frequently when I'd look at my kids homework. We would talk about what the Real point of the assignment was, and what I thought they (the teachers) were trying to get across. It made them open their eyes.

Keep em busy. Don't give them time to be influenced! Set an example for them, and let your life and how you lead it, be all the "influence" they need.

And get em in Martial Arts. It lets you sleep well at night, knowing they can take care of themselves, and it teaches them they have to work to get what they want.

This what my kids took...

Click to expand...

Hey Rivermobster (Joe, right?) I will give you congrats on raising what sounds to be good kids. Good on you. I get what you're saying that you can't lump everyone into one group. I also get what Daves saying and agree with his points. "Mellinials" and other generations are grouped together by society values, beliefs, activities, actions, etc. The generations are like water in a stream and flow together for the most part but all are not exactly the same and there is always exceptions to the rules. Not everyone is going to fit all molds but for the most part, the generation analysis does a very good (and very interesting I think) job of identifying trait and life styles for the masses of specific generational groups. They're pretty dead on for all the generation explanations. It's not a slap in the face or an insult to your kids. It's what your kids are going to have to deal with from peers as well as from others that immediately presume them "fuckin mellinials"

I too have a 23 y/o daughter that is a mellinial and I gotta say, she really doesn't fit the bill at all. Super self driven, straight A's her whole life, worked her ass off in everything she ever did, super competitive and is now in an advanced nursing program (selected 23 out of 500 applicants) and is leading her class there too. So no, not everyone fits all generational descriptions. I'd like to say we (her parents) had a lot to do with that but in truth, she just is who she is.

Anyway, the Generational identity profile is pretty interesting to begin with but this particular video is excellent at discussing why this specific generation "generally" acts a certain way, not just discusses the manner in which they act. The speaker is pretty engaging and is very good at explaining things as he draws you into the topic with the calming way he speaks.

I would suggest you remove yourself from the personal aspect and just view it for what it is.....Or not:thumbsup