Tesla fires hundreds of workers.

I wonder if Musk draining the swamp? Maybe some disgruntled workers were trying to unionize Tesla:hmm

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-14/amid-management-exodus-tesla-fires-hundreds-workers

One month after Tesla lost its head of business development who wished to "spend more time with his family", and just weeks after the EV company's veteran battery technology director also unexpectedly quit amid a growing senior management exodus (full list at the bottom of this article), Tesla decided to even out the ranks on the bottom as well, and fired "hundreds of workers" this week, including engineers, managers and factory workers even as the company struggles to expand its manufacturing and product line, according to the Mercury News which first reported of the mass layoffs.

Workers estimated between 400 and 700 employees have been fired, although Tesla refused to say how many employees were let go, and added that it expects employee turnover to be similar to last year’s attrition. Tesla employs about 10,000 workers at its Fremont factory; it lost $336 million in the second quarter, and burned through a record $1.16 billion in cash in Q2, or $13 million per day

Being run on taxpayer grants, "Obama Eco dollars", and throwing money at it with both hands .

"Musk is running full speed on top of a picket fence, and if one foot slips ..............."

A lot of dead weight in Mfg has brought down good companies. I have repaired stuff that engineers and processors ( low skilled workers) have destroyed due to incompetence. A few hundred is about right imo if that is the case. People who can't produce get a walking to the front door no questions asked.

13 Mil per day loss.. WOW f'n Wow..

spectras only said:

Workers estimated between 400 and 700 employees have been fired, although Tesla refused to say how many employees were let go, and added that it expects employee turnover to be similar to last year?s attrition. Tesla employs about 10,000 workers at its Fremont factory; it lost $336 million in the second quarter, and burned through a record $1.16 billion in cash in Q2, or $13 million per day

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Certainly one wonders if the "reduction in force" is a reflection of the $13mil per day and trying to break even. Not sure what the pay scales are there, but 400-700 workers with an average pay of $75K is only $52mil out of a $4 billion annual operating loss. It would seem that Tesla is finding out you actually have to produce a product the public wants to buy, at a price they are willing to pay is what the free market is about. Being subsidized by the taxpayer to build things the public doesn't want is not a solid business strategy.

Bottom 15% of all workers get fired after their annual reviews. :skull

At least they didn't call Zack in to dart them from a helicopter.

My SiL hit some water during the recent flooding and insurance totaled the car as the electrical system fried. Same thing with another local owner.

Both told me they won't buy another as the initial cost and lack of range make them impractical. Fast and fun to drive, but not worth the cost. From what I see, they are an expensive novelty at this point and buyers see that.....

We're bidding a job right now with a Tesla tile roof specified.
Met with the owner and the architect and I asked what his experience with the roofing was, zero was his reply.
I told the owner being the test subject for a new product that just came on the market is unwise. The hippy dippy architect replied that you can't find a more solid company than Tesla, I restrained myself from answering.

Went direct to Tesla with phone calls and e-mails, no reply. Check for comments on the product and nothing but complaints. Biggest complaint was deposits paid for the product and no product delivered with no response from Tesla trying to track their orders down. It's a house of cards.

500bbc said:

We're bidding a job right now with a Tesla tile roof specified.
Met with the owner and the architect and I asked what his experience with the roofing was, zero was his reply.
I told the owner being the test subject for a new product that just came on the market is unwise. The hippy dippy architect replied that you can't find a more solid company than Tesla, I restrained myself from answering.

Went direct to Tesla with phone calls and e-mails, no reply. Check for comments on the product and nothing but complaints. Biggest complaint was deposits paid for the product and no product delivered with no response from Tesla trying to track their orders down. It's a house of cards.

Click to expand...

I believe the only roof installations "in the wild" are on Solar City executive houses, the product isn't ready for prime-time.

Curious what the cost per/sq ft is on the tiles?

Old Texan said:

My SiL hit some water during the recent flooding and insurance totaled the car as the electrical system fried. Same thing with another local owner.

Both told me they won't buy another as the initial cost and lack of range make them impractical. Fast and fun to drive, but not worth the cost. From what I see, they are an expensive novelty at this point and buyers see that.....

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I bought a P85DL for my wife. We have had it for 3 years. It is an awesome car in Southern California. When I need to work in downtown LA I will take it and get carpool access. 100 miles round trip easy no charge needed. Saves time and aggravation. Tesla is expanding their super charging stations with them model 3 releasing it is going to be a mess. The one by my house has a line during the day all the time. OT I get it though it is not for everyone.

Sleek-Jet said:

I believe the only roof installations "in the wild" are on Solar City executive houses, the product isn't ready for prime-time.

Curious what the cost per/sq ft is on the tiles?

Click to expand...

I have wondered the same thing. It has to be astronomical. I cannot wait until the tiles are commoditized.

Sleek-Jet said:

I believe the only roof installations "in the wild" are on Solar City executive houses, the product isn't ready for prime-time.

Curious what the cost per/sq ft is on the tiles?

Click to expand...

Two to be exact.

Starts at four times the cost of a tile roof. Their guaranty is great though "For Infinity or the life of the house".:rolleyes

SJP said:

I have wondered the same thing. It has to be astronomical. I cannot wait until the tiles are commoditized.

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Do you mean subsidized?

SJP said:

I bought a P85DL for my wife. We have had it for 3 years. It is an awesome car in Southern California. When I need to work in downtown LA I will take it and get carpool access. 100 miles round trip easy no charge needed. Saves time and aggravation. Tesla is expanding their super charging stations with them model 3 releasing it is going to be a mess. The one by my house has a line during the day all the time. OT I get it though it is not for everyone.

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How do the charging stations work? You put a credit card in and they charge your car? I?m just curious how much does it cost to recharge at a charging station? Not being a hater just curious.

To put it in perspective - they employ over 22,000 people. Firing a few hundred is nothing, except an opportunity for the media to get a headline and create a story that seems dramatic

Bigbore500r said:

To put it in perspective - they employ over 22,000 people. Firing a few hundred is nothing, except an opportunity for the media to get a headline and create a story that seems dramatic

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Agreed. They did not even have to file RIF paperwork with the state, since less then 10% of employees were terminated

Old Texan said:

From what I see, they are an expensive novelty at this point and buyers see that.....

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Tex, Tesla sells 2,000 - 3,000 Model S sedans per month. consistently, for the last three years.
That's a formula that Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, BMW, Audi and Lexus are still trying to figure out, because the Model S is consistently outselling all of them.

A novelty that's been cleaning house in a segment that includes the Mercedes-Benz S-Class, BMW 7er, All large Audi sedans, Porsche Panamera and Lexus LS is more than a novelty...these carmakers are all chasing Tesla for segment sales. And these carmakers literally can't bring their competitive EV's to market fast enough.

We can debate the viability of the company based on their burn rate, or if EVs make sense for every market segment, but the fact remains that there's significant demand for the cars Tesla sells, particularly in the prestige large sedan segment.

The numbers are way beyond a novelty at this point.

I would imagine if MB, BMW and the other luxo car makers were writing $7500 checks, plus local and state governments kicking in a few bucks for each car sold and they bought all the gas for the life of the car, they'd move a few more units.

Sleek-Jet said:

I would imagine if MB, BMW and the other luxo car makers were writing $7500 checks, plus local and state governments kicking in a few bucks for each car sold and they bought all the gas for the life of the car, they'd move a few more units.

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It still wouldn't give them the sales lead.

Plus, how much "trunk money" (incentives) are placed on $100k cars in general?
I can give you a hint: It's significantly more than the $7500 tax credit Model S buyers get.

Especially when you can't move inventory, which is the case for all cars in this market...the market is truck/SUV/crossover crazy.
No one wants sedans.

Tesla will soon exceed 200k in sales, which means the $7500 federal tax subsidies go away.
We'll see how much that affects demand.

More than likely, it will affect Model 3 sales a lot more than Model S.

pronstar said:

It still wouldn't give them the sales lead.

Plus, how much "trunk money" (incentives) are placed on $100k cars in general?
I can give you a hint: It's significantly more than the $7500 tax credit Model S buyers get.

Especially when you can't move inventory, which is the case for all cars in this market...the market is truck/SUV/crossover crazy.
No one wants sedans.

Tesla will soon exceed 200k in sales, which means the $7500 federal tax subsidies go away.
We'll see how much that affects demand.

More than likely, it will affect Model 3 sales a lot more than Model S.

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I have no idea, but the model S is trendy right now. By all accounts a great car. The handmade model 3 is not a model S, we'll see how much people are willing to put up with since there is already competition in that market segment.

What happened in Hong Kong is telling, don't know if there would be a parallel here or not. Even in the halo segment, the tax credit is yuge.

DRYHEAT said:

How do the charging stations work? You put a credit card in and they charge your car? I?m just curious how much does it cost to recharge at a charging station? Not being a hater just curious.

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Ours has unlimited super charging. Basically baked into the price of the vehicle. We super charge - basically in 30-45 minutes can get the car to 90 percent from low on road trips. Easily one stops to river and Vegas. Wive takes it to Palm Springs- they put them next to Starbucks / food. It works. Well of course people are going to jack the deal and in urban areas with no 220 service or place to plug in at home.... abuse of infrastructure. So after Jan 1 2017 all new cars are given like 3 charge cycles and then you have a card on file that charges market or just below. Comes out to like 8-12 per charge (I think). Does not apply to us but everyone buying a 3 will definitely be on that program. Another thing they are doing is if you are parked at an SC station with a full charge and squatting you are getting fined. People were parking and shopping while people were waiting in line. Again as more mainstream buys it is a matter of time you will cross a person that is incompetent/inconsiderate.

Sleek-Jet said:

...but the model S is trendy right now. .

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It's been trendy for over 3 years, with no sign of slowing...well beyond a trend, methinks.

Sleek-Jet said:

Bottom 15% of all workers get fired after their annual reviews. :skull

At least they didn't call Zack in to dart them from a helicopter.

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That's funny

500bbc said:

We're bidding a job right now with a Tesla tile roof specified.
Met with the owner and the architect and I asked what his experience with the roofing was, zero was his reply.
I told the owner being the test subject for a new product that just came on the market is unwise. The hippy dippy architect replied that you can't find a more solid company than Tesla, I restrained myself from answering.

Went direct to Tesla with phone calls and e-mails, no reply. Check for comments on the product and nothing but complaints. Biggest complaint was deposits paid for the product and no product delivered with no response from Tesla trying to track their orders down. It's a house of cards.

Click to expand...

Did Musk buy Ultra Boats when we weren't looking ? HA HA HA Poor customer service with 22,000 employees on the books ? Millions of dollars lost every day ? OH, there's nothing wrong here !

pronstar said:

Tex, Tesla sells 2,000 - 3,000 Model S sedans per month. consistently, for the last three years.
That's a formula that Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, BMW, Audi and Lexus are still trying to figure out, because the Model S is consistently outselling all of them.

A novelty that's been cleaning house in a segment that includes the Mercedes-Benz S-Class, BMW 7er, All large Audi sedans, Porsche Panamera and Lexus LS is more than a novelty...these carmakers are all chasing Tesla for segment sales. And these carmakers literally can't bring their competitive EV's to market fast enough.

We can debate the viability of the company based on their burn rate, or if EVs make sense for every market segment, but the fact remains that there's significant demand for the cars Tesla sells, particularly in the prestige large sedan segment.

The numbers are way beyond a novelty at this point.

Click to expand...

The GLARING point you don't mention is that ALL those other car makers, are staying in business by MAKING PROFITS, on their competing EV's , and their business practices.

The fact that Tesla has gotten nothing but "bucket loads of taxpayer cash, and every local municipality's land, labor and tax deals", then you TRY to compare "what you call, like products", so I must point out that the companies you compare to, are in VIABLE LONG TERM BUSINESSES .

I have no doubt that most or all of the "other EV makers", are also getting "some government assistance", but they are diversified in their products, and are not having "back order lists", dragging on for months or years .

Even Tesla admits that they are "bleeding cash", cash they got from taxpayers, not from sales or "pre-sales deposits", so how can you compare the products of "viable car makers", to those of "a one foot always in the grave, car maker" ?

IMO, all the Tesla models (and other all electric vehicles) are still and will for the near future years, be NOVELTIES . The "slow and late production rates of the vehicles", is only surpassed by the even slower progress of "supporting charging stations", across this country .

Sure, you can park it and charge it in your garage OVERNIGHT, but I don't think there are 1000 supercharging stations across the USA, today . But I know that there are more than 1000 GAS STATIONS, in Arizona alone .

"Can you say CONVENIENCE "? "I knew you could" .

Some "city dwellers" may buy these for their own uses, and that would make them a "nitch novelty vehicle", but you can bet that IF those "city dwellers" have a country home, or a favorite vacation spot out of town, they will not drive the Tesla, they will drive "their real car", to out of town places, for security and convenience .

I applaud Musk's efforts, he is trying to cram 35+ years of technical and social progress into a 10 year program , that now seems to be "poorly thought out".

What I do and have always detested are the politicians and others who gave BILLIONS to this "private enterprise", with no oversight . They were/are "picking a choosing" which companies win or loose, and they still BET OUR MONEY on a LOOSER, TESLA .

pronstar said:

It's been trendy for over 3 years, with no sign of slowing...well beyond a trend, methinks.

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I think selling a $100+k car like the X and S are one thing. Those people are buying it because the car can drive itself, and it is the "it" car to own at the moment.

I think the 3 is going to be a disappointment with regard to quality and/or range, or it will be too expensive relative to the competition. It is Tesla's classic debut messaging -

1. Say that the car is going super bad ass, cheap and available in 2 years.
2. Delay, delay, delay the realease of the car.
3. Say sorry it is going to cost 1/3 more than we thought.
4. Release the car.

Every time they say they do this they are violating the Proverb we all know to be universally true.

Cheap, Fast, Reliable. Pick 2.

LargeOrangeFont said:

I think selling a $100+k car like the X and S are one thing. Those people are buying it because the car can drive itself, and it is the "it" car to own at the moment.

I think the 3 is going to be a disappointment with regard to quality and/or range, or it will be too expensive relative to the competition. It is Tesla's classic debut messaging -

1. Say that the car is going super bad ass, cheap and available in 2 years.
2. Delay, delay, delay the realease of the car.
3. Say sorry it is going to cost 1/3 more than we thought.
4. Release the car.

Every time they say they do this they are violating the Proverb we all know to be universally true.

Cheap, Fast, Reliable. Pick 2.

Click to expand...

Yeah the Model 3 is the litmus test...the jury is still out on that one.
Notice my posts were specific to the Model S.

AzGeo said:

The GLARING point you don't mention is that ALL those other car makers, are staying in business by MAKING PROFITS, on their competing EV's , and their business practices.

Click to expand...

I was mostly talking about sales, but wanted to give a nod (from my post, below) to exactly what you posted, because it really can't be ignored until/unless they start to generate more cash than they burn...

pronstar said:

We can debate the viability of the company based on their burn rate, or if EVs make sense for every market segment, but the fact remains that there's significant demand for the cars Tesla sells, particularly in the prestige large sedan segment.

Click to expand...

SJP said:

Ours has unlimited super charging. Basically baked into the price of the vehicle. We super charge - basically in 30-45 minutes can get the car to 90 percent from low on road trips. Easily one stops to river and Vegas. Wive takes it to Palm Springs- they put them next to Starbucks / food. It works. Well of course people are going to jack the deal and in urban areas with no 220 service or place to plug in at home.... abuse of infrastructure. So after Jan 1 2017 all new cars are given like 3 charge cycles and then you have a card on file that charges market or just below. Comes out to like 8-12 per charge (I think). Does not apply to us but everyone buying a 3 will definitely be on that program. Another thing they are doing is if you are parked at an SC station with a full charge and squatting you are getting fined. People were parking and shopping while people were waiting in line. Again as more mainstream buys it is a matter of time you will cross a person that is incompetent/inconsiderate.

Click to expand...

Thank you. I see the charging stations in a lot of places I go I always wondered how it worked.

Sleek-Jet said:

Bottom 15% of all workers get fired after their annual reviews. :skull

At least they didn't call Zack in to dart them from a helicopter.

Click to expand...

Spacex has laid off 400 people at one time after an annual review. We called it black Monday. We are due for one soon

Despite many detracting facts, I'm rooting for Tesla to break trends, make a profit and repay Americans for what they have involuntarily donated. I would really hate to see all of the research go to China after a Major bankruptcy. Lets just hope the DEA doesn't get involved and try to pull the "Delorean" on them if things get really tough.

pronstar said:

Tex, Tesla sells 2,000 - 3,000 Model S sedans per month. consistently, for the last three years.
That's a formula that Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, BMW, Audi and Lexus are still trying to figure out, because the Model S is consistently outselling all of them.

A novelty that's been cleaning house in a segment that includes the Mercedes-Benz S-Class, BMW 7er, All large Audi sedans, Porsche Panamera and Lexus LS is more than a novelty...these carmakers are all chasing Tesla for segment sales. And these carmakers literally can't bring their competitive EV's to market fast enough.

We can debate the viability of the company based on their burn rate, or if EVs make sense for every market segment, but the fact remains that there's significant demand for the cars Tesla sells, particularly in the prestige large sedan segment.

The numbers are way beyond a novelty at this point.

Click to expand...

I don't disagree.....I just pointed out the experience of 2 owners that opted out after their cars fried from water on the roads other vehicles were routinely driving through. Both loved driving the cars but tired of other issues. And from how both went down, areas like the Gulf Coast with frequent heavy rains, aren't Tesla friendly.

[video=youtube;MQLbakWESkw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQLbakWESkw&feature=share[/video]

What Adam fails to realize is that most folks could not give a shit about being green.

pronstar said:

What Adam fails to realize is that most folks could not give a shit about being green.

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TRENDY always TRUMPS green !

However, stupid is still by far the LEADER ................

AzGeo said:

TRENDY always TRUMPS green !

However, stupid is still by far the LEADER ................

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If the .gov is stupid enough to pay me to drive a car, I'd be stupid not to take them up on the offer

pronstar said:

If the .gov is stupid enough to pay me to drive a car, I'd be stupid not to take them up on the offer

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\
It's not the "govt's" money.:grumble:

pronstar said:

If the .gov is stupid enough to pay me to drive a car, I'd be stupid not to take them up on the offer

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"taxpayer"

Ill PM a response, might be too vulgar for public consumption.

Ouderkirk said:

Certainly one wonders if the "reduction in force" is a reflection of the $13mil per day and trying to break even. Not sure what the pay scales are there, but 400-700 workers with an average pay of $75K is only $52mil out of a $4 billion annual operating loss. It would seem that Tesla is finding out you actually have to produce a product the public wants to buy, at a price they are willing to pay is what the free market is about. Being subsidized by the taxpayer to build things the public doesn't want is not a solid business strategy.

Click to expand...

That's a pretty fair assessment.