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Red light camera tickets- What’s the scoop

DWC

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My son California stopped a red light camera in West Covina. Turns out it’s a $500 mistake...
What’s the scoop? Any way to beat it or just suck it up and pay?
 

hallett21

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Used to be able to claim you never got the ticket. Now I believe the postman is the signer saying that you got the ticket.

You’re left with written declaration or fighting it in court. Both will have video evidence so I think you’re dead in the water


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redone76

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I'd say he learned a $500 lesson. Curious where in the city he got it? I live in West Covina and don't see those often.
 

DWC

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I'd say he learned a $500 lesson. Curious where in the city he got it? I live in West Covina and don't see those often.

Off of grand and Badillo?
 

RP1

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My son California stopped a red light camera in West Covina. Turns out it’s a $500 mistake...
What’s the scoop? Any way to beat it or just suck it up and pay?

Not that I advocate running red lights or getting away with the violation, but here are some options...

Have him go to the Police station and asks the traffic officer in charge of red light tickets to let him see the picture the camera took. If the pictures is not clear enough to positively say it's him, they will dismiss the ticket. Also, you can inquire when the last time the cameras were calibrated for accuracy.
 

530RL

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Not that I advocate breaking any laws either, but......

In Arizona you register your car solely in your wife's name and her car solely in your name. If a photo ticket comes, you send a letter with a copy of your drivers license explaining it is clearly not you. They can not force you to testify and/or identify your spouse.

California also has a spousal privilege law so I suspect it works in Ca also but I don't know for sure.

Not much help for your son, but something to consider for the rest of us...... :)
 

Hallett_Whacker

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I've gotten 2 over the years. One on Garfield and Imperial, and one on Chapman and Valley View. With the first came several pictures where it was clear as daylight that I was driving the truck, and I was guilty of running the light. The second, a few years later, directed me to a link where I could view a video of me running the light. That one I probably could have successfully fought--it was very close, and it was a very short yellow for the posted speed limit. Anyway, I chose not to fight it--I just paid it.

They were both quite expensive.
 
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DWC

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No wonder...that's Covina and one of the last red light camera's in the area. They make a ton of money off that damned thing

$500 a pop isn’t a bad deal. I’d like to invest in a few of them.
 

pronstar

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Jeez the one on my neighborhood is $75 and it caught my FIL twice LOL


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DWC

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Not that I advocate breaking any laws either, but......

In Arizona you register your car solely in your wife's name and her car solely in your name. If a photo ticket comes, you send a letter with a copy of your drivers license explaining it is clearly not you. They can not force you to testify and/or identify your spouse.

California also has a spousal privilege law so I suspect it works in Ca also but I don't know for sure.

Not much help for your son, but something to consider for the rest of us...... :)

The car is in my name. It’s a clear picture of him. Thanks for the tip. I was hoping for more of a “just toss it”.:)
 

530RL

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The car is in my name. It’s a clear picture of him. Thanks for the tip. I was hoping for more of a “just toss it”.:)


Send a letter to them with a picture of your drivers license stating that the photo is not you. Nothing more, nothing less than that. Maybe you get lucky and they toss the ticket?
 

caribbean20

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My son California stopped a red light camera in West Covina. Turns out it’s a $500 mistake...
What’s the scoop? Any way to beat it or just suck it up and pay?
My understanding is that merely mailing the citation to you does NOT constitute proper service. You must be properly served to be found guilty. What proof does the issuing agency have that you received notice of the alleged violation?

I’m not an attorney and would be interested to hear a more definitive interpretation of the law in CA (I did the research for Boulder, CO). I hate these chicken shit money grabs and have fought them tooth and nail over the years. I’m 5 - 0 vs John Law. Make them prove it. Who’s to say the light and sensors were properly calibrated, etc. etc.

Unless someone with expertise chimes in to the contrary, I’d file it in the “Pending” file until/If you ever get proper service. A machine cannot serve a proper citation, must be issued/served by a human.

That’s my two cents worth, probably about what it’s worth, but I’ve put my money where my mouth is over the years and spent the time fighting these.
 
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DWC

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My understanding is that merely mailing the citation to you does NOT constitute proper service. You must be properly served to be found guilty. What proof does the issuing agency have that you received notice of the alleged violation?

I’m not an attorney and would be interested to hear a more definitive interpretation of the law in CA (I did the research for Boulder, CO). I hate these chicken shit money grabs and have fought them tooth and nail over the years. I’m 5 - 0 vs John Law. Make them prove it. Who’s to say the light and sensors were properly calibrated, etc. etc.

Unless someone with expertise chimes in to the contrary, I’d file it in the “Pending” file until/If you ever get proper service. A machine cannot serve a proper citation, must be issued/served by a human.

That’s my two cents worth, probably about what it’s worth, but I’ve put my money where my mouth is over the years and spent the time fighting these.

I went with 530RL’s advice. We’ll see how it works out. Didn’t want to toss and hope because it’ll just continue to climb in cost.
 

LargeOrangeFont

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My son California stopped a red light camera in West Covina. Turns out it’s a $500 mistake...
What’s the scoop? Any way to beat it or just suck it up and pay?

Fight by mail, if that does not work and you are found guilty ask for an in person retrial, you can either take traffic school or try to fight it again in person.

Sometimes at red light cameras they shorten the duration of the yellow light, you might have an angle there. It is situation dependent, but be prepared to lose if they didn’t shorten the yellow light.
 
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Heylam

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I say if he’s truly guilty, make him take responsibility and pay the fine. I know it’s a petty infraction, but it might make him think twice before committing any future infractions, some of which might have more serious consequences.



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185EZ

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Only reason I live in Cali is cause we get to roll stop signs :D
I got pulled over in Desert Hills
Sheriff said i did the California roll
He let me go with a warning and he told me I could just burn it lol
 
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LargeOrangeFont

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The car is in my name. It’s a clear picture of him. Thanks for the tip. I was hoping for more of a “just toss it”.:)


Yep this is the best angle, I forgot to ask whose car it was... be prepared, they are going to hassle you :)
 
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El Chingon

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No wonder...that's Covina and one of the last red light camera's in the area. They make a ton of money off that damned thing

I too dont condone running a red light.The wife and I have both got a ticket at that intersection in the last 4-5 years. We were told by a cop to not click on the link when the ticket was received. We Just disregarded the letter and did not click on the link on the ticket. Once you click on link you are admitting guilt. I have had no problems registering my vehicles or renewing our drivers licenses since.
 

DWC

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I too dont condone running a red light.The wife and I have both got a ticket at that intersection in the last 4-5 years. We were told by a cop to not click on the link when the ticket was received. We Just disregarded the letter and did not click on the link on the ticket. Once you click on link you are admitting guilt. I have had no problems registering my vehicles or renewing our drivers licenses since.

Thanks, i think he clicked on it already. We’ll go with the it wasn’t me strategy and crossing our fingers.
I don’t condone him breaking any laws. If it was an officer that pulled him over he’d pay and be done. Speeding, texting or racing (in his Volt) would be a complete different discussion. Some company from Arizona that plops a camera down and splits the cash with the city can bite me. I could retire If i could put one on the 40 checking towing speeds.:)
He’s a good kid. Almost 4 gpa in high school, same pace in 1st year in college, ASB president, been recognized by Google / Facebook for his community efforts. If pulling a California stop is the worst thing I’m good. In the end, it’s his $500. He’ll have to work a ton more of min wage hours to pay it off.
 

Dalton

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Not that I advocate breaking any laws either, but......

In Arizona you register your car solely in your wife's name and her car solely in your name. If a photo ticket comes, you send a letter with a copy of your drivers license explaining it is clearly not you. They can not force you to testify and/or identify your spouse.

California also has a spousal privilege law so I suspect it works in Ca also but I don't know for sure.

Not much help for your son, but something to consider for the rest of us...... :)

I thought the ones in PHX ended up being a private company you were paying, and if you didn't pay nothing happened
 

530RL

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Just tossing it has higher risks.

By sending a letter stating you are not the driver with evidence that you are not, you are basically asking for a "trial by declaration" as once you have sent the letter you have admitted you were served with the citation. In Arizona, most times, you will hear nothing else.

Worst case, they send you a letter stating you are still responsible and so you show up at the scheduled court date. Your face doesn't look like the picture so clearly you are not guilty.

The judge will most likely ask you if you know who it is and you have the right to respectfully decline. Although they will push a little hard for you to identify, you do not have to. He did his job, you did yours.

Saves 500 bucks and some insurance increases.

Oh, and include a stern lecture/beating/yard work/loss of allowance/or anything else necessary for junior to understand it takes but about 1 second to come to a complete stop. :)
 
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530RL

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I thought the ones in PHX ended up being a private company you were paying, and if you didn't pay nothing happened


In the interest of due process, law enforcement officials typically review the evidence from the cameras to make sure that a violation has occurred before a citation is sent out.

You can ignore them and take the chance but the rules on whether or not it has been properly served and they can end up with a default judgement are somewhat technical and if ignoring them, you have to understand the rules carefully.
 

DWC

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I thought the ones in PHX ended up being a private company you were paying, and if you didn't pay nothing happened

Sounds like that may have been the case at one point. It’s what he told me. All good except it came to me. Goes from $500 to $800 quick. I have other stuff to do with $800
 
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Melloyellovector

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530s advice good for Cali.
Send pic of your license stating you are not driver. And your not sure who was driving that day. And can’t tell by picture who that is.

Not your responsibility to prove who’s driving just to prove your weren’t.

My dumb ass kid did same thing in one of my trucks. Got out of it.
Then he did again in his friends truck that he was buying. The friend got out of it, but he also gave them info who was driving, lol
 
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caribbean20

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QUOTE="DWC, post: 3247166, member: 13159"]Sounds like that may have been the case at one point. It’s what he told me. All good except it came to me. Goes from $500 to $800 quick. I have other stuff to do with $800[/QUOTE]

Another thing to consider before you roll over on this thing, and not suggesting that you were planning to, is the impact a moving violation will have on junior’s car insurance. Which, if you are in the same boat as many of us, YOU are paying, because junior doesn’t have a pot to piss in at his tender age.

Maybe in CA you can get it expunged with that online traffic school crap, don’t know. Just suggesting that you think it all the way through before throwing in the towel.

BTW, I’m no stranger to this pain.:)
 
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DWC

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QUOTE="DWC, post: 3247166, member: 13159"]Sounds like that may have been the case at one point. It’s what he told me. All good except it came to me. Goes from $500 to $800 quick. I have other stuff to do with $800

Another thing to consider before you roll over on this thing, and not suggesting that you were planning to, is the impact a moving violation will have on junior’s car insurance. Which, if you are in the same boat as many of us, YOU are paying, because junior doesn’t have a pot to piss in at his tender age.

Maybe in CA you can get it expunged with that online traffic school crap, don’t know. Just suggesting that you think it all the way through before throwing in the towel.

BTW, I’m no stranger to this pain.:)[/QUOTE]

That’s definitely part of it. Insurance is expensive as hell. At some point we agreed to pay until they were “finished” with school. 3 kids, he’s the youngest, and i think this is the first ticket. I’m not excited to see what this would do.
 
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RP1

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To be clear... did this occur in Covina or West Covina?
 

mjc

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make sure you look at the pictures if saying it is not you doesn't fix it. I got one in Loma Linda and in the picture I hadn't even crossed the crosswalk line yet, so by mail got out of it.
 
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C-2

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I think that camera is Covina, the West Covina camera is Barranca/Rowland. I work right there and hate those cameras. The Barranca camera catches you for no turn on red. Two of my co-workers thought they got nailed but nothing ever arrived in the mail.

I know in Cali they don't "serve" citations. I never understood why AZ would take on the nearly impossible and costly task of doing so.

Traffic school it out if the trial by dec fails.
 

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Appear in court and plead guilty and they'll LOWER the fine 150.00. Her 500.00 was lowered to 350.00. My wife was told that from a co-worker and it worked. I gotta say though, there's a lotta a-holes running red lights where I live. City removed the cameras about 5 years ago and everything has gotten crazy since. I taught all my boys to look both ways before proceeding from red to green. I actually would like them to be re-installed,,,,that's how bad it's gotten in the High Desert
 
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Ballyhoo

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The car is in my name. It’s a clear picture of him. Thanks for the tip. I was hoping for more of a “just toss it”.:)
You should be able to beat that no problem. The ticket was likely mailed to you as the registered owner. You have ZERO responsibility to identify who was driving at the time of the violation. They can't force you to do that. Some cities will run drivers license photo checks for your address in attempt to identify the driver but I think that is rare.

If all else fails, take to the city prosecutor who is handling the case and try to negotiate to get the violation amended to 38300 CVC (It is unlawful for the driver of any vehicle to disobey any sign, signal, or traffic control device placed or maintained pursuant to Section 38280. The fine will be less and it doesn't have any points attached to it. My son just successfully handled a red light camera ticket in Orange County this way.
 
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DWC

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You should be able to beat that no problem. The ticket was likely mailed to you as the registered owner. You have ZERO responsibility to identify who was driving at the time of the violation. They can't force you to do that. Some cities will run drivers license photo checks for your address in attempt to identify the driver but I think that is rare.

If all else fails, take to the city prosecutor who is handling the case and try to negotiate to get the violation amended to 38300 CVC (It is unlawful for the driver of any vehicle to disobey any sign, signal, or traffic control device placed or maintained pursuant to Section 38280. The fine will be less and it doesn't have any points attached to it. My son just successfully handled a red light camera ticket in Orange County this way.

Thank you
 

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I stop at all of them, tow at 55, always have a front license plate and use my blinker even when alone. :)
Didn't know California cars had working blinkers - never seen one working.
 
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HALLETT BOY

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I hate those things , nothing short of extortion ! The Santa Monica Mountain conservancy agency put up a bunch of those cameras at secondary / gravel roads ,and parking lots , turns out it was not legal . Did they stop or return peoples money? No !
 
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yz450mm

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Appear in court and plead guilty and they'll LOWER the fine 150.00. Her 500.00 was lowered to 350.00. My wife was told that from a co-worker and it worked. I gotta say though, there's a lotta a-holes running red lights where I live. City removed the cameras about 5 years ago and everything has gotten crazy since. I taught all my boys to look both ways before proceeding from red to green. I actually would like them to be re-installed,,,,that's how bad it's gotten in the High Desert
Seriously, why is it so bad up here in the desert? I look both ways three or four Four times before daring to go on a green light. Bear Valley is the worst, but it's happening more and more everywhere.

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Seriously, why is it so bad up here in the desert? I look both ways three or four Four times before daring to go on a green light. Bear Valley is the worst, but it's happening more and more everywhere.

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Because there aren't any traffic enforcement officers. When was the last time you saw a patrol car or cycle off the side of the road with a radar gun. They just don't exist unless your on the frwy in the desert,,,,at least in the High Desert there aren't
 

Wombat

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Not that I advocate breaking any laws either, but......

In Arizona you register your car solely in your wife's name and her car solely in your name. If a photo ticket comes, you send a letter with a copy of your drivers license explaining it is clearly not you. They can not force you to testify and/or identify your spouse.

California also has a spousal privilege law so I suspect it works in Ca also but I don't know for sure.

Not much help for your son, but something to consider for the rest of us...... :)
We in Australia have had red light/ speed camera combos for many years. The speed camera side is activated when the orange is on to stop drivers speeding up to beat the red (where most accidents occur). The cameras take a couple of photos which lets them know who was driving and number plate ID. If you say "it wasn't me" you will still cop the fine AND loss of points (which is the biggest worry because you only 12 points per year) if you do not identify who was driving so that they can cop the loss of points and fine.
 

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I have been lucky enough to receive 2 of those tickets. Paid the 1st one $500 2nd one I just ignored it. No follow up from the ticket company...
You know it's all BS, you don't even get a ding from the DMV for the ticket.
 

JDKRXW

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We in Australia have had red light/ speed camera combos for many years.

I always thought you guys invented them.
Couldn't your countrymen find something better to do with their time? ‍:)
 

Wombat

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Because there aren't any traffic enforcement officers. When was the last time you saw a patrol car or cycle off the side of the road with a radar gun. They just don't exist unless your on the frwy in the desert,,,,at least in the High Desert there aren't
I don't know if it's the same in the states but all our Highway patrol cars are equipped with licence plate ID (whether the cars have current rego or not) speed cameras and in car video and with cops looking to book anybody at the slightest indiscretion. o_O
 
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