The Refuge

[teded]

Had a rezone happen on the par 3 Palm Desert Cc. Golf course to condos in 5 city council votes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[RiverDave]

The Coast News Group

Your community. Your newspaper. Covers Camp Pendleton, Oceanside, Carlsbad, Encinitas, Solana Beach, Del Mar, Carmel Valley, Rancho Santa Fe, Escondido, San Marcos & Vista.

thecoastnews.com

It’s only a few votes away from an RV campground.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Funny.. My buddy Chris's dad owned Coast News back when we were kids.. I'd bet Chris is running it now.

RD

 

[instagator]

@RiverDave should buy it…. This is your next big move RDP!

River Daves golf course, Caddyshack !

 

[Xtrmwakeboarder]

RDP boat storage until the racks are done

 

[2Driver]

I’d say that since most residents don’t golf, they should weigh how important it is to look at the grass. Because once the residents fork out the cash and are stradled with what probably will be a losing business it’s too late, the cash eating gorilla is on their back. One time HOA entrance fees and dues going from $1200 to $4800++ a year for people who don’t play golf isn’t going to do much for home values either.

Some desert restoration with natural bike/ hike paths starts to sound real nice.

 

[ridebig]

Sad deal. I don’t live in the Refuge but close. Loved to eat at the restaurant even though it was mediocre at best most times. Great atmosphere and killer views. I hope someone can save it.

 

[checkrdpast]

Anyone remember when it was originally developed, I vaguely recall the golf course being an big deal with Arnold Palmer's name attached to it somehow. And then I think after some setbacks at the turn of economy his name was removed or maybe opted out. I have been wanting to get to the restaurant for some bit of time, almost did new years eve last year there. guess, I'm gonna need to wait for the reopening. I sure hope it all plays out for the good of the homeowners there, there have been some big investments made.

As soon as they made changes to the golf course for the RV spots without the Palmer group ok ,They dropped the name.

 

[KevinR]

Its a lease and its a big number.

When we were the largest client of EZ GO, leasing more carts per year than any other company, we paid $50/$60 per cart per month. Sure you add a mechanic for the fleet, charging and maintenance costs, etc, but you rent the cart twice or three times and you’ve covered the costs for that month. Carts are the highest percentage net profit department of a golf course operation.

 

[Englewood]

It would be nice to see the clubhouse replaced with something that would attract more people.

They are redoing the entire clubhouse. Bar/restaurant/event space. We live right by the clubhouse and I can’t wait til it’s done.

 

[Ace in the Hole]

They are redoing the entire clubhouse. Bar/restaurant/event space. We live right by the clubhouse and I can’t wait til it’s done.

Back in the day that was always my grandparents gripe when it was some level of a "membership" club. It was "going to happen" and then just never did through the ownership changes.

Glad to hear it's happening. It's got a great view, and I look forward to when its done.

 

[riverroyal]

In about 6 months sellling Claritin and Allegra door to door wil be a soild side hustle

 

[Turnup]

Did anyone hear what the outcome was?

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

Did anyone hear what the outcome was?

Of what?

 

[Turnup]

That HOA zoom was supposed to have taken place today, wondering what that was all about.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

That HOA zoom was supposed to have taken place today, wondering what that was all about.

Nothing to do with the sale, normal HOA stuff, like who left their trash cans out to long, and who had music too loud at night (me and me). I gave up after 15 minutes when they couldn’t figure out how to run a zoom meeting. The golf course meetings are separate now.

 

[rivermobster]

truth... I never golfed.

RD

Maybe it could be the next location for the next Waste Management Open?

 

[DWC]

Nothing to do with the sale, normal HOA stuff, like who left their trash cans out to long, and who had music too loud at night (me and me). I gave up after 15 minutes when they couldn’t figure out how to run a zoom meeting. The golf course meetings are separate now.

There’s a HOA zoom for who has their music too loud each week?

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

There’s a HOA zoom for who has their music too loud each week?

Monthly, my name comes up often

 

[RiverDave]

Monthly, my name comes up often

I could never live in an HOA.. lol

 

[TCHB]

I could never live in an HOA.. lol

I like not having all the junk in people’s yards and the neighborhood stays nice.

 

[bonesfab]

Sounds like Walt needs a blown alcohol margarita mixer in the back yard.

 

[dspracing]

I like not having all the junk in people’s yards and the neighborhood stays nice.

That's why we bought in.

 

[WildWilly]

I could never live in an HOA.. lol

I had a townhouse in South OC with an HOA. I would get letters for my garage being open too long, working on stuff in my garage etc but the one that blew me away was the fine I got for having ball marks on my garage door and told to repaint the door. I went to the meeting to let them know I don't have kids, don't like kids, and it wasn't anyone associated with me playing ball on my door so I'd suggest they do their jobs and find out what kids played ball on my door. That drug out for 6 months. end of HOA's for me

 

[rivermobster]

I had a townhouse in South OC with an HOA. I would get letters for my garage being open too long, working on stuff in my garage etc but the one that blew me away was the fine I got for having ball marks on my garage door and told to repaint the door. I went to the meeting to let them know I don't have kids, don't like kids, and it wasn't anyone associated with me playing ball on my door so I'd suggest they do their jobs and find out what kids played ball on my door. That drug out for 6 months. end of HOA's for me

Ball marks...

Gotta be a good joke in here somewhere hanging around?

 

[Bear Down]

Ball marks...

Gotta be a good joke in here somewhere hanging around?

Gives a new perspective of "Balls to the wall " ..

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

 

[WildWilly]

yea ok I left that door open, fair enough lol

 

[DWC]

Monthly, my name comes up often

Must mean you’re doing something good. I only get Saturday morning calls and letters to “everyone” in the neighborhood.

 

[TCHB]

When I go up to the Foothills It feels good. All nice homes, no junk rvs,cars, boats, trailers parked on the front yards. All underground utilities. That is one thing I did not like is all the unkept homes on most streets.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

When I go up to the Foothills It feels good. All nice homes, no junk rvs,cars, boats, trailers parked on the front yards. All underground utilities. That is one thing I did not like is all the unkept homes on most streets.

Foothills HOA was pretty relaxed compared to the Refuge. Hell I remember the night Noah and William were playing with Noahs new toon stereo and had the song "Suck My Dick" thumping till 1 am or so. I embraced that behavior. Refuge takes it up a notch but I am OK with it, no issues with your neighbor having one of those Havasu flavor homes that you have to stare at. The neighbors are not really the issue, hell we only have 4 anywhere near us and they are nice folks, all of the other homes are empty snowbird homes, rather its the security patrol, they are the ones that report everything back to the HOA. Two of the gals are very cool and I got them some gift certificates for Christmas, but there is one guy who works on weekends that is a complete tool bag, you know the guy that flunked out of the police academy security guard type, still bitter. He didnt get a gift certificate.

 

[Turnup]

There are 2 more zoom meetings set, tomorrow 2pm and Saturday 9am. If I hear anything I'll update

 

[nowski]

When we were the largest client of EZ GO, leasing more carts per year than any other company, we paid $50/$60 per cart per month. Sure you add a mechanic for the fleet, charging and maintenance costs, etc, but you rent the cart twice or three times and you’ve covered the costs for that month. Carts are the highest percentage net profit department of a golf course operation.

My buddy Stu explained the whole golf business to me one morning over breakfast, as you know it's a little more complicated than people think...

 

[28Eliminator]

When I go up to the Foothills It feels good. All nice homes, no junk rvs,cars, boats, trailers parked on the front yards. All underground utilities. That is one thing I did not like is all the unkept homes on most streets.

you should join an HOA board

 

[Racey]

How does that work. Don’t the home owners pay the HOA to Maintain the community Including the golf course and restaurant? Does that mean the CC&R’s are just torn up?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So in Henderson NV there was a golf course called Black Mountain that had been around for decades and had entire neighborhoods built around it, it went bankrupt and the homeowners on the course could not or did not try to buy it and essentially just figured it would work itself out.... Well a buddy bought it out of bankruptcy and was able to rezone it and sold it to Lennar (cliff note version) now all these people who had "golf course homes" have backyards that will face into block walls or streets of an 1,100 home development....

This can be the flip side of not having an HOA that owns the course....

Not that this really applies to the refuge since that is all in an HOA I'm sure. Now if the HOA can't figure out what to do, or if they can volunteer assess the home owners to keep it running or keep it as bare land, things can get interesting.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

So in Henderson NV there was a golf course called Black Mountain that had been around for decades and had entire neighborhoods built around it, it went bankrupt and the homeowners on the course could not or did not try to buy it and essentially just figured it would work itself out.... Well a buddy bought it out of bankruptcy and was able to rezone it and sold it to Lennar (cliff note version) now all these people who had "golf course homes" have backyards that will face into block walls or streets of an 1,100 home development....

This can be the flip side of not having an HOA that owns the course....

Not that this really applies to the refuge since that is all in an HOA I'm sure.

HOA does not own the course, that’s what they are trying to do

 

[Racey]

HOA does not own the course, that’s what they are trying to do

Ahhh, gotcha. Gonna be a lot of work to try and make that deal work for the home owners that are gonna fork out to absorb it. What a cluster...

 

[stephenkatsea]

Can’t even imagine what Palmer would have thought of this situation. Not only was his name used on the original project, so was his image. I believe he was truly involved with original course design. Not sure where it went from there. In its current configuration, it’s not what it once was. Hope, for all, this can somehow be remedied. It’s more than just a golf course. But, without it, it’s not much.

 

[KevinR]

Can’t even imagine what Palmer would have thought of this situation. Not only was his name used on the original project, so was his image. I believe he was truly involved with original course design. Not sure where it went from there. In its current configuration, it’s not what it once was. Hope, for all, this can somehow be remedied. It’s more than just a golf course. But, without it, it’s not much.

Lots and lots of golf courses around the country built in the 80s through early 2000s have had this situation occur.
Palmer and other course architect companies are used to it. Especially in the southwest where your golf operation operates in the red during the summer months. You have to maintain good cash reserves. Golf play drops a ton but the grass grows faster and requires more water every day. While there is a lot of variable labor to be cut back during the summer in other departments, the golf course maintenance costs still run hard. Especially if you pay for your water cuz you don’t have your own wells.

 

[KevinR]

My buddy Stu explained the whole golf business to me one morning over breakfast, as you know it's a little more complicated than people think...

Haha. A lot more complicated for sure. Most golfers think they know how to operate a golf property because they know how to play and they are good businessmen in other industries.

 

[Turnup]

The jist of today's meeting was how much things could be, what the restaurant and golf course could be, how it could be run, and how the owners could be impacted..if they bought the course and clubhouse for $2.8M. However that offer was rejected, so there wasn't any other scenarios calculated out.

3275 N Latrobe Dr Lake Havasu City AZ 86404 Property Details & Valuation

3275 N Latrobe Dr Lake Havasu City AZ with 0 bedroom and 0 bath is currently not for sale. Xome's estimated value is . Discover more property details at Xome.com.

www.xome.com

 

[riverroyal]

So the club And course is under 3 million?
Have you contacted marty byrd?

 

[Singleton]

So the club And course is under 3 million?
Have you contacted marty byrd?

They want almost $5M for it. HOA offered 2.8.
IMO, HOA ownership is going to result in annual 5 figure assessments and is not a smart move.

 

[CJ_Donahue]

I know it is likely complicated but what is the deal with the RV spaces?

I know the HOA would prefer not to have RVs but I see it as the solution. When I look on Google Earth I count 50ish spaces that would easily sell at 100K each or more for the spots with the better views. If the HOA purchased the course/property with a pre-approved vote, contingent on the purchase, to allow the occupancy and sale of the spaces (Not rentals). I don't see an issue with there being a separate driveway and being owners only. I bet the sales would refund the entire purchase price and 50ish new member dues would help support the community/course.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

They want almost $5M for it. HOA offered 2.8.
IMO, HOA ownership is going to result in annual 5 figure assessments and is not a smart move.

$3 mil is what they will sell for, only $200k apart, pretty sure neither party is going to walk away for that amount

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

I know it is likely complicated but what is the deal with the RV spaces?

I know the HOA would prefer not to have RVs but I see it as the solution. When I look on Google Earth I count 50ish spaces that would easily sell at 100K each or more for the spots with the better views. If the HOA purchased the course/property with a pre-approved vote, contingent on the purchase, to allow the occupancy and sale of the spaces (Not rentals). I don't see an issue with there being a separate driveway and being owners only. I bet the sales would refund the entire purchase price and 50ish new member dues would help support the community/course.

Two things, course area is only zoned for recreational, no homes or rv park without getting that changed. Case went to AZ Supreme Court last time around and wasn’t changed.

Second issue is they hacked up a Arnold Palmer designed course to put in the RV park, Arnold pulled his name from the design and they made a work around on the back 9 which is kind of jacked up and I don’t think the course plays a regulation distance any more.

 

[LHC Kirby]

So is the grass still getting watered right now?

Any maintenance at all? Or a complete abandoned course and building?

I would assume security dude hanging around.

 

[185EZ]

I heard one guy is still working and trying to keep greens and tees alive but pond for watering is drying up
Talk of getting a watering truck to hand water.
Security is a joke. They don't even drive around.
What's the point of taking down worker's plates when going in and not checking to see if they came out lol
Pull up in a nice car or trailering your boat and they just open the gates for you
I was offered the job years ago. No way would i want to be a part of that cluster f

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

I heard one guy is still working and trying to keep greens and tees alive but pond for watering is drying up
Talk of getting a watering truck to hand water.
Security is a joke. They don't even drive around.
What's the point of taking down worker's plates when going in and not checking to see if they came out lol
Pull up in a nice car or trailering your boat and they just open the gates for you
I was offered the job years ago. No way would i want to be a part of that cluster f

I walk the back 9 or front 9 every day, no watering is going on. Tee boxes have weeds sprouting up in them now. Greens are going to shit in a hurry.

Top pick green, bottom fairway

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

I heard one guy is still working and trying to keep greens and tees alive but pond for watering is drying up
Talk of getting a watering truck to hand water.
Security is a joke. They don't even drive around.
What's the point of taking down worker's plates when going in and not checking to see if they came out lol
Pull up in a nice car or trailering your boat and they just open the gates for you
I was offered the job years ago. No way would i want to be a part of that cluster f

Security does drive around, they take photos of your trash cans if they are out too long

 

[Ace in the Hole]

So is the grass still getting watered right now?

Any maintenance at all? Or a complete abandoned course and building?

I would assume security dude hanging around.

Pretty sure that it was posted that the bank is covering maintenance to try and stem their loss... @ONE-A-DAY Walt would know more than most..

 

[hallett21]

So if the Bank is running the maintenance how can the owners negotiate a sale price? Seems like the bank only has 1 offer?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk