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DC Police Boat Hits, Sinks Docked Craft!

aka619er

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Citizens arrest. That was clearing a hit and run.

Reminds me of LE turning on lights and sirens just to get through an intersection or make an illegal u-turn and then turning them off.
 

McRib

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Im sure the cops will be issuing a citation for something stupid after the fact.
 

BoatCop

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That's just nuts.

I heard the guy was responding to a call of people in the water, but that's no excuse for doing a power slide into a moored boat.

It'll be interesting to hear the cop's reasoning behind that move. I predict he'll be doing foot patrol in the projects from here on out.
 

Cajun

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News report mentions that the city doesn't know if it will replace the boat which is pretty much a complete loss. The "officer" took a few seconds to come to better judgement and get off the throttles instead of continuing on.
 
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McRib

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News report mentions that the city doesn't know if it will replace the boat which is pretty much a complete loss. The "officer" took a few seconds to come to better judgement and get off the throttles instead of continuing on.

Doesn't know if they are going to replace the boat?? I guess the videos clear hard evidence is questionable. :rolleyes
 

nowski

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I think what is needed is an unbiased "Sobriety Check Point " on these waters. This is where civilian's like you and me check to see if these guys ( cops ) are sober enough to operate a boat to do there job! Don't think for a moment that these guys always show up to work sober, there just like you and me. Where I live I'm surrounded by cops and there parties always outlast the parties in my neighborhood. While were at it lets do a safety check inspection on that police boat...
 
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t&y

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That's just nuts.

I heard the guy was responding to a call of people in the water, but that's no excuse for doing a power slide into a moored boat.

It'll be interesting to hear the cop's reasoning behind that move. I predict he'll be doing foot patrol in the projects from here on out.

I'm suprised he was actually responding to something. When I first saw it I figured they were trying to demonstrate some tactical response or something. LIke Dave said, where the hell was we trying to go prior to pulling that move???
 

U4ia

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The version of this on Jalopnik says that the LEO was leaving a restaurant after lunch..... A witness said that departures like that are the norm for these guys and that lots of locals were expecting something like this to happen. As far as the "responding to a man in water call", well, they would claim that wouldn't they.... CYA and all that.

Remember the Coasties that killed those kids at the Xmas boat parade in San Diego a few years back? Not all that different behavior by the LEOs and it ended in a whitewash and coverup. IIRC, no one went to jail nor were there fines, just some token demotions. I fully expect this to end the same way, it always does: they will close ranks and support and make excuses for their peers. The public interest really does not stand much of a chance......
 
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U4ia

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That wasn't a 40' Sea Ray either as the news guy reported.

I thought the second boat, the one behind the sinker, was the Sea Ray. The report I read said that it was damaged too.
 

ONE-A-DAY

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I love the guy filming comments, classic.
 

Ziggy

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Damn wakeboad boats look tame now in comparison.:p
Complete bonehead move by Mr Serve and Protect. Frankly, the most amazing thing to me is he didn't throttle down right away.
And as Dave said, where was he heading anyway? His quick turn appears more like he avoided going full ramming speed straight into it? :rolleyes:

From my POS T-mobile thingie
 

Wavemaker

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Was the officer driving the police boat "Drunk with authority?" Dangerous operation in near vicinity to moored watercraft. I hope the attorney for owner of the partially sunken craft subpoenas the radio dispatcher's broadcast tape and the written transcripts of the radio dispatches. If the police officer was in show-off mode, the partially sunk boat owner should file a lawsuit against the city, and the operating officer collectively. A case of pure negligence of vessel operation and the safety of others and of other's property.
 

t&y

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Was the officer driving the police boat "Drunk with authority?" Dangerous operation in near vicinity to moored watercraft. I hope the attorney for owner of the partially sunken craft subpoenas the radio dispatcher's broadcast tape and the written transcripts of the radio dispatches. If the police officer was in show-off mode, the partially sunk boat owner should file a lawsuit against the city, and the operating officer collectively. A case of pure negligence of vessel operation and the safety of others and of other's property.

Welll... that is the reality of it. LEO's have protections when conducting emergency operations, responding to emergent calls, etc... but this appears to be the equivelant of running through a red light while not authorized Code 3 (lights and sirens) and causing an accident. The authority granted to LEO's to violate the law under certain circumstances will not apply and we/they can be held civily liable.
 

BoatCop

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Remember the Coasties that killed those kids at the Xmas boat parade in San Diego a few years back? Not all that different behavior by the LEOs and it ended in a whitewash and coverup. IIRC, no one went to jail nor were there fines, just some token demotions. I fully expect this to end the same way, it always does: they will close ranks and support and make excuses for their peers. The public interest really does not stand much of a chance......

The Cox'n (driver) of that boat was demoted, suffered loss of pay (fines) and sent to the Navy brig for 3 months. He'll never be more than a dishwasher, IF he gets to stay in. The crew was also disciplined and received punishment ranging from 30 days confinement to quarters and forfeiture of rank and pay, to a letter of reprimand. - The Officer-In-Charge was also convicted of Dereliction of Duty at a Special Court Martial.

The final NTSB report showed a severe lack of oversight on the San Diego Station. While it's set up with its own command structure, it's subordinate to Coast Guard Sector San Diego, which is focused around the aviation community and flight operations. The command at Sector just pretty much let the Chief of the Station run things, figuring that he knew what he was doing. However, that attitude had led to 3 OinCs being relieved for cause in the previous 9 years.

And just for the record, the Cox'n and all crewmen submitted to drug and alcohol tests immediately after returning to Station, and found negative.
 

AzGeo

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TRY not to profile all LEOs as "looking and acting the same", and wait for some actual facts. I hope no man nor beast was injured. Everyone makes mistakes, and it's still not clear if this was a 'bonehead showoff stunt' or an actual 'accident during an emergency'. We all know this clip will make it to all the 'crash and burn' TV shows so PLEASE, let's get some kind of perspective here. There were NO REEDS involved, and it's not like they "hit and sank a Schiada" ! Let's all chill, and wait for the actual facts.
 

U4ia

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The Cox'n (driver) of that boat was demoted, suffered loss of pay (fines) and sent to the Navy brig for 3 months. He'll never be more than a dishwasher, IF he gets to stay in. The crew was also disciplined and received punishment ranging from 30 days confinement to quarters and forfeiture of rank and pay, to a letter of reprimand. - The Officer-In-Charge was also convicted of Dereliction of Duty at a Special Court Martial.

The final NTSB report showed a severe lack of oversight on the San Diego Station. While it's set up with its own command structure, it's subordinate to Coast Guard Sector San Diego, which is focused around the aviation community and flight operations. The command at Sector just pretty much let the Chief of the Station run things, figuring that he knew what he was doing. However, that attitude had led to 3 OinCs being relieved for cause in the previous 9 years.

And just for the record, the Cox'n and all crewmen submitted to drug and alcohol tests immediately after returning to Station, and found negative.

Thanks for the details of the "Slap on the Wrist" they got. Imagine if you were the one whose cowboy behavior resulted in the death of a child: getting off with only a demotion at work as your punishment and a couple of weeks in lockup. I bet the Letter of Reprimand was the part that really hurt! Sweet deal for them and a real bummer for the grieving parents. Do you think that knowing that the jerks whose negligence killed your child were forced to make a career change as punishment makes you feel like justice was done?
 

Cajun

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Ok, here's a fact...
The operator got stupid jarred when he hit. :D
 

rmarion

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Damn wakeboad boats look tame now in comparison.:p
Complete bonehead move by Mr Serve and Protect. Frankly, the most amazing thing to me is he didn't throttle down right away.
And as Dave said, where was he heading anyway? His quick turn appears more like he avoided going full ramming speed straight into it? :rolleyes:

From my POS T-mobile thingie

I heard that this LEO owns a wakeboard boat.....
 

rivermobster

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Thanks for the details of the "Slap on the Wrist" they got. Imagine if you were the one whose cowboy behavior resulted in the death of a child: getting off with only a demotion at work as your punishment and a couple of weeks in lockup. I bet the Letter of Reprimand was the part that really hurt! Sweet deal for them and a real bummer for the grieving parents. Do you think that knowing that the jerks whose negligence killed your child were forced to make a career change as punishment makes you feel like justice was done?

No shit. :thumbsdown
 

t&y

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Thanks for the details of the "Slap on the Wrist" they got. Imagine if you were the one whose cowboy behavior resulted in the death of a child: getting off with only a demotion at work as your punishment and a couple of weeks in lockup. I bet the Letter of Reprimand was the part that really hurt! Sweet deal for them and a real bummer for the grieving parents. Do you think that knowing that the jerks whose negligence killed your child were forced to make a career change as punishment makes you feel like justice was done?

Justice? I doubt anybody is really going to find "justice" when their kid is killed in an accident like that. My heart goes out to those parents along with the friends and familys.

I think what Boatcop was pointing out is that your statements about a coverup, no jail, and no fines is clearly false. Not the penality's you are obviously seeking, but something nontheless.
 

rivermobster

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Justice? I doubt anybody is really going to find "justice" when their kid is killed in an accident like that. My heart goes out to those parents along with the friends and familys.

I think what Boatcop was pointing out is that your statements about a coverup, no jail, and no fines is clearly false. Not the penality's you are obviously seeking, but something nontheless.

Slap on the wrist. A mere mortal like me would be behind bars right now.

No mater you you wanna slice it, I'd call it a complete cover up as well. :thumbsdown

Can't imagine being in those poor parents shoes. :(
 

aka619er

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I just watched the CNN footage of this and the operator comes back aggressively yelling telling people at the dock that nobody is hurt and they all need to relax. What a douche. Ive seen these attitudes on almost every video of LE screwing up.
 

U4ia

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Justice? I doubt anybody is really going to find "justice" when their kid is killed in an accident like that. My heart goes out to those parents along with the friends and familys.

I think what Boatcop was pointing out is that your statements about a coverup, no jail, and no fines is clearly false. Not the penality's you are obviously seeking, but something nontheless.

I never said coverup, I said "whitewash" and the info that was posted about the "punishment" confirms that. The heaviest sentence was 90 days in the brig! 3 little months for what was essentially reckless homicide of at least one child, do you think the average Joe would get off so lightly? Hell, I think that because of the way they abused their authority and the trust that we put in them they deserve a greater penalty than regular citizens, not less. That is a basic part of the social contract: those whom we allow to use deadly force against us are to be held to a higher standard of behavior. Without that we might as well be Mexico or some other place with a culture of impunity.
 

jman

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I just watched the CNN footage of this and the operator comes back aggressively yelling telling people at the dock that nobody is hurt and they all need to relax. What a douche. Ive seen these attitudes on almost every video of LE screwing up.
Most cornered animals will lash out when they know they are trapped.:rolleyes
 

BoatCop

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I never said coverup, I said "whitewash" and the info that was posted about the "punishment" confirms that. The heaviest sentence was 90 days in the brig! 3 little months for what was essentially reckless homicide of at least one child, do you think the average Joe would get off so lightly? Hell, I think that because of the way they abused their authority and the trust that we put in them they deserve a greater penalty than regular citizens, not less. That is a basic part of the social contract: those whom we allow to use deadly force against us are to be held to a higher standard of behavior. Without that we might as well be Mexico or some other place with a culture of impunity.

The boat driver was charged at Special Court Martial with Negligent Homicide, Involuntary Manslaughter, Hazarding a vessel, Aggravated Assault and numerous other offenses. He was found not guilty of the most serious offenses and ultimately convicted of dereliction of duty and failure to conduct a risk assessment.

He had his day in court, just like anyone else who is accused of a crime. That's all that can be asked.

It's no different from someone who recklessly kills 3 kids with his boat, or runs over and kills a guy on a PWC, then runs away and gets a year of weekends in jail and 5 years probation. (Except they took pleas instead of going to trial)

It may not be "fair". We may not like it. But that's the way the court system works.
 

RiverDave

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I just watched the CNN footage of this and the operator comes back aggressively yelling telling people at the dock that nobody is hurt and they all need to relax. What a douche. Ive seen these attitudes on almost every video of LE screwing up.

The boat driver was charged at Special Court Martial with Negligent Homicide, Involuntary Manslaughter, Hazarding a vessel, Aggravated Assault and numerous other offenses. He was found not guilty of the most serious offenses and ultimately convicted of dereliction of duty and failure to conduct a risk assessment.

He had his day in court, just like anyone else who is accused of a crime. That's all that can be asked.

It's no different from someone who recklessly kills 3 kids with his boat, or runs over and kills a guy on a PWC, then runs away and gets a year of weekends in jail and 5 years probation. (Except they took pleas instead of going to trial)

It may not be "fair". We may not like it. But that's the way the court system works.

I saw what you did there.. Actually pretty strong argument boatcop!

RD
 

Tom Brown

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I saw what you did there.. Actually pretty strong argument boatcop!

RD

I believe Alan was responding to another incident that was cited in an argument against this one.

Whomever is keeping score can mark me down on the side that thinks the person who's vessel was sunk is more likely to get a ticket or be arrested and beaten than the officer driving the assault vehicle to be held to account. If a civilian had done that, he'd be in jail bleeding by now.

Thank God for video or LEOs would never be held to account for much of anything.

My reality is, officers, on average, are no more honest than the average middle class person and that is a pretty unappetizing thought.
 

Magic34

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Boatcop, let's say he didn't hit the boat, clears it by 5', but throws the boat into the dock with his wake. Clearly in the video, the water is not choppy. Would the police be liable for the damages? Does it matter that they were responding to a distress call?
 

RiverDave

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I believe Alan was responding to another incident that was cited in an argument against this one.

Whomever is keeping score can mark me down on the side that thinks the person who's vessel was sunk is more likely to get a ticket or be arrested and beaten than the officer driving the assault vehicle to be held to account. If a civilian had done that, he'd be in jail bleeding by now.

Thank God for video or LEOs would never be held to account for much of anything.

My reality is, officers, on average, are no more honest than the average middle class person and that is a pretty unappetizing thought.

Someone cited this incident, and he cited 2 that were both local.. and well known on the boards.



Boatcop, let's say he didn't hit the boat, clears it by 5', but throws the boat into the dock with his wake. Clearly in the video, the water is not choppy. Would the police be liable for the damages? Does it matter that they were responding to a distress call?

I'm not a lawyer, but I think technically yes.. But good luck getting anyone to side against them. LOL

RD
 

spectras only

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Only way to get even, get a scuba gear and go on a rampage pulling drain plugs on LE boats tied at their dock:D

Ps; their RIBs would still float but still would have a foot or so water iside!
 
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BoatCop

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Boatcop, let's say he didn't hit the boat, clears it by 5', but throws the boat into the dock with his wake. Clearly in the video, the water is not choppy. Would the police be liable for the damages? Does it matter that they were responding to a distress call?

I'm not sure about DC laws, but here, we (law enforcement vessels) can operate in lieu of certain restrictions, such as "no wake" or "boats keep out areas", in performance of official duties as long as we do so without endangering persons or property. There is absolutely no situation where we (or anyone else) can legally operate a vessel in a reckless, negligent manner.

If the DC boat had missed slamming into the side of the boat, but the wake caused damage to it, or any other property, the driver and hence the city, would be responsible.

It's like running lights and siren in a patrol car. When we're doing it, we can go through stop signs, red lights, exceed the speed limit, etc. But if we do so recklessly and/or cause a collision, then we're responsible.

Like I tell all my trainees. Running lights and sirens to get somewhere quickly, isn't a license to kill. Whether it's us or someone else. We can't help someone if we don't make it to the scene. And we just make things worse when resources (other police, fire, rescue, ambulance) has to divert or respond to clean up our messes instead of concentrating on the initial emergency.
 

Fun Times

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Thanks for the details of the "Slap on the Wrist" they got. Imagine if you were the one whose cowboy behavior resulted in the death of a child: getting off with only a demotion at work as your punishment and a couple of weeks in lockup. I bet the Letter of Reprimand was the part that really hurt! Sweet deal for them and a real bummer for the grieving parents. Do you think that knowing that the jerks whose negligence killed your child were forced to make a career change as punishment makes you feel like justice was done?

Justice? I doubt anybody is really going to find "justice" when their kid is killed in an accident like that. My heart goes out to those parents along with the friends and familys.

I think what Boatcop was pointing out is that your statements about a coverup, no jail, and no fines is clearly false. Not the penality's you are obviously seeking, but something nontheless.
Please guys, let's not let this one go sideways. Yes it was nice that Alan was able to give us a little insight of what the overall outcome happen to be on something that has happened in the past that most of us wouldn't really know to much about or follow all the way through unless it happened to someone you knew personally. Then you would know most of the story I'd presume.

As Alan has demonstrated in the past, it seems he enjoys coming on here to share his knowledge of many different things he's seen or done or knows about such as things like what happened here and what the overall outcome was. It was just an overall question of a reminder of what had happened in the past and now that it has past with an outcome reached, It seems he was just setting aside his personal feelings or opinions of the subject at hand and just being nice to us by sharing the outcome of the ordeal that he just happened to have had some knowledge of was all with no real intention of wanting to go into an online debate of if the outcome was right wrong or indifferent of his thoughts versus anyone else's thoughts of the actual outcome.

So unfortunately what's done is done and unfortunately debating it with him here on an online forum is not really going to be able to change the overall outcome in any way, shape, or form, Nor how either Alan or anyone else feels about the whole situation. Unfortunately neither he nor most of us are in the right place to change an outcome such as something like this and i'm sure Alan does not really want to go into an emotional state with debates like this that he has no real power to change the outcomes around.

Alan is a welcomed asset here but in the past, he has demonstrated that sharing his personal feelings of what has already come about he would rather not do it seems, so please, let's respect that. Thanks guys.:)
 

shintoooo

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Please guys, let's not let this one go sideways. Yes it was nice that Alan was able to give us a little insight of what the overall outcome happen to be on something that has happened in the past that most of us wouldn't really know to much about or follow all the way through unless it happened to someone you knew personally. Then you would know most of the story I'd presume.

As Alan has demonstrated in the past, it seems he enjoys coming on here to share his knowledge of many different things he's seen or done or knows about such as things like what happened here and what the overall outcome was. It was just an overall question of a reminder of what had happened in the past and now that it has past with an outcome reached, It seems he was just setting aside his personal feelings or opinions of the subject at hand and just being nice to us by sharing the outcome of the ordeal that he just happened to have had some knowledge of was all with no real intention of wanting to go into an online debate of if the outcome was right wrong or indifferent of his thoughts versus anyone else's thoughts of the actual outcome.

So unfortunately what's done is done and unfortunately debating it with him here on an online forum is not really going to be able to change the overall outcome in any way, shape, or form, Nor how either Alan or anyone else feels about the whole situation. Unfortunately neither he nor most of us are in the right place to change an outcome such as something like this and i'm sure Alan does not really want to go into an emotional state with debates like this that he has no real power to change the outcomes around.

Alan is a welcomed asset here but in the past, he has demonstrated that sharing his personal feelings of what has already come about he would rather not do it seems, so please, let's respect that. Thanks guys.:)

Thanks Dave :thumbup:
 

HolyMoly

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Please guys, let's not let this one go sideways. Yes it was nice that Alan was able to give us a little insight of what the overall outcome happen to be on something that has happened in the past that most of us wouldn't really know to much about or follow all the way through unless it happened to someone you knew personally. Then you would know most of the story I'd presume.

As Alan has demonstrated in the past, it seems he enjoys coming on here to share his knowledge of many different things he's seen or done or knows about such as things like what happened here and what the overall outcome was. It was just an overall question of a reminder of what had happened in the past and now that it has past with an outcome reached, It seems he was just setting aside his personal feelings or opinions of the subject at hand and just being nice to us by sharing the outcome of the ordeal that he just happened to have had some knowledge of was all with no real intention of wanting to go into an online debate of if the outcome was right wrong or indifferent of his thoughts versus anyone else's thoughts of the actual outcome.

So unfortunately what's done is done and unfortunately debating it with him here on an online forum is not really going to be able to change the overall outcome in any way, shape, or form, Nor how either Alan or anyone else feels about the whole situation. Unfortunately neither he nor most of us are in the right place to change an outcome such as something like this and i'm sure Alan does not really want to go into an emotional state with debates like this that he has no real power to change the outcomes around.

Alan is a welcomed asset here but in the past, he has demonstrated that sharing his personal feelings of what has already come about he would rather not do it seems, so please, let's respect that. Thanks guys.:)


When I think of BoatCop, I imagine him as an ice skater in an all white jump suit doing an interpretive dance of my life.
 

Tom Brown

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He had his day in court, just like anyone else who is accused of a crime. That's all that can be asked.

It's no different from someone who recklessly kills 3 kids with his boat, or runs over and kills a guy on a PWC, then runs away and gets a year of weekends in jail and 5 years probation. (Except they took pleas instead of going to trial)

I think the problem is that when the average guy encounters a LEO, he is detained, questioned, and LEOs take their time while they figure out what's what. The citizen is guilty until proven innocent, in this sense. The LEO, however, can do quite a few illegal things without consequence and, even when there is consequence, they are called into their supervisor's office or maybe summoned to a review board, etc. Essentially innocent until proven guilty. LEOs get the benefit if the doubt where citizens do not.

I can say that while understanding the average LEO is a better boat operator than the average citizen and the average LEO is probably more lawful than the average citizen.



It may not be "fair". We may not like it. But that's the way the court system works.

For me, it comes down to consequence. A LEO, member of the military, government official, or regular citizen should all face the same consequence for the same crime. I'm not sure this is the case. It seems as though a LEO faces a lower conviction liability and also faces a lower sentence liability. *If* these two inequities exist, this would be a clear case of injustice.
 

t&y

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I never said coverup,
Uhhh....

The version of this on Jalopnik says that the LEO was leaving a restaurant after lunch..... A witness said that departures like that are the norm for these guys and that lots of locals were expecting something like this to happen. As far as the "responding to a man in water call", well, they would claim that wouldn't they.... CYA and all that.

Remember the Coasties that killed those kids at the Xmas boat parade in San Diego a few years back? Not all that different behavior by the LEOs and it ended in a whitewash and coverup. IIRC, no one went to jail nor were there fines, just some token demotions. I fully expect this to end the same way, it always does: they will close ranks and support and make excuses for their peers. The public interest really does not stand much of a chance......

Well, now that we are clear on what's been said, it appears Allen has come back and expanded on his position here. He nor I are making excuses for anything that has occurred and there is no point in arguing with you about what punishments should have been handed out and why.
 
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