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1993 21’ Eliminator Daytona

jmaxwell279

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Well I heard this is the place to come for some good knowledge and info on my new to me float.

I just recently picked up a 1993 21’ Eliminator Daytona with a 1998 mercury 200 rigged on it. Bobs Machine Hydro Jack Plate and what I was told was a fresh lower unit. ( has a bobs nose cone on it )

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Test drove the boat before the purchase and all seemed to be doing what it should.

Fast forward a week later went out to the same lake for a day on the water and the shifter starts giving me issues. It has become very difficult to put into gear. Figured cable is out of adjustment so do my best to try to adjust the cable while floating on the lake which by the way is full of wakeboard boats (FUN). Still doesn’t seem to be right. So have a buddy tow me back into the ramp.

Go home and contact the seller. He says that it is probably an adjustment issue / or the cable has gone bad since it is probably the original.

I decide to disassemble shifter at helm. Turns out somebody had “repaired” the cable previously. Yikes.
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So I think alright no big deal, put a new cable in it. So I proceed to tear apart the interior of the boat to fish out old shift cable.

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After getting a new shift cable in place and cleaning up the routing of everything I get the interior back in and cable adjustment dialed in. Great ready for another test drive.

Take the boat out to the lake last Sunday launch and fire it up all is good. Throw it into reverse and it goes in smooth great. Go to put in forward and it’s making some noise. Ok I’m thinking maybe cable adjustment is off. Tie up at the dock and pull off the cowl. Adjust the cable so it is going fully into gear both directions. We checked this by manually putting into gear and verifying the cable throw was sufficient.

Fire it back up and idle out past no wake. Go to get on throttle and I hear clunking while in forward. Put back in neutral and no noise powerhead sounds like an ok 2 stroke should. So I put in reverse no noise either back to forward I have noise. Now I’m scratching my head ok something in the lower isn’t in agreement. Put the boat in reverse and idle back to ramp. Load up and go home.

Next day call around and everyone I talk to thinks it’s adjustment I’m not convinced. So I decided to drain the gear oil out of the lower. BINGO. That stuffs got more metal flake in it than a bass boat paint job.

Seems odd to me as this lower was just rebuilt... so I was told.

Upper plug

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Lower plug
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Oil
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So this leads me where I’m at now. Seems a new stock lower unit from Mercury part # 1647-9148T84 is a replacement but then I need to come it for low water pick up. Or I can find a CLE lower or sport master lower 1.87 20” RH . Or I can sell the motor I have and source and repower with something else.

Looking for thoughts on what you would do in this situation. And for any leads on new Lower Units and or New Power.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers

-Josh


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Riverfamlee

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Welcome. I'm no help with your question but pretty sure you'll plenty to digest soon.
 

Water Romper

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If the seller claimed the lower was "New" any chance getting a hold of the seller to see if there is a warranty from the shop that did it?
The metal on the magnetic plugs is a big issue, and I am NO OUTBOARD PRO by any means. Just sit tight and the knowledgeable RDP'rs will come out of the wood work and offer suggestions, they have bailed me out many times.
Curious, where are you located/ (City, State) and for what it's worth, that's a clean looking boat. There is a "Teal" thread going on in the lounge, should toss in a picture of yours, only Teal color allowed ;)
 

jmaxwell279

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If the seller claimed the lower was "New" any chance getting a hold of the seller to see if there is a warranty from the shop that did it?
The metal on the magnetic plugs is a big issue, and I am NO OUTBOARD PRO by any means. Just sit tight and the knowledgeable RDP'rs will come out of the wood work and offer suggestions, they have bailed me out many times.
Curious, where are you located/ (City, State) and for what it's worth, that's a clean looking boat. There is a "Teal" thread going on in the lounge, should toss in a picture of yours, only Teal color allowed ;)

Seller told me lower had just been rebuilt and he spent $1200 on it. No paperwork. Seller is a friend of a friend. He gave me phone number for mechanic that did “rebuild” on the side in his garage. Owned his own boat shop for awhile been a boat mechanic for 40 years. Called him and he told me all he did was replace the seals and the carrier and water pump he didn’t take it down any further than that.

I’m in So Cal specifically San Diego Ca.

Shoot I’ll have to go find that ! Thanks


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lake p.a.l.

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Very cool new ride, congrats.
What are your goals for mph? Intended use? Our buddy F14 had a 21 with a 300XS & it ran right around 100. Good luck
 

jmaxwell279

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In the future don’t start in neutral, start in gear. Disconnect the neutral safety switch, you’ll go through lowers a lot less often.

Really ? Can’t tell if trolling or if you’re serious? Seems like it would be hard on the starter no?


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jmaxwell279

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Very cool new ride, congrats.
What are your goals for mph? Intended use? Our buddy F14 had a 21 with a 300XS & it ran right around 100. Good luck

Thanks. I don’t need anything to crazy more speed / power is always nice though. Eventually probably go a similar route with a 300xs. Just a weekend ride at the lower river between Yuma and Parker.


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ONE-A-DAY

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Clean CLE’s are hard to find since they are so old. A stock lower with a bobs cone and water pick up is actually faster than a CLE. If the carrier threads are not toast in the one you have then take it off and drop it off to Joe at Hot Laps or Kyle at WOT for a rebuild. If the carrier threads are bad then it is now a nice door stop.
 

jmaxwell279

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Clean CLE’s are hard to find since they are so old. A stock lower with a bobs cone and water pick up is actually faster than a CLE. If the carrier threads are not toast in the one you have then take it off and drop it off to Joe at Hot Laps or Kyle at WOT for a rebuild. If the carrier threads are bad then it is now a nice door stop.

Yes I hear that. Been looking and haven’t found any yet. Talked to both of those gentleman. Although I haven’t pulled it off yet by the looks of the gear oil I’m sure the internals are gone.

What’s the ballpark cost to rebuild a lower unit? Am I not gonna be in it as much as just buying a new one ?


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ONE-A-DAY

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Yes I hear that. Been looking and haven’t found any yet. Talked to both of those gentleman. Although I haven’t pulled it off yet by the looks of the gear oil I’m sure the internals are gone.

What’s the ballpark cost to rebuild a lower unit? Am I not gonna be in it as much as just buying a new one ?


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No need to waste the money on the new one if the case is fine. As far as the cost you wont know till they open it up and see whats bad and good. Change the gear oil run it for awhile and then drain the oil again and see what it looks like and if you have pubes on the magnet again, there will always be some crap on there. The chunk of pubes could be from it not being changed in a very long time. As long as its still shifting in and out of gear and not making any whining or ugly noises I would run it and keep tabs on the gear oil for now.
 

jmaxwell279

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No need to waste the money on the new one if the case is fine. As far as the cost you wont know till they open it up and see whats bad and good. Change the gear oil run it for awhile and then drain the oil again and see what it looks like and if you have pubes on the magnet again, there will always be some crap on there. The chunk of pubes could be from it not being changed in a very long time. As long as its still shifting in and out of gear and not making any whining or ugly noises I would run it and keep tabs on the gear oil for now.

The gear oil that just came out of it has about 20-30 minutes on it. I talked to the mechanic who “rebuilt” it. He seems like a straight up guy and let me know he didn’t “rebuild” it but all he did was install a new carrier, water pump impeller, and install new seals. His thought is that it is not cost effective to rebuild. I’m not saying he’s right but just putting out there what I was told.


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zx14

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My 2 cents. Go over that boat with a fine tooth comb. The previous owner did a bullshit repair on the shift cable, and didn’t tell you. Said the lower was rebuilt, and new damn well, it was not. Like Walt said, put oil in It and run it. You should have boats us anyways. So if it breaks, no biggy. Look hard at the steering. Make sure throttle cable is good too. You don’t want to get hurt.
 

jmaxwell279

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My 2 cents. Go over that boat with a fine tooth comb. The previous owner did a bullshit repair on the shift cable, and didn’t tell you. Said the lower was rebuilt, and new damn well, it was not. Like Walt said, put oil in It and run it. You should have boats us anyways. So if it breaks, no biggy. Look hard at the steering. Make sure throttle cable is good too. You don’t want to get hurt.

I 100% agree. I’ve already cleaned up a bunch of other bs as well that I haven’t mentioned. Wiring cable routing etc. Been though about 80% of the boat /trailer already. But I’m sure there is still gremlins hiding.


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jmaxwell279

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Who can enlighten me on the correct order of operations for removing the lower unit ? Do I need to put in gear , neutral? Disconnect anything at power head ? My apologies if this is a dumb question newb here.


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ONE-A-DAY

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The gear oil that just came out of it has about 20-30 minutes on it. I talked to the mechanic who “rebuilt” it. He seems like a straight up guy and let me know he didn’t “rebuild” it but all he did was install a new carrier, water pump impeller, and install new seals. His thought is that it is not cost effective to rebuild. I’m not saying he’s right but just putting out there what I was told.


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So he never took it apart and inspected the gears, clutches, bearings, seals, etc. Your call if you want to use it, some would say dont because you could put parts through the case which I have never seen on an outboard, only on big power inboards. I dont see the logic in buying a complete new lower other than the shop will turn around and sell your case to another customer. My preference would be to have someone who knows high performance stuff to take it apart and find out what the issue is, no need to toss the case especially if it already has the bobs on it. Installing a bobs is alot of work, not difficult but endless sanding and filling, sanding and filling, primer, etc., takes many many hours.
 

ONE-A-DAY

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Who can enlighten me on the correct order of operations for removing the lower unit ? Do I need to put in gear , neutral? Disconnect anything at power head ? My apologies if this is a dumb question newb here.


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nothing to it, four bolts you can see, two on either side of the cavitation plate, then a hidden one, remove the torque tab thingy and under that is another bolt, the tab bolts from the top down through the hole in the top, and then one more bolt at the front so a total of 6. From there it will just drop out, tilt the engine a bit so it doesnt fall on your foot. It may take a few whacks with a rubber mallet if it has not come off in a long time. When you are ready to reinstall we can cover that later.
 

jmaxwell279

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So he never took it apart and inspected the gears, clutches, bearings, seals, etc. Your call if you want to use it, some would say dont because you could put parts through the case which I have never seen on an outboard, only on big power inboards. I dont see the logic in buying a complete new lower other than the shop will turn around and sell your case to another customer. My preference would be to have someone who knows high performance stuff to take it apart and find out what the issue is, no need to toss the case especially if it already has the bobs on it. Installing a bobs is alot of work, not difficult but endless sanding and filling, sanding and filling, primer, etc., takes many many hours.

Your logic makes sense. I will have one of the two mentioned previously pull it apart and see where we stand.

What’s the process for removing the LU. Do I need to do anything special besides removing hardware?


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jmaxwell279

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nothing to it, four bolts you can see, two on either side of the cavitation plate, then a hidden one, remove the torque tab thingy and under that is another bolt, the tab bolts from the top down through the hole in the top, and then one more bolt at the front so a total of 6. From there it will just drop out, tilt the engine a bit so it doesnt fall on your foot. It may take a few whacks with a rubber mallet if it has not come off in a long time. When you are ready to reinstall we can cover that later.

Perfect. Thanks for your knowledge it is appreciated and very helpful!


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ONE-A-DAY

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nothing to it, four bolts you can see, two on either side of the cavitation plate, then a hidden one, remove the torque tab thingy and under that is another bolt, the tab bolts from the top down through the hole in the top, and then one more bolt at the front so a total of 6. From there it will just drop out, tilt the engine a bit so it doesnt fall on your foot. It may take a few whacks with a rubber mallet if it has not come off in a long time. When you are ready to reinstall we can cover that later.
Oh and it doesnt matter if its in gear or not when taking it off.
 

stoker2001

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Who can enlighten me on the correct order of operations for removing the lower unit ? Do I need to put in gear , neutral? Disconnect anything at power head ? My apologies if this is a dumb question newb here.


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start disassembly in neutral.3 studs facing up closer to front (leading edge),2 facing down farther back and single bolt all way in back under the anode/zink that has to be removed first.careful,it will fall off fast if your not paying attn
 

zx14

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You’re making me miss my old 21’s
 

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ONE-A-DAY

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start disassembly in neutral.3 studs facing up closer to front (leading edge),2 facing down farther back and single bolt all way in back under the anode/zink that has to be removed first.careful,it will fall off fast if your not paying attn
Sorry, forgot one, its been a bit.
 

jmaxwell279

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Those are some sweet boats!

Thank you guys for all the replies ! Will report back when I know more.


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ONE-A-DAY

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I would love to get the "easter egg" boat back as my wife called it. It was hideous or beautiful depending on who you asked. The trailer was pink on one side and green on the other, ahh the 90's.
 

Backlash

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Here I thought I was reading MY thread! 😁 Nice boat, sorry to hear about the issues you're having. That sucks!! I've had my little 19' for a year and have hardly used it....so I know the feeling. I hope to sort out a lot of the issues with mine this summer and winter, and am HOPING to have it all dialed in by next summer. I need less projects! 😁
 

jmaxwell279

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Here I thought I was reading MY thread! [emoji16] Nice boat, sorry to hear about the issues you're having. That sucks!! I've had my little 19' for a year and have hardly used it....so I know the feeling. I hope to sort out a lot of the issues with mine this summer and winter, and am HOPING to have it all dialed in by next summer. I need less projects! [emoji16]

I need less projects as well seems like everything I own is currently in pieces.


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Duramax

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I have a CLE lower at Joes right now, although I forgot which side broke. I was always going to build it as a spare and I still might. I broke some small gear out of it, but if it has something else you need that's still good, take it man and pay Joe for whatever he says its worth. I just got a replacement CLE when mine broke so I could save the trip. He has my boat now doing a few little things to it.

Tell him Erik with the twins boat.
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Backlash

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I have a CLE lower at Joes right now, although I forgot which side broke. I was always going to build it as a spare and I still might. I broke some small gear out of it, but if it has something else you need that's still good, take it man and pay Joe for whatever he says its worth. I just got a replacement CLE when mine broke so I could save the trip. He has my boat now doing a few little things to it.

Tell him Erik with the twins boat. View attachment 1020250

Damn that's a deal and a helluva offer right there!! 😲
 

jmaxwell279

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I have a CLE lower at Joes right now, although I forgot which side broke. I was always going to build it as a spare and I still might. I broke some small gear out of it, but if it has something else you need that's still good, take it man and pay Joe for whatever he says its worth. I just got a replacement CLE when mine broke so I could save the trip. He has my boat now doing a few little things to it.

Tell him Erik with the twins boat. View attachment 1020250

Thank you man much appreciated! This might just save my season.


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jmaxwell279

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I would call Kyle at Wide Open Throttle. Hes a personal friend and just rebuilt my lower. Fantastic guys and know his stuff, plus he’s in Vista.

Thanks! I have been talking with him.


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instagator

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Really ? Can’t tell if trolling or if you’re serious? Seems like it would be hard on the starter no?


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He is right, little dangerous if you forget.
 

ONE-A-DAY

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He is right, little dangerous if you forget.
Carry a spare starter with you, waaaay cheaper than a lower unit, easy repair on the water and they crap out all the time. That and have a few coil packs on board.
 

ChrisV

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In the future don’t start in neutral, start in gear. Disconnect the neutral safety switch, you’ll go through lowers a lot less often.


Could you explain this?
 

ONE-A-DAY

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Could you explain this?
Unhook the neural safety switch, putting an older outboard in and out of gear often shortens the gearcase lifespan, just start in gear. Take the key out when your not at the helm. Once the engine is warm just a blip with the ignition and it will fire.
 
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