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Armed on the river

racetrash

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Legalities of having a gun on your boat on the Parker strip ? Az resident, just wondering because half Az, half Ca.
 

rivrrts429

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I would assume you’d want to follow the laws of your resident state. I don’t think it matters where on the water you are.
 

77charger

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Think issue can be who you get stopped by being that ca and az both have authority on the water and can enforce their states laws and will do.And if they are having a bad day it can be taken out on you.
 

Water Romper

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If I recall, the center of the river is the dividing line between the two states. I don't think either state is a right to carry state so having a concealed weapon is against the law. Now with that said, I NEVER went to the river/camping/road trip without a pistol. Why would I need a gun while boating on the river? The world is a ugly place and people are hurting each other at an alarming rate. Have I ever needed to brandish my weapon? No. Have I ever thought I may need to grab it because I thought the wife and I were in danger? Yes. (in coves in Havi) but fortunately it never went that far, but having a weapon is a HUGE responsibility and must not be taken lightly. Understand there will be percussions and legal "fall out" if you ever present a gun, but that's somthing I would deal with if the situation arose., sure hope it never comes to it. As a side note, here in Idaho, everyone has a side arm strapped to their hip. Very little gun violence here.

I think Boat Cop (Alan) and the other LEO here would offer a more "legal" answer than mine.
 

DILLIGAF

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If I recall, the center of the river is the dividing line between the two states. I don't think either state is a right to carry state so having a concealed weapon is against the law. Now with that said, I NEVER went to the river/camping/road trip without a pistol. Why would I need a gun while boating on the river? The world is a ugly place and people are hurting each other at an alarming rate. Have I ever needed to brandish my weapon? No. Have I ever thought I may need to grab it because I thought the wife and I were in danger? Yes. (in coves in Havi) but fortunately it never went that far, but having a weapon is a HUGE responsibility and must not be taken lightly. Understand there will be percussions and legal "fall out" if you ever present a gun, but that's somthing I would deal with if the situation arose., sure hope it never comes to it. As a side note, here in Idaho, everyone has a side arm strapped to their hip. Very little gun violence here.

I think Boat Cop (Alan) and the other LEO here would offer a more "legal" answer than mine.

AZ is a right to carry. No CCW required.

i always looked at it this way in those areas. Whichever laws are the toughest is what you should follow.
 

azsunfun

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illegal in the boat in az, that said, cali less retrictive dont think so! its also illegal without ccw in arizona for the wife to carry in her purse, but when the smoke clears and wife needs new purse from the bullet hole, she will walk away!
 

Big B Hova

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What I'd you had a gun mounted to your boat and in plane view?
 

HCP3

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What I'd you had a gun mounted to your boat and in plane view?
special-boat-team-12-hr~2.jpg
 

PaPaG

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If I recall, the center of the river is the dividing line between the two states. I don't think either state is a right to carry state so having a concealed weapon is against the law. Now with that said, I NEVER went to the river/camping/road trip without a pistol. Why would I need a gun while boating on the river? The world is a ugly place and people are hurting each other at an alarming rate. Have I ever needed to brandish my weapon? No. Have I ever thought I may need to grab it because I thought the wife and I were in danger? Yes. (in coves in Havi) but fortunately it never went that far, but having a weapon is a HUGE responsibility and must not be taken lightly. Understand there will be percussions and legal "fall out" if you ever present a gun, but that's somthing I would deal with if the situation arose., sure hope it never comes to it. As a side note, here in Idaho, everyone has a side arm strapped to their hip. Very little gun violence here.

I think Boat Cop (Alan) and the other LEO here would offer a more "legal" answer than mine.
Incorrect, AZ is a right to carry both open and concealed. Now in regards to the River Boat COP may know exacts.
 

BoatCop

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Authorities (Police) from either state can enforce their own laws, anywhere on the River, up to the high water line of the opposing state, and have LE authority up to 25 air miles into the other state. (but cannot enforce their laws while obviously in the other state). The 25 mile provision is so opposite shore authorities can provide back-up, pursue violators, and can be first responders to emergencies in the neighboring state.

Courts from either State can prosecute crimes committed anywhere on the Colorado River, up to the opposing high water mark.

Neither State can prosecute for conduct that is legal within the State that the conduct was committed.

As far as conflicting laws, that provision has never been challenged in court, to my knowledge. As it is now, California Authorities (who's laws are usually more stringent than AZ) will prosecute CA laws on CA residents, anywhere on the River. (Which includes Lake Havasu)
 

$hot

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illegal in the boat in az, that said, cali less retrictive dont think so! its also illegal without ccw in arizona for the wife to carry in her purse, but when the smoke clears and wife needs new purse from the bullet hole, she will walk away!
Illegal in the boat and purse?
 

$hot

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Authorities (Police) from either state can enforce their own laws, anywhere on the River, up to the high water line of the opposing state, and have LE authority up to 25 air miles into the other state. (but cannot enforce their laws while obviously in the other state). The 25 mile provision is so opposite shore authorities can provide back-up, pursue violators, and can be first responders to emergencies in the neighboring state.

Courts from either State can prosecute crimes committed anywhere on the Colorado River, up to the opposing high water mark.

Neither State can prosecute for conduct that is legal within the State that the conduct was committed.

As far as conflicting laws, that provision has never been challenged in court, to my knowledge. As it is now, California Authorities (who's laws are usually more stringent than AZ) will prosecute CA laws on CA residents, anywhere on the River. (Which includes Lake Havasu)
So what your saying is? Yes carry as an non CA resident, or no?
 

Desert Whaler

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On the ocean I always have a pistol close to me if not ON me.
Perfectly legal as long as you follow those weird CA laws transporting it to and from your vehicle.
I've had the Coast Guard inspect my boat while night-fishing the Federal Breakwater in Long Beach. I told them I was carrying, they said, "You're smart". I asked "Do you need to see it"? . . . they said, "Not unless you want to show us"! 🤣 🇺🇸

I always wondered the legalities of carrying while on inland waterways.
 

azsunfun

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overlapping juristictions means simply you wil not be getting away, water or land! learn your own state laws, negligence is no excuse! love the the speargun idea! wife said i cant conceal carry that while in the channel, might offend somebody 😏
 

BoatCop

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If I recall, the center of the river is the dividing line between the two states.

The Center-line border cannot be used, based on previous State Court precedent., and the reason for the compact I described above.

Back in the 1970's a drunk boater ran over and killed two persons on Lake Havasu. He was arrested and charged by Mohave County Sheriff and prosecuted in Kingman (Superior Court location). The whiz-bang defense attorney at an evidentiary hearing challenged the prosecution to PROVE that the collision occurred in Arizona/Mohave County jurisdiction. Due to the nature of actions on the water, and the drifting of wreckage, that could not be done. The case file was transferred to San Bernardino County for their prosecution, since logic says that if it didn't happen in AZ it had to happen in CA,

However, since nothing in the law is logical, the same legal ploy was used and San Berdoo was not able to prosecute. The case was transferred to the Feds, but at the time, the most they could charge was "Grossly Negligent Operation", which at the time was a $5,000 fine and 10 days in jail.

So while there technically is a dividing line in the "middle" of the river, that line cannot be used for criminal prosecution, unless it can be PROVEN that the crime took place on one side or the other. And since the River course has shifted many times since the borders were set, unless the violation occurs OBVIOUSLY in one state or the other (like within a cove), a prosecution based on center-line border is impossible.
 

BoatCop

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Here is text of the AZ Compact. California and Nevada have similar language in their compacts:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

37-620.11. Enactment of compact

The interstate compact for jurisdiction on the Colorado river is enacted into law as follows:

Section I. Concurrent Jurisdiction

A. If conduct is prohibited by two adjoining party states, courts and law enforcement officers in either state who have jurisdiction over criminal offenses committed in a county where the Colorado river forms a common interstate boundary have concurrent jurisdiction to arrest, prosecute and try offenders for the prohibited conduct that is committed anywhere on the boundary water between the two states and concurrent jurisdiction to arrest offenders for prohibited conduct that is committed on any land mass within twenty-five air miles of the Colorado river or within twenty-five air miles of any lake that is formed by or is a part of the Colorado river.

B. This compact does not authorize:

1. Prosecution of any person for conduct which is lawful in the state where it was committed.

2. Any conduct prohibited by any party state.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

One note on this. There has to be a law in BOTH States for either one to prosecute. The laws don't have to be identical, but there must be a law that addressees the issue.

Example: AZ has a 12 year old and under operator law. California's is 16. While the laws are different, operator age is regulated by both states. California and Arizona can enforce their own specific provisions. (Currently CA enforces their 16 YOA law on CA residents (not vessel registration) only.

Now if CA decided to enact a law that prohibited the operation of green boats, but AZ had no law about boat color, the CA law could not be enforced on the concurrent jurisdiction waterway. I haven't heard how this is being addressed regarding the Boater Education provision. CA has one but AZ does not. My reading of the Compact tells me that it cannot be enforced at all anywhere on the Colorado River.
 
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lbhsbz

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Keep a fishing rod in the boat and a fishing license onboard and you’re legal to keep an unloaded weapon on board…throw a line in the water and you’re legal to carry a loaded weapon I think…especially if you’re standing on shore at the time.

edit: in CA
 

Big B Hova

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Authorities (Police) from either state can enforce their own laws, anywhere on the River, up to the high water line of the opposing state, and have LE authority up to 25 air miles into the other state. (but cannot enforce their laws while obviously in the other state). The 25 mile provision is so opposite shore authorities can provide back-up, pursue violators, and can be first responders to emergencies in the neighboring state.

Courts from either State can prosecute crimes committed anywhere on the Colorado River, up to the opposing high water mark.

Neither State can prosecute for conduct that is legal within the State that the conduct was committed.

As far as conflicting laws, that provision has never been challenged in court, to my knowledge. As it is now, California Authorities (who's laws are usually more stringent than AZ) will prosecute CA laws on CA residents, anywhere on the River. (Which includes Lake Havasu)

But is there a law that stops me from mounting a machine gun to a blown flatty?
 

Blackmagic94

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Is it legal to have a firearm on a vessel in az controlled waters? Someone mentioned that it is not and that is news to me.


Not talking about the River
 

FROGMAN524

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How about the other lakes like Mohave and Mead that are NV/AZ or Powell which is UT/AZ?


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BoatCop

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Arizona is a Constitutional Carry state. ANYONE (unless specifically prohibited) can carry a firearm openly (18 YOA) or concealed (21 YOA *19 for military or veteran who has completed a course of firearms safety) on their person or within a vehicle (including a watercraft), Except in locations where it specifically prohibited, such as Government facilities, airport security areas, Bars (except LE or CCW permit), polling places, Schools, Utility - nuclear-hydro-electric* facilities, etc.

LE is defined as being certified by the AZ POST and currently employed as an AZ Peace Officer.

18 to 20 YOA may possess a firearm in a vehicle (or boat) provided the firearm is inside a case, holster, scabbard, pack or luggage, or is located within a storage compartment, map pocket, trunk or glove compartment.


*stay away from the dams
 

BoatCop

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How about the other lakes like Mohave and Mead that are NV/AZ or Powell which is UT/AZ?

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The Interstate Compact I described above applies to the National Park waters regarding State or local enforcement. AZ. CA, NV and UT are all party to the Compact(s). The Parks Service generally follows State laws regarding weapons possession, except they may prohibit them within NPS buildings, such as government offices, visitor centers, ranger stations, fee collection buildings, and maintenance facilities. Even though I said "MAY" prohibit, presume that they are until shown otherwise. Especially with the current Federal Government Administration.
 
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BoatCop

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Regarding Weapons possession on Indian Reservations (CRIT & Fort Mohave):

Tribal Codes may prohibit persons from possessing concealed or openly carried firearms, HOWEVER, the Tribal Codes usually apply to Registered Native Americans of a Federally recognized Tribe and have no force on Non-Natives. While they do have authority to enforce CIVIL violations (traffic, minor violations, etc) on non-Natives, and impose fines, Tribal Courts cannot prosecute non-Natives. However, their facilities (including Resort facilities, Casinos, Hotels, Govt. Buildings, Businesses owned by the Tribe, etc) are considered Government Buildings and can prohibit weapon possession.

Tribal Police Departments and Officers in AZ are Certified by AZPOST and their Peace Officers can enforce AZ laws, citing or prosecuting crimes on the Reservations through the Local County Justice/Superior Courts. California does not recognize Indian Police authority, except on Native Americans within the Res. Not sure how Nevada handles it, in the case of Fort Mohave on the NV side.
 

BoatCop

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Is it legal to have a firearm on a vessel in az controlled waters? Someone mentioned that it is not and that is news to me.


Not talking about the River


As I stated above, the AZ Weapon laws apply anywhere in the State, including sole-State waters, such as Lake Pleasant, Roosevelt, Apache, etc. Arizona State Law also states that local jurisdictions, such as Cities, Counties, Towns, Parks, etc. cannot implement weapons laws or ordinances that are stricter than State Law. It is left to School Boards and Regents, in the case of colleges, to set their own restrictions on their campuses, except that they cannot restrict firearm possession in vehicles on public thoroughfares and parking lots within or adjacent to the campus.
 

Desert Whaler

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I can't vouch for the validity of this video, but i found it very interesting.
(1st 9 minutes . . . after that it switches topics)
 

BoatCop

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if you don't live in CA you cannot get a CCW for CA.

Also, there is no reciprocity in AZ for CA CCW permits. Meaning, AZ doesn't recognize CA CCW permits and CA doesn't recognize ANYONE's CCW, except their own. The map below shows which states recognize AZ permits. If they don't recognize our permits, we don't recognize theirs. But this doesn't preclude non-AZ residents from carrying where a CCW is not required.

While anyone can carry concealed in AZ in general, there are some specific locations that would require a CCW, such as businesses that serve alcohol.

For those that don't know, Arizona residents that possess an AZ CCW Permit do not have to undergo the Federal background check requirements when purchasing a firearm from licensed Firearm Dealers in AZ. The FFA forms have to be filled out, but the NICS check isn't required.

ARIZONA-CCW-MAP-0716.png
 

702sandman

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The Interstate Compact I described above applies to the National Park waters regarding State or local enforcement. AZ. CA, NV and UT are all party to the Compact(s). The Parks Service generally follows State laws regarding weapons possession, except they may prohibit them within NPS buildings, such as government offices, visitor centers, ranger stations, fee collection buildings, and maintenance facilities. Even though I said "MAY" prohibit, presume that they are until shown otherwise. Especially with the current Federal Government Administration.

last Year I was driving down to the dam to just walk across the bypass bridge with the wife and at the check point they asked if we had any weapons so I replied yes I have my carry gun and my CCW, they said to turn around and leave I can’t carry a gun anywhere in the Hoover dam area because it’s a federal building. So we turned around and left. Now I would assume That you couldn’t carry on any federal land or national parks because it’s typically federal property correct ? Isn’t this tru with waterways ? I would think they are federal and same rules apply. I just carry mine and leave in a certain spot in my boat and Won’t disclose it.
 

BoatCop

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last Year I was driving down to the dam to just walk across the bypass bridge with the wife and at the check point they asked if we had any weapons so I replied yes I have my carry gun and my CCW, they said to turn around and leave I can’t carry a gun anywhere in the Hoover dam area because it’s a federal building. So we turned around and left. Now I would assume That you couldn’t carry on any federal land or national parks because it’s typically federal property correct ? Isn’t this tru with waterways ? I would think they are federal and same rules apply. I just carry mine and leave in a certain spot in my boat and Won’t disclose it.

The Dams are Federal Facilities, as opposed to just Federal Land or Federal Owned Property. They are considered Sensitive Infrastructure. Read what I posted earlier about Hydro Electric facilities.

A 2010 Federal Law allows loaded weapons in National Parks and on other Federal lands, as long as the person is allowed by applicable State Law.
 

little rowe boat

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Also, there is no reciprocity in AZ for CA CCW permits. Meaning, AZ doesn't recognize CA CCW permits and CA doesn't recognize ANYONE's CCW, except their own. The map below shows which states recognize AZ permits. If they don't recognize our permits, we don't recognize theirs. But this doesn't preclude non-AZ residents from carrying where a CCW is not required.

While anyone can carry concealed in AZ in general, there are some specific locations that would require a CCW, such as businesses that serve alcohol.

For those that don't know, Arizona residents that possess an AZ CCW Permit do not have to undergo the Federal background check requirements when purchasing a firearm from licensed Firearm Dealers in AZ. The FFA forms have to be filled out, but the NICS check isn't required.

View attachment 1024124
Could you explain to me the difference in a Non resident AZ. CCW permit and a resident AZ.CCW. I have a Ca. CCW and a AZ. CCW. I have homes in both states, would they both be considered resident CCW's??
 

BoatCop

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Something that surprised me, several years ago I had to go onto Twenty-Nine Palms Marine Base. At the time I was Retired Coast Guard. I had to get a temp parking pass, and declared my Firearm. The Sergeant on duty, asked If I had a Permit, and I said no, but was a currently active Peace Officer. He said no problem.

Even now, I can go on Arizona Military Bases armed with no issues. However, I do have an AZ CCW, and am covered by the LEOSA. Have been on Fort Huachuca Army Base, Luke AFB, Yuma Proving Ground, and Yuma MCAS. Always advise the Gate Sentry, and have been waved through each time.

I think it's bullshit that I can carry, but Active Duty actually assigned to that particular base, cannot in most cases. Whether they can, or not, depends on the Commanding Officer. A 2016 rule issued by the Pentagon permits individual Base COs to determine Weapon regulations, consistent with State Law, on their base and other facilities (barracks, Family Housing, etc)
 
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