Cactus RV - When the house of cards falls..

[RiverDave]

I was referring to the repitched/new/used guy in Miami...

Forgot about that one, but yeah that guy is a cocksucker for sure.. lol

 

[Bigbore500r]

Forgot about that one, but yeah that guy is a cocksucker for sure.. lol

@Coast Mar Exp

 

[ChumpChange]

....every one can point and laugh at me for not paying enough for my 2 brand new toons and causing a company to go broke....

If you feel like you got a sweet deal because Cactus was defrauding their bank and knowingly not paying off their flooring, they may want to talk to you. Some of the various people Vik liquidated his Lambos to had to give them back as they knowingly paid too little. Did you knowingly not pay enough Steve?

https://jalopnik.com/lamborghini-orange-county-owner-to-plead-guilty-on-frau-5168645

 

[ChumpChange]

Some more Orange County Lambo reading.....

https://ferraris-online.com/the-lambo-dealer-the-12m-swindle-the-slammer/

n early November 2008, I received multiple early morning phone calls and emails telling me that Lamborghini of Orange County had just closed its doors.

My first thought was how could the largest Lamborghini dealership in the world possibly go broke? My second thought was, why had it taken so long?

We begin with a short history lesson
Successful tractor manufacturer Ferruccio Lamborghini entered the automotive world with the 350 GTV at the Turin Auto Show in 1963, followed by the modestly successful 350 GT and 400 GT production cars. The Miura bowed as a bare mid-engined super-exotic chassis at the Turin Auto Show in November 1965, posing Lamborghini as a serious challenger to Ferrari. When Marcello Gandini’s stunning bodywork was unveiled at the Geneva Auto show, the Miura became the exotic for the rich and famous. Lamborghini continued with the Espada four-seater in 1968, the mass-market Urraco at the Turin Show in 1970, and the ultra-exotic LP 500 Countach at the Geneva show in 1971.

Alas, Lamborghini ran out of luck and money in the early 1970s after the tractor factory had bet the farm on a major plant expansion. A large order for tractors was canceled, wiping out Lamborghini’s cash reserves. The Urraco and LP 400 Countach finally went into limited production, just as the world was rocked by the first oil crisis of October 1973 and the market for thirsty supercars imploded. Add on a major investment in the Hummer-style Cheetah (LM002 in America), and by 1978, the automaker was bankrupt.

The soap opera years
The names on the head office door kept changing. First Georges-Henri Rossetti, a Swiss industrialist, bought a 51% share from Ferruccio Lamborghini. Then Lamborghini sold his remaining 49% to Rene Leimer, another Swiss. In 1978, the Italian courts appointed Dr. Alessandro Arteses to run things, but by 1979, the company was led by Raymond Noima and Hubert Hahne, who was Lamborghini’s German importer. In July 1980, Patrick Mimran, (another Swiss) took over management and in 1984 took ownership, but lacked the engineering expertise and funds to do more than keep Lamborghini on life support.

Chrysler saves the day
Lee Iacocca came to the rescue in April 1987, when Chrysler bought Lamborghini. A quick facelift of the Countach as the “25th Anniversary” special model kept the name and factory afloat until the Diablo arrived. Chrysler’s timing seemed right, as Marcello Gandini, who designed the Miura and the Countach, was already working on the Diablo. Thanks to Chrysler dollars, design input, volume manufacturing techniques, efficient pollution controls, and attention to creature comforts, the Diablo was a success.

Once again Lamborghini had the right car at the wrong time, introducing the Diablo in January 1990, as the world economy fell off a cliff. In January of 1994, Chrysler bailed out, selling to an Indonesian investment group headed by Tommy Suharto. Shortly before, Chrysler had built a substantial parts and vehicle distribution center in Jacksonville, Florida, under a separate division called ALUSA, or Automobili Lamborghini USA. ALUSA had financial problems from the start, and within a few years owed the factory for about 20 U.S.-spec. Diablos.

My uncle’s boss runs Chrysler
In an amazing coincidence, shortly after the Chrysler takeover, Tony Carlini, the nephew of Lee Iacocca’s lieutenant, Hank Carlini, became the Orange County Lamborghini dealer. Pacifica Lamborghini immediately sold its allotment, plus a few more Anniversary Countachs and rode the Diablo to success. Unfortunately, Carlini had no interest in service or parts, a necessity for a franchised exotic car dealership, the economy declined, the Diablo lost its initial luster, and in 1993 the doors closed.

Enter Vik Keuylian
I first met Vik Keuylian when he was a small-time car broker in Newport Beach, specializing in Lamborghinis. In 1995, Keuylian took over the Orange County Lamborghini dealership, simply because no one else wanted it. As the economy improved, Keuylian’s Platinum Motors prospered, but without a regular supply of cars, no dealer can succeed.

So in January 1998, Keuylian offered to buy the entire inventory of ALUSA—about 20 new U.S.-spec. Diablo VTs and SVs—at the importer cost, or about $35,000 below dealer cost, with 20 days to pay. Lamborghini was thrilled at the cash flow and Keuylian sold the cars at dealer cost to a line of buyers.

Lamborghini was cashed out of 20 cars, Keuylian made the $35,000 spread between importer and dealer cost (times 20), and retail clients were thrilled to buy at dealer cost. As part of the agreement, Keuylian was given the distributorship for North America. Not surprisingly, the surviving dealer network was unhappy about 20 cars sold at cost, undercutting their potential sales, and even less thrilled to have Keuylian as the distributor.

The boom years
By mid-1998, Keuylian had doubled Lamborghini’s U.S. sales from 48 cars to 100 cars; by the end of 1998, Keuylian had sold 160 new Lamborghinis, over half of total production. At roughly $35,000 profit per car—times 160—the math pencils out to $5.6m. Add a bonus of $10,000 on every car, once Keuylian reached 100 cars, and the picture was very rosy. For reasons best left to the reader’s imagination, the business entities were in the names of Keuylian’s sisters, Nora, Sossi, and Astrid. Keuylian and his sisters were to keep the distributorship for the next two and a half years.

On August 4, 1998, Audi AG became the sole owner of Automobili Lamborghini and immediately moved to replace the Keuylian family as importers. By late 2000, after what can best be called acrimonious negotiations, Audi bought out the Keuylians as importers, but Platinum Lamborghini remained the Orange County dealer. With the introduction of the Gallardo, sales at Platinum Motors reached 200 cars a year, making Platinum Lamborghini the largest Lamborghini dealership in the world. High-profile clients such as Rod Stewart, Kobe Bryant, Nicolas Cage, and Dennis Rodman certainly helped sales.

Your word is your bond
There are only three businesses in which large sums of money are wired around the world with minimal paperwork and lots of trust—flashy trinkets (as in diamonds, watches, and jewelry), exotic cars, and illicit drugs. The exotic car world is a contact sport and all the major players have been in the game for decades, and they know who to trust. However, Keuylian developed a reputation of playing by his own rules, and if there was a way to make deals go sideways, Keuylian found it, leaving a trail of angry clients and furious fellow dealers in his wake.

The boom turns to bust
Run properly, Platinum Lamborghini had sales of just over 200 high-end exotics a year, with a gross margin of about $25,000 per car. That’s $5m a year income and a pre-tax, after-expenses profit of about $2m. But Keuylian got caught up in the real estate bubble, and from 2005 to 2007 he bought three empty building lots in the Santa Ana Auto mall at over $6m. He also purchased his freeway frontage showroom for another $9m—a crushing $15m debt load.

In what can only be called egotistical madness, Keuylian attempted to develop a 60-acre winery with a 120-room luxury resort in Temecula’s wine country. He also tried to build a 154-room hotel in Escondido… another fiasco. As things spiraled out of control he added two closed restaurants in South Orange County, intending to build new dealerships on the land. Finally, Keuylian bought land on Pacific Coast Highway for a new dealership and opened two satellite showrooms, one in Calabasas and another in Newport Beach.

It was too much. The negative cash flow was far more than even a prosperous exotic car dealership could handle. When the economy went south in 2008, the house of cards collapsed. True to form, Keuylian held a two-week Lamborghini fire sale, dumping 54 cars at below-wholesale prices for $8.1 million. As you might expect, none of that money found its way back to Volkswagen AG, who had provided the cars on credit. In November 2008, the doors were closed, the building was cleared, and Volkswagen AG was owed $12m out-of-trust.

No winners here
After more than three decades in the exotic car business, I know that in boom times it’s hard to do anything wrong, and in a bust it’s hard to do anything right. Keuylian didn’t pay attention to his business, didn’t build a group of trusted dealers to work with when business slowed, and was wiped out by massive financial over-extension and mismanagement within six months of the downturn.

On March 11, 2009, in an effort to shield his sisters and in a pre-arranged deal with the D.A., Keuylian pleaded guilty to wire fraud, with a recommended five-year sentence.

 

[RiverDave]

If you feel like you got a sweet deal because Cactus was defrauding their bank and knowingly not paying off their flooring, they may want to talk to you. Some of the various people Vik liquidated his Lambos to had to give them back as they knowingly paid too little. Did you knowingly not pay enough Steve?

https://jalopnik.com/lamborghini-orange-county-owner-to-plead-guilty-on-frau-5168645

He’s got his titles and his paperwork so he’s not worried about it..

RD

 

[2FORCEFULL]

If you feel like you got a sweet deal because Cactus was defrauding their bank and knowingly not paying off their flooring, they may want to talk to you. Some of the various people Vik liquidated his Lambos to had to give them back as they knowingly paid too little. Did you knowingly not pay enough Steve?

https://jalopnik.com/lamborghini-orange-county-owner-to-plead-guilty-on-frau-5168645

LOL.... I didn't know that I didn't pay enough till after I bought them,and no one told me what they did with my money...but... if the bank thinks that, they can give me my money back and take the toons....no problem here...

 

[RiverDave]

LOL.... I didn't know that I didn't pay enough till after I bought them,and no one told me what they did with my money...but... if the bank thinks that, they can give me my money back and take the toons....no problem here...

Free rental boat right?

 

[HNL2LHC]

Free rental boat right?

Plus we all know the tune bubble burst last week. :looking:

 

[gqchris]

Some more Orange County Lambo reading.....

https://ferraris-online.com/the-lambo-dealer-the-12m-swindle-the-slammer/

n early November 2008, I received multiple early morning phone calls and emails telling me that Lamborghini of Orange County had just closed its doors.

My first thought was how could the largest Lamborghini dealership in the world possibly go broke? My second thought was, why had it taken so long?

We begin with a short history lesson
Successful tractor manufacturer Ferruccio Lamborghini entered the automotive world with the 350 GTV at the Turin Auto Show in 1963, followed by the modestly successful 350 GT and 400 GT production cars. The Miura bowed as a bare mid-engined super-exotic chassis at the Turin Auto Show in November 1965, posing Lamborghini as a serious challenger to Ferrari. When Marcello Gandini’s stunning bodywork was unveiled at the Geneva Auto show, the Miura became the exotic for the rich and famous. Lamborghini continued with the Espada four-seater in 1968, the mass-market Urraco at the Turin Show in 1970, and the ultra-exotic LP 500 Countach at the Geneva show in 1971.

Alas, Lamborghini ran out of luck and money in the early 1970s after the tractor factory had bet the farm on a major plant expansion. A large order for tractors was canceled, wiping out Lamborghini’s cash reserves. The Urraco and LP 400 Countach finally went into limited production, just as the world was rocked by the first oil crisis of October 1973 and the market for thirsty supercars imploded. Add on a major investment in the Hummer-style Cheetah (LM002 in America), and by 1978, the automaker was bankrupt.

The soap opera years
The names on the head office door kept changing. First Georges-Henri Rossetti, a Swiss industrialist, bought a 51% share from Ferruccio Lamborghini. Then Lamborghini sold his remaining 49% to Rene Leimer, another Swiss. In 1978, the Italian courts appointed Dr. Alessandro Arteses to run things, but by 1979, the company was led by Raymond Noima and Hubert Hahne, who was Lamborghini’s German importer. In July 1980, Patrick Mimran, (another Swiss) took over management and in 1984 took ownership, but lacked the engineering expertise and funds to do more than keep Lamborghini on life support.

Chrysler saves the day
Lee Iacocca came to the rescue in April 1987, when Chrysler bought Lamborghini. A quick facelift of the Countach as the “25th Anniversary” special model kept the name and factory afloat until the Diablo arrived. Chrysler’s timing seemed right, as Marcello Gandini, who designed the Miura and the Countach, was already working on the Diablo. Thanks to Chrysler dollars, design input, volume manufacturing techniques, efficient pollution controls, and attention to creature comforts, the Diablo was a success.

Once again Lamborghini had the right car at the wrong time, introducing the Diablo in January 1990, as the world economy fell off a cliff. In January of 1994, Chrysler bailed out, selling to an Indonesian investment group headed by Tommy Suharto. Shortly before, Chrysler had built a substantial parts and vehicle distribution center in Jacksonville, Florida, under a separate division called ALUSA, or Automobili Lamborghini USA. ALUSA had financial problems from the start, and within a few years owed the factory for about 20 U.S.-spec. Diablos.

My uncle’s boss runs Chrysler
In an amazing coincidence, shortly after the Chrysler takeover, Tony Carlini, the nephew of Lee Iacocca’s lieutenant, Hank Carlini, became the Orange County Lamborghini dealer. Pacifica Lamborghini immediately sold its allotment, plus a few more Anniversary Countachs and rode the Diablo to success. Unfortunately, Carlini had no interest in service or parts, a necessity for a franchised exotic car dealership, the economy declined, the Diablo lost its initial luster, and in 1993 the doors closed.

Enter Vik Keuylian
I first met Vik Keuylian when he was a small-time car broker in Newport Beach, specializing in Lamborghinis. In 1995, Keuylian took over the Orange County Lamborghini dealership, simply because no one else wanted it. As the economy improved, Keuylian’s Platinum Motors prospered, but without a regular supply of cars, no dealer can succeed.

So in January 1998, Keuylian offered to buy the entire inventory of ALUSA—about 20 new U.S.-spec. Diablo VTs and SVs—at the importer cost, or about $35,000 below dealer cost, with 20 days to pay. Lamborghini was thrilled at the cash flow and Keuylian sold the cars at dealer cost to a line of buyers.

Lamborghini was cashed out of 20 cars, Keuylian made the $35,000 spread between importer and dealer cost (times 20), and retail clients were thrilled to buy at dealer cost. As part of the agreement, Keuylian was given the distributorship for North America. Not surprisingly, the surviving dealer network was unhappy about 20 cars sold at cost, undercutting their potential sales, and even less thrilled to have Keuylian as the distributor.

The boom years
By mid-1998, Keuylian had doubled Lamborghini’s U.S. sales from 48 cars to 100 cars; by the end of 1998, Keuylian had sold 160 new Lamborghinis, over half of total production. At roughly $35,000 profit per car—times 160—the math pencils out to $5.6m. Add a bonus of $10,000 on every car, once Keuylian reached 100 cars, and the picture was very rosy. For reasons best left to the reader’s imagination, the business entities were in the names of Keuylian’s sisters, Nora, Sossi, and Astrid. Keuylian and his sisters were to keep the distributorship for the next two and a half years.

On August 4, 1998, Audi AG became the sole owner of Automobili Lamborghini and immediately moved to replace the Keuylian family as importers. By late 2000, after what can best be called acrimonious negotiations, Audi bought out the Keuylians as importers, but Platinum Lamborghini remained the Orange County dealer. With the introduction of the Gallardo, sales at Platinum Motors reached 200 cars a year, making Platinum Lamborghini the largest Lamborghini dealership in the world. High-profile clients such as Rod Stewart, Kobe Bryant, Nicolas Cage, and Dennis Rodman certainly helped sales.

Your word is your bond
There are only three businesses in which large sums of money are wired around the world with minimal paperwork and lots of trust—flashy trinkets (as in diamonds, watches, and jewelry), exotic cars, and illicit drugs. The exotic car world is a contact sport and all the major players have been in the game for decades, and they know who to trust. However, Keuylian developed a reputation of playing by his own rules, and if there was a way to make deals go sideways, Keuylian found it, leaving a trail of angry clients and furious fellow dealers in his wake.

The boom turns to bust
Run properly, Platinum Lamborghini had sales of just over 200 high-end exotics a year, with a gross margin of about $25,000 per car. That’s $5m a year income and a pre-tax, after-expenses profit of about $2m. But Keuylian got caught up in the real estate bubble, and from 2005 to 2007 he bought three empty building lots in the Santa Ana Auto mall at over $6m. He also purchased his freeway frontage showroom for another $9m—a crushing $15m debt load.

In what can only be called egotistical madness, Keuylian attempted to develop a 60-acre winery with a 120-room luxury resort in Temecula’s wine country. He also tried to build a 154-room hotel in Escondido… another fiasco. As things spiraled out of control he added two closed restaurants in South Orange County, intending to build new dealerships on the land. Finally, Keuylian bought land on Pacific Coast Highway for a new dealership and opened two satellite showrooms, one in Calabasas and another in Newport Beach.

It was too much. The negative cash flow was far more than even a prosperous exotic car dealership could handle. When the economy went south in 2008, the house of cards collapsed. True to form, Keuylian held a two-week Lamborghini fire sale, dumping 54 cars at below-wholesale prices for $8.1 million. As you might expect, none of that money found its way back to Volkswagen AG, who had provided the cars on credit. In November 2008, the doors were closed, the building was cleared, and Volkswagen AG was owed $12m out-of-trust.

No winners here
After more than three decades in the exotic car business, I know that in boom times it’s hard to do anything wrong, and in a bust it’s hard to do anything right. Keuylian didn’t pay attention to his business, didn’t build a group of trusted dealers to work with when business slowed, and was wiped out by massive financial over-extension and mismanagement within six months of the downturn.

On March 11, 2009, in an effort to shield his sisters and in a pre-arranged deal with the D.A., Keuylian pleaded guilty to wire fraud, with a recommended five-year sentence.

This is a great read! So interesting to know how the collapse went down.

Think about how much of this crap went on before the days of the internet. We never heard about it and life went on. Now we all can be warned and just like the boat industry, seems like the car industry has just as much shadiness!

 

[ChumpChange]

This is a great read! So interesting to know how the collapse went down.

Think about how much of this crap went on before the days of the internet. We never heard about it and life went on. Now we all can be warned and just like the boat industry, seems like the car industry has just as much shadiness!

The fraud of Lambo OC demolished the used Lamborghini market for quite some time after, even more than the recession would have. Lamborghini had just made a new version of red called Rosso Vik which is no longer offered.

 

[Lavey29]

Will be interesting to see how it all plays out in the end. Hopefully the honest boaters just trying to enjoy their hobby dont get screwed over in the end. If you paid all cash I would be concerned for sure because that just opens the door for possible fraud if this ultimately becomes a criminal investigation.

 

[RiverDave]

Will be interesting to see how it all plays out in the end. Hopefully the honest boaters just trying to enjoy their hobby dont get screwed over in the end. If you paid all cash I would be concerned for sure because that just opens the door for possible fraud if this ultimately becomes a criminal investigation.

If your paper work checks you are good..

 

[2FORCEFULL]

If you feel like you got a sweet deal because Cactus was defrauding their bank and knowingly not paying off their flooring, they may want to talk to you. Some of the various people Vik liquidated his Lambos to had to give them back as they knowingly paid too little. Did you knowingly not pay enough Steve?

https://jalopnik.com/lamborghini-orange-county-owner-to-plead-guilty-on-frau-5168645

As you very well know,... I have put the toons up for sell...It really bothers me that I didn't pay enough, but that's behind me now...my question to you is,... knowing that I didn't pay enough.... do I have to sell them for more than I paid,..?? or am I breaking the law by selling for less than I paid.... I just wanna be fair and do whats right...

 

[2FORCEFULL]

so now..… not only do you have to worry about getting ripped off,... you have to make sure you paid enough?????

 

[2FORCEFULL]

Apples and oranges, you can’t compare that with Lake Havasu. People come here to boat and party in the summer not go shopping. Snowbirds come here and most are on a budget and aren’t really into trendy. The town really isn’t big enough to sustain a mall of that size. I don’t know maybe they were planning for the future.

I'm gonna forward this to my wife if you don't mind...

 

[RiverDave]

so now..… not only do you have to worry about getting ripped off,... you have to make sure you paid enough?????

Paid enough and get paid enough or lose enough!

 

[Lavey29]

If your paper work checks you are good..

The Lamborghini guys thought the same thing

 

[Lavey29]

As you very well know,... I have put the toons up for sell...It really bothers me that I didn't pay enough, but that's behind me now...my question to you is,... knowing that I didn't pay enough.... do I have to sell them for more than I paid,..?? or am I breaking the law by selling for less than I paid.... I just wanna be fair and do whats right...

Perhaps you should ask your good buddy Scott?

 

[Havasu blue label]

I wouldn't lose sleep over it the price was given to you by a lic salesman and dealer

 

[RiverDave]

Perhaps you should ask your good buddy Scott?

Maybe you should stop chasing Steve around the board for every little thing..

Not even sure why you are doing that to begin with? Especially on this subject?


I still don’t get why you got mad that he got a toon for 59k? Etc? I read the post in the other threads and it seems like you are taking his business very personally when it has nothing to do with you?

Or does it somehow?

 

[Lavey29]

Maybe you should stop chasing Steve around the board for every little thing..

Not even sure why you are doing that to begin with? Especially on this subject?

He references our previous discussion in every post which is fine. I just respond in kind when I feel like it is relevant to do so. He sent me a PM message saying how much he liked the guy and he made him laugh. I didn't know if he was talking boat stuff or a tinder date with him but seemed obvious they were friends.

 

[RiverDave]

I wouldn't lose sleep over it the price was given to you by a lic salesman and dealer

Exactly if you got titles, paid the advertised price etc there’s no way it is getting unwound.

 

[RiverDave]

He references our previous discussion in every post which is fine. I just respond in kind when I feel like it is relevant to do so.

I still don’t understand why ya got mad about what he paid in the first place?

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

As you very well know,... I have put the toons up for sell...It really bothers me that I didn't pay enough, but that's behind me now...my question to you is,... knowing that I didn't pay enough.... do I have to sell them for more than I paid,..?? or am I breaking the law by selling for less than I paid.... I just wanna be fair and do whats right...

It isn’t your job to investigate the dealers you buy boats from. You are going to be fine selling them for whatever the market will bear.

 

[Bobby V]

Maybe you should stop chasing Steve around the board for every little thing..

Not even sure why you are doing that to begin with? Especially on this subject?


I still don’t get why you got mad that he got a toon for 59k? Etc? I read the post in the other threads and it seems like you are taking his business very personally when it has nothing to do with you?

Or does it somehow?

59? Says 70k or 90K in the Pontoon for sale section. Is this the same toon? Post 17 and 18.

https://www.riverdavesplace.com/forums/threads/in-2-deep-with-toons-for-sale-or-trade.206055/

 

[Loo Dog]

As you very well know,... I have put the toons up for sell...It really bothers me that I didn't pay enough, but that's behind me now...my question to you is,... knowing that I didn't pay enough.... do I have to sell them for more than I paid,..?? or am I breaking the law by selling for less than I paid.... I just wanna be fair and do whats right...

In all honesty, and we all know you DIDN’T pay too little for those toons. Don’t let anybody convince you otherwise. You got a good deal in a hot, overinflated market. You actually and probably paid too much! You asked yourself about the bubble bursting, which will prove itself to be instinctively correct in the near future.

 

[RiverDave]

59? Says 70k or 90K in the Pontoon for sale section. Is this the same toon? Post 17 and 18.

https://www.riverdavesplace.com/forums/threads/in-2-deep-with-toons-for-sale-or-trade.206055/

One was 59 no trailer or something.. I am not gonna go back and research it all. Unless I was gonna buy one then I’d be looking posts up.

 

[riverroyal]

One was 59 no trailer or something.. I am not gonna go back and research it all. Unless I was gonna buy one then I’d be looking posts up.

so what your saying is theres a chance your buying a pontoon?

 

[SJP]

Anyone going boating this weekend?

 

[240Hallett]

Anyone going boating this weekend?

Yes

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Anyone going boating this weekend?

Yes, just need to get my boat off the rack!

 

[Bigbore500r]

Like sand thru an hourglass....so are the days of our lives
Jesus

 

[Lavey29]

I still don’t understand why ya got mad about what he paid in the first place?

Perhaps you know (maybe you don't) INTEGRITY is one of the most important qualities that defines an individuals character. Good people have it and losers don't.

INTEGRITY is one of the primary underlying reasons for the thread you started here based on your second hand hearsay information

 

[RiverDave]

Perhaps you know (maybe you don't) INTEGRITY is one of the most important qualities that defines an individuals character. Good people have it and losers don't.

INTEGRITY is one of the primary underlying reasons for the thread you started here based on your second hand hearsay information

Which has what to do with how much Steve did or didn’t buy a boat from a dealership for?

Or are you saying my integrity is in question?

I talked to the guy that repo’d the boats directly. (2nd hand?)

What are you talking about?

 

[Lavey29]

Which has what to do with how much Steve did or didn’t buy a boat from a dealership for?

Or are you saying my integrity is in question?

I talked to the guy that repo’d the boats directly. (2nd hand?)

What are you talking about?

Yes your information is second hand. You did not witness any of the alleged fraud you posted about. You heard about it from a guy who may or may not have first hand knowledge himself.

 

[RiverDave]

Yes your information is second hand. You did not witness any of the alleged fraud you posted about. You heard about it from a guy who may or may not have first hand knowledge himself.

He was contracted to go get the boats from the flooring company. Lol. What are you talking about?

RD

 

[Lavey29]

He was contracted to go get the boats from the flooring company. Lol. What are you talking about?

RD

You posted multiple times in this whole thread "word on the street" or "I heard" or "I talked with" :

I can’t confirm first hand but my buddy was there


To correct some errors earlier. Warlock250 is Todd and he is one of the owners of Cactus RV. Him and Scott were partners in the biz. I can’t even pretend to know why he came on here aggressively multiple times taking shots at Horzizon. Then in one thread denied even being a part of Cactus RV.. (bizarre?).

Scott has disappeared and a ton of cash is missing. Last number I was told is 1.3 million.

There is over 60 warranty claims that were never honored, and it looks like JR will be doing the repair work.

It would stand to reason the other flooring company isn’t far behind.

Word on the street is Todd is going to try to salvage the operation, but I’d imagine that’s going to be an uphill battle.



Other then hearing about some the boats picked up, you didn't witness anything. You are just posting "what you heard" and the person(s) you "heard" it from may or may not have first hand knowledge of the alleged incident.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

This happens every time RD posts "breaking news"..

 

[Blackmagic94]

You posted multiple times in this whole thread "word on the street" or "I heard" or "I talked with" :

I can’t confirm first hand but my buddy was there


To correct some errors earlier. Warlock250 is Todd and he is one of the owners of Cactus RV. Him and Scott were partners in the biz. I can’t even pretend to know why he came on here aggressively multiple times taking shots at Horzizon. Then in one thread denied even being a part of Cactus RV.. (bizarre?).

Scott has disappeared and a ton of cash is missing. Last number I was told is 1.3 million.

There is over 60 warranty claims that were never honored, and it looks like JR will be doing the repair work.

It would stand to reason the other flooring company isn’t far behind.

Word on the street is Todd is going to try to salvage the operation, but I’d imagine that’s going to be an uphill battle.



Other then hearing about some the boats picked up, you didn't witness anything. You are just posting "what you heard" and the person(s) you "heard" it from may or may not have first hand knowledge of the alleged incident.

What Dave has said on here was confirmed to me by another source that is close friends of the owners.

 

[guest hs]

Godfreys were picked up today. Not looking good I have a few inside sources telling me this.

 

[RiverDave]

You posted multiple times in this whole thread "word on the street" or "I heard" or "I talked with" :

I can’t confirm first hand but my buddy was there


To correct some errors earlier. Warlock250 is Todd and he is one of the owners of Cactus RV. Him and Scott were partners in the biz. I can’t even pretend to know why he came on here aggressively multiple times taking shots at Horzizon. Then in one thread denied even being a part of Cactus RV.. (bizarre?).

Scott has disappeared and a ton of cash is missing. Last number I was told is 1.3 million.

There is over 60 warranty claims that were never honored, and it looks like JR will be doing the repair work.

It would stand to reason the other flooring company isn’t far behind.

Word on the street is Todd is going to try to salvage the operation, but I’d imagine that’s going to be an uphill battle.



Other then hearing about some the boats picked up, you didn't witness anything. You are just posting "what you heard" and the person(s) you "heard" it from may or may not have first hand knowledge of the alleged incident.

Lol ok..

 

[RVR SWPR]

Sad

 

[Lavey29]

What Dave has said on here was confirmed to me by another source that is close friends of the owners.

Never said the info was not accurate just not first hand knowledge info. Same as your third hand info you just described.

 

[78Southwind]

I wonder if these pontoons will be on craigslist?

 

[Bigbore500r]

Sad View attachment 805507 View attachment 805508

Are these coming or going?

 

[riverroyal]

its just a remodel. Maybe they are paving the lot?

 

[RVR SWPR]

Looks like going.Incredible contrast to the usual activity.

 

[Bigbore500r]

Boat owners are worried about beach rash when that sucker got dropped off on asphalt at delivery ....

 

[RiverDave]

Never said the info was not accurate just not first hand knowledge info. Same as your third hand info you just described.

Seems a bizarre response for me asking you to stop chasing Steve around rdp.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Seems a bizarre response for me asking you to stop chasing Steve around rdp.

One might even call it bullying.