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Cost to rig new hull?

Nikwho

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Hello all,
I'll try to be specific enough that folks can actually answer my question. I've worked on many of my boats extensively in the past, R&R outdrive, repower, new upholstery, re-wiring, etc. I've built quite a few old cars and have a fair bit of mechanical aptitude.

With that said, I am considering building and rigging a boat myself. Kind of a big project, but I've often bit off more than I should chew in life. I am considering buying a 28' cat hull. It's never been rigged or powered before. I plan to do nearly all work, if not everything myself. I will paint the hull, wire it, install outdrive and engine, etc. I have a line on the hull and trailer.

Goals: My goal is to build a 28' cat as a family lake/river cruiser, with no boat loan or financing. I'd like it to be capable of 70-85 MPH. Planning on installing a single 650-ish HP BBC (496 cu. in.) and Bravo One outdrive. So, pretty basic setup. I'm not familiar with the efficiency of a catamaran style hull, so I am just throwing out a guess, here.

So, here's my question:
Aside from the cost of actual engine, outdrive, upholstery, paint stereo and gauges, what should I expect to pay for parts to wrap this boat up? Keep in mind, I'm thinking more simplistic. I'm no baller, I'm a fireman! The goal is to build a boat that I can be proud of, and pay for as I build it, with no boat loan. I plan to sell my built hot rod '68 GMC to kick start the process.

- Exhaust. Was planing on running an EMI Thunder exhaust for about $2700. Engine will be covered.

- Paint. I figure on about $2,500 in chemicals and consumables. I have paint/body work experience. I've painted a few complete cars, camper shells, a few bikes and one complete boat. Have access to a booth big enough for the hull and have all necessary equipment. 28' cat, I'm thinking about 3-4 gallons of color and a few gallons of clear. That'll be a whole other discussion/post.

- Provisions to mount BBC in hull. Looking to run my Mk. IV BBC.

- Throttle and steering (my Eliminator Eagle had manual rack and pinion steering. I'd prefer hydraulic, but could cut it as my Eliminator with a Bravo Pne has never been a problem for me). I'm thinking upgrade to hydraulic assist after the boat gets wet!

- All other asssociated hardware and accessories. Things like blower fan for engine compartment, perhaps a electric/hydraulic ram for engine hatch, bildge pumps, switches, cleats, grab handles, cup holders, drain plug(s), rub rails and so forth.

- I plan to build my hatch, seat frames and will have an upholstery shop cover them. I will build my seat frames, cut foam and prep for upholstery shop. What might I be looking at for basic upholstery work to cover two buckets and a bench, along with seat risers, and other associated parts and pieces.

Outdrive - I can figure out the cost of an outdrive. I'm curious about other expenses after purchasing the outdrive that I may not be considering.

I am aware that my question is akin to asking "how much is a bag of groceries". I'm just trying to make my best (somewhat educated) guess, then add about $10,000 in stuff that will nickel and dime the project to completion. I want to make sure that it's something that isn't going to be a tremendous waste of time and money.

So, ball park guess on the expense (parts, no labor) to rig a 28' cat hull, less engine, outdrive and trailer?

Just need a reality check to see if I'm grossly off base thinking that after sourcing a hull, trailer, engine, outdrive, upholstery and paint, that I could get the hull water worthy for a reasonable amount of money?

Would it be reasonable to think that I could rig this hull with an additional $10,000-$15,000?

Hopeful to get some opinions from folks that have actually done this. Not just be told by people that bought their boat from a dealer say that it's a waste of time and money.

Whew, okay, sorry for the novel! Let the flaming begin!

Nik
 

DrunkenSailor

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This is going to be fun. Welcome to the boards by the way. Who built the hull? Does it have a center pod or is it a true tunnel? If it is a common hull design this sounds like a doable project and will be awesome to follow along. If it's a one off hull you might run into issues. A few have been built that won't plane or have handling issues and I would hate for you to put money into a project that will never work right. Schiada built a tunnel once...
 

Nikwho

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Sounds like Rex is a knowledgeable fellow, with some very relevant experience in offshore racing. I suppose that he'll probably chime in here at some point. I think that the project is well within my scope. Just want to be realistic about finances required to pull this off! If I'm gonna end up living in this thing after my saint of a wife has had enough of my shenanigans, I want to at least end up with a BA boat!
 

Nikwho

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So, it looks to me as though it has a center pod (second picture in my last post). But, I'll admit, I'm new to tunnel hull/catamaran nomenclature! Except that I've owned a HobieCat sailboat!
 

Gelcoater

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So, it looks to me as though it has a center pod (second picture in my last post). But, I'll admit, I'm new to tunnel hull/catamaran nomenclature! Except that I've owned a HobieCat sailboat!
I’ve never seen one quite like that.
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Looks just like the rounded keel of a 20 sport/Spectra/the hull everyone splashed or had a version of.

Where would you set x dimension on something like this?
Where are the gas tanks?
Could end up a huge kettle of worms.
Not saying it will, but the potential is there, lol.
 

Xring01

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Unless this is a proven hull design...
I wouldnt take the risk...

Because you may waste a whole lot of time, effort and $$$, on something you may not be happy with..

My advice, make sure of the capabilities of this hull, or find a hull thats proven.

Cost estimates?
Thats truly a guessistimate... are you buying everything brand new, or rebuilt, or used?

Thats three different prices on the power plant, and outdrive alone...

Electronics, that can be couple of hundred dollars, or thousands...

Depends on what you want to build..

Create a spread sheet on all the items of the build.. create 3 pricing columns
New Parts -------------- Rebuilt Parts -------------- Used Parts/Great Deals
Engine
Outdrive
Steering
Paint/Gel
Swimstep
Electrical
Lights
Stereo
Electronics
Trailer
Rubrail

etc etc etc

Create you own estimates, and fill in the blanks with the best available data you can find...

Best Case, find a wrecked boat, that gets auctioned off.. One that hasnt sunk and low hours... get most of the parts of it, for this boat.
 
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Rayson1971

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I bought my bare hull brand new from raysoncraft in 2001. No trailer plain white for 12,500. Bought new trailer . Traded stuff here and there put good parts in it and had 30k in it. With price of hull.. so 17500 to rig and trailer it. My guess now more near 25 to 30 k
 

Nikwho

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I bought my bare hull brand new from raysoncraft in 2001. No trailer plain white for 12,500. Bought new trailer . Traded stuff here and there put good parts in it and had 30k in it. With price of hull.. so 17500 to rig and trailer it. My guess now more near 25 to 30 k
Man, that's EXACTLY the kind of answer that I was hopeful for, thank you!!

My engine is built. I will keep some feelers out for a Bravo One outdrive. I had considered trying to source a wrecked boat, but not sure if my time and money would be better spent with looking for good deals on select used parts. I would like most of the deck hardware, steering, cleats and what-not to be new. I want it to feel like a new boat when I'm done, not a pieced together boat. I'm on board if I can get this project wrapped up with a $30,000 budget. I think that will be tough, but I think that it is doable.
 

JBS

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This has the makings of an epic I really fucked up thread:eek:

There is a reason this Hull/Plug is not rigged and running. Speaking of running that is my advice to you :cool:
 

J DUNN

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The only thing I read was, "sell my built hot rod '68 GMC"!

Regarding the boat, go for it, and start with selling the 68'!
 

Gelcoater

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Man, that's EXACTLY the kind of answer that I was hopeful for, thank you!!

My engine is built. I will keep some feelers out for a Bravo One outdrive. I had considered trying to source a wrecked boat, but not sure if my time and money would be better spent with looking for good deals on select used parts. I would like most of the deck hardware, steering, cleats and what-not to be new. I want it to feel like a new boat when I'm done, not a pieced together boat. I'm on board if I can get this project wrapped up with a $30,000 budget. I think that will be tough, but I think that it is doable.
How often do you get out to Cali?
Some of the stuff you could do used (cleats, bezels, stainless rails, etc,) and clean up pretty easy.
Eliminator has a few boxes of various gauges that are now “obsolete” with Mercury’s modern digital plug and play ways.
They’d probably let some go pretty cheap.
If you’re handy I’d suspect you could do this relatively easily, as far as obtaining parts, rigging it up, etc.

My biggest worry for you would be not knowing anything about this hull design.
You could end up with something very bad ass.
You may end up having polished a turd.

I’d want to ride in one before pulling the trigger.
And, it brings pain to think you’re selling off a hot car to do it, lol.
Best of luck.
 

Nikwho

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Pretty often, to visit family. It's been a while since I've been to the Eliminator shop! I was just right down the road from there last week, heading home from San Diego. Too bad I didn't have this discussion on here a couple of weeks ago!
 

Nikwho

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Huh, that interesting. Well, projects such as this certainly aren't for everyone. Still weighing whether it's for me. I have built cars that others wouldn't consider taking on. The guy that laid it up seems to have a fair bit of experience & from the looks of it has produced some really nice hulls. I think that he primarily lays up GN 20' hulls. Not very related hulls, but seems to do some nice work.

Im not sure that he and I are on the same page yet, price wise, but if we can get on the same page, it could be a fun build!
 

DrunkenSailor

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upload_2019-1-9_16-43-50.png


Here's a Teague XR drive for you that a guy is selling on RW on Facebook.

I was really curious about this hull and did a lot of internet searching to try and find a similar bottom design to what this boat has. I thought it was unique in an industry where there is a lot of sharing going on. Hawaiian/Warlock both had similar aspects to the back of the tunnel (chines on the centerpod, shape of the centerpod). The freeboard is much higher, the centerpod is smaller, and the tunnel is a lot shallower on the Rexcraft though and the twin vented steps along with the large step at the rear adds another unique component.

The front of the tunnel is interesting as well as it appears in the pictures that I have seen to shallow up pretty quickly like an HTM. Again just the depth of the tunnel is similar the freeboard is much higher on the rexcraft and the bottom is shaped completely different. The plus is lots of room under the bow or room for an open bow conversion, the minus may be that the cg is moved forward and not a ton of room to pack air.

I would be curious to see where the CG on this boat is without a motor vs with. Could be a really fun and interesting project, but like others have said, its one I would take on with eyes open. There is going to be a ton of trial and error here with things that are not easily changed. Gas tank position, Motor position, Drive location, etc... If the steps are in the wrong spots that's a whole load of bs. That's not even getting into the usual set up issues like prop selection, drive spacers, battery location, etc... All that said there are a few folks on this board who could tackle a project like this in their garage and probably come out with a pretty bitchen boat. I am not that guy. If you think you are I will be following the build thread with great interest.
 

Nikwho

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Thank you for the thoughtful response! And lead on the outdrive. I agree with everything that you said. Lots of concerns. I was concerned with at what speed this hull would start packing air. I'm also concerned with the x dimension, as well as all other unknown factors involved. I feel like it would likely be a high payout risk to take. My personal thoughts were to make it a walkthru hull for additional seating. Though, that could cause even more issues. I aim to at least take a trip down, check the hull out and put some more thought and research into the feasibility of the project. I know that Rex hasn't been super responsive in his classified ad, but when I spoke to him on the phone, he was a very pleasant guy to talk to, that sounded very knowledgeable!
 

HydroSkreamin

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First off, I'd like to commend you for putting your thoughts out there and dipping your toes in the water before diving in. We can all appreciate where you're coming from, and many of us have had similar thoughts.

Your performance goal of 70-85 is probably achievable, but one thing that everyone is telling you is the unknown factor of this hull. Many air entrapment hulls have a "hop zone" that is overcome with HP or hydrodynamic lift or "support" from a center pod. This really shows up when the sponsons are not wide enough to carry the load, and there's not enough air to help carry the load either. Most hulls that do this have the hop from about 70-90, sometimes higher. If you don't have the HP to power through it, you are stuck operating in the hop zone. I'm not at all saying this hull will do that, but as others have suggested, I'd want a ride in a similarly rigged boat. You are already going out on a limb with rigging one for the first time, I don't think you want to be doing hull development too.

The other thing I would check into is how insurable this piece would be when you are done. With no known background or history, this may be a deal breaker. I'd definitely investigate the availability and cost.

I think you are off by 50% on your paint materials; when HeadlessHula painted his 20' Baja, it was $4500 or thereabouts in materials, although they were modern metallic which I'm sure charge a premium. Also, I think even if you build seat frames, you'll still have $4-$6k in interior (I speak from recent experience). If you can do what Gelcoater suggested and get hardware/gauges/controls that aren't super current but in good shape and functional, I'd do it, as all this stuff will nickel and dime you to death. Fuse panels, fans, wiring, stereo, lighting all adds up.

One of the sources I used for some things like handles, cleats, etc. is https://www.greatlakesskipper.com/ . It's basically a closeout wholesaler, you have to do some digging to find exactly what you want, but I am pleased with all of my purchases from there. Amazon was my friend as well, but you can spend hours researching and pricing everything.

I'd probably look for a bare hull whose performance is known and refurb it exactly the way you like it. At least then you can compare notes and ask for advice on things like X-dimension and CG.

Good luck to you, I hope you can wrap your head around this.
 

Nikwho

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Thank you all for your input! It's a tough call. Could be a fruitful reward, taking this challenge on. Could be a big waste of money! Might be best not to take this gamble...
 

DrunkenSailor

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Thank you all for your input! It's a tough call. Could be a fruitful reward, taking this challenge on. Could be a big waste of money! Might be best not to take this gamble...
I was tempted by the project when he first listed it. Still interested but I don't have the cash right now to start a project like this. I really hope someone does and shares the build thread. Stick around this is a good group of people.
 

Nikwho

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I was tempted by the project when he first listed it. Still interested but I don't have the cash right now to start a project like this. I really hope someone does and shares the build thread. Stick around this is a good group of people.
I'm not saying that there is NO chance of me taking this project on. It's just a big decision. Wish there was more of these hulls out there running around. Or more info on this hull. Thanks for your help!
 
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