Employer requiring the jab...

[regor]

Anyone can look at both pieces of info and come to their own conclusion.

Happy to disagree with what I've put forward without being disagreeable.

Does that screen gab have a link I can go read seems like its loaded with " Could and maybe"

Just did a basic search if there was a coronavirus virus vaccine.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Ive got to stand up in front of a 75/25 audience that wants me to mandate the vax as does our owner- were an older group and more at risk than many so it went that way.

Im not doing it- I'm under tremendous heat from my exec staff over this.

I dont see on my own, or have a damm thing from this place I can sell to the guys opposing me though.

 

[snowhammer]

Ive got to stand up in front of a 75/25 audience that wants me to mandate the vax as does our owner- were an older group and more at risk than many so it went that way.

Im not doing it- I'm under tremendous heat from my exec staff over this.

I dont see on my own, or have a damm thing from this place I can sell to the guys opposing me though.

After twelve pages of debating data and efficacy, it comes down to a personal moral choice. The way I view it.

I do respect your decision and I feel for you when pressured. I also respect the way you dig up and dissect information.

 

[regor]

Ive got to stand up in front of a 75/25 audience that wants me to mandate the vax as does our owner- were an older group and more at risk than many so it went that way.

Im not doing it- I'm under tremendous heat from my exec staff over this.

I dont see on my own, or have a damm thing from this place I can sell to the guys opposing me though.

You said this is your company?

 

[Uncle Dave]

After twelve pages of debating data and efficacy, it comes down to a personal moral choice. The way I view it.

I do respect your decision and I feel for you when pressured. I also respect the way you dig up and dissect information.

Thanks.

Ive been standing on personal and moral choice, freedom, America.....

My company is highly engineering based and these guys want science.

You said this is your company?

Is it my company-? IS that the question, no Im the CEO of a 200 person company. I have two bosses the owner and his wife.

Ive declined to make the vax mandatory and the owner let my call stand - for now.

 

[Tom Slick]

Yes but some of those would possibly have gotten it regardless. I just don't believe it would have been as prevelant as it was.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

Agreed

 

[Tom Slick]

Well Slick, if you've paid attention, as an employer I'm fighting mandatory participation even though I decided to vax.

I believe people should be free to choose and I support all my employees decisions.



Do you have to make a stand for anything other than yourself?

I'm not sure what you mean by "Do you have to make a stand for anything other than yourself?" I am personally not effected by the vaccine and mandates, as I'm self-employed. I am however taking a stand for my wife, here co-workers and any other citizen that is being directly effected by employer mandates. My wife is an RN at Idaho's largest employer and they along with the other two major healthcare providers in the state have made the vaccine mandate to all employees and outside vendors that do business with them that they need to be vaccinated by September, or they will be fired. Idaho's governor (who by they way passed a bill so that state employees are not mandated), our GOP and DEMS all refuse to get involved and have stated that they will not get involved. Idaho's state legislature has officially left the private sector to sort it out for itself. Idaho already suffers from not enough healthcare workers and now upwards of 30% of the currently employed healthcare works will be terminated. And with the now extraordinarily high cost of living and housing in the state, it will be very difficult to restaff the hospitals.

 

[regor]

Is it my company-? IS that the question, no Im the CEO of a 200 person company. I have two bosses the owner and his wife.

Ive declined to make the vax mandatory and the owner let my call stand - for now.

Gotcha, it’s very simple then. Do as the owners request or move on.

You have only yourself to reason with. Not an ideal situation with your beliefs Dave, but sometimes you have to do what you have to do.

 

[Tom Slick]

AGAIN....WATCH THIS VIDEO. It answers all of the questions that you guys continue to argue about. WATCH IT!

 

[Uncle Dave]

I'm not sure what you mean by "Do you have to make a stand for anything other than yourself?" I am personally not effected by the vaccine and mandates, as I'm self-employed. I am however taking a stand for my wife, here co-workers and any other citizen that is being directly effected by employer mandates. My wife is an RN at Idaho's largest employer and they along with the other two major healthcare providers in the state have made the vaccine mandate to all employees and outside vendors that do business with them that they need to be vaccinated by September, or they will be fired. Idaho's governor (who by they way passed a bill so that state employees are not mandated), our GOP and DEMS all refuse to get involved and have stated that they will not get involved. Idaho's state legislature has officially left the private sector to sort it out for itself. Idaho already suffers from not enough healthcare workers and now upwards of 30% of the currently employed healthcare works will be terminated. And with the now extraordinarily high cost of living and housing in the state, it will be very difficult to restaff the hospitals.

My question should have asked if are you an employer or employee, and if an employer how many people.

Im opposed to the mandate, we did just fine being careful without a mandate.

If I mandate it I will lose of my best and brightest engineers, but they aren't the majority.
I like all my poeple even though we may not see eye to eye on everything.

I just dont see the need as we had no outbreaks internally -
We did have people get it outside the office and have lots of hospitilizations, one guy will never recover, and a few deaths.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Gotcha, it’s very simple then. Do as the owners request or move on.

You have only yourself to reason with. Not an ideal situation with your beliefs Dave, but sometimes you have to do what you have to do.

Sometimes you have to make some kind of a stand if you have any balls at all.

I am for now.

My balls are getting beat better than than a 1000 an hour dominatrix.

 

[Tom Slick]

My question should have asked if are you an employer or employee, and if an employer how many people.

Im opposed to the mandate, we did just fine being careful without a mandate.

If I mandate it I will lose of my best and brightest engineers, but they aren't the majority.
I like all my poeple even though we may not see eye to eye on everything.

I just dont see the need as we had no outbreaks internally -
We did have people get it outside the office and have lots of hospitilizations, one guy will never recover, and a few deaths.

Please watch the video that I posted above. The information may be of great help to you and the decisions that you are faced with at your company. My opinion is just that, my opinion. I believe that injecting anything into ones body should be that persons choice. I don't think that there is a company on earth that should have any right to tell a citizen what they need to put into their body in order to maintain employment.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Please watch the video that I posted above. The information may be of great help to you and the decisions that you are faced with at your company. My opinion is just that, my opinion. I believe that injecting anything into ones body should be that persons choice. I don't think that there is a company on earth that should have any right to tell a citizen what they need to put into their body in order to maintain employment.

I checked it ou a bit earlier for just a while. Ill try to watch the whole thing tonight.
I sympathize with what Ammon Bundy went though and dislike gov. Add Randy Weaver to that.

At my place the tech companies hold more clout than does government.

 

[spectra3279]

See column 3 under " type" this is from the wiki link. The only " New" vaccines are the MRNA - the others work just like they always have.

It took a long time to isolate the virus and decode enough of it to make it work - it was easier and quicker to use an old school technique than push new technology forward so the MRNA stuff was later to market.



View attachment 1026516

Actually I thought the mrna vaccines were the first to market here in the USA. The j&j came a few months after.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

 

[Uncle Dave]

Actually I thought the mrna vaccines were the first to market here in the USA. The j&j came a few months after.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

Sputnik was first globally.

The Russians beat US, hard as that is to type.


Govermnent "attention" vs industry score one for the commies. UGH!!

..BUT the tech is old and efficacy is 2nd rate.

 

[spectra3279]

Sputnik was first globally.

The Russians beat US, hard as that is to type.


Govermnent "attention" vs industry score one for the commies. UGH!!

But again the mrna was first here.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

 

[Uncle Dave]

But again the mrna was first here.

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yes but depends

- is an MRNA Vaccine a real Vaccine or not?

or was the johnson and johnson viral vector vaccine the first because its " real"?

Or are none real, or are someones real?

 

[spectra3279]

yes but depends

- is an MRNA Vaccine a real Vaccine or not?

or was the johnson and johnson viral vector vaccine the first because its " real"?

Or are none real, or are someones real?

Have not researched the j&j enough yet. But no, I do not qualify the mrna as a real vaccine as it only mitigates symptoms, does not stop from catching or spreading.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

 

[perky]

yes but depends

- is an MRNA Vaccine a real Vaccine or not?

or was the johnson and johnson viral vector vaccine the first because its " real"?

Or are none real, or are someones real?

Listen for christs sake people can't quite their jobs. You can just make it clear that you do not agree with the decision but ultimately it's the owners decision. You just have the poor job of being the messenger. I have never seen anything like this being pushed so hard. WHY ! People should make their own choice . Why this forcing it on people. Door to door ? GET the fuck outta here. You wanna get the shot ? Fuck do I care, get 2. You want me to get the shot ? Fuck do you care ? Get out of here. edit: I am 63. When I was a kid doctors used to say getting sick was vital to building a strong immune system. They would be better off finding a vaccine for food then their wouldn't be so many fat fuckers around !

 

[Andy B.]

You’re playing their word semantics as there is no such thing as a “vaccine” for a coronavirus, you know that I know that. When the general public hears the word vaccine, it’s implied that it will cure it and although that’s not the true definition of a vaccine, that’s the perception of our country. So if you want to start calling it a flu shot, then maybe you will get people that would actually respect and feel that you’re being honest, because calling it a vaccine, you’re not

Maybe he'll acknowledge you but I doubt it people can't handle the truth to bad really.

"You can't handle the truth" what movies that from?

How can someone claim vax for coronavirus isn't a real vaccine - but claim other vaccines made the same way for other diseases are?

Im totally cool with whatever you want to do Andy. Nobody has answered this very simple question.

Because the answer is they are both real.

REALLY!! Give it a rest the polio vaccine actually prevents you from getting it for example ,they are nor the same go back to 8th grade science jezus!!!

 

[Uncle Dave]

Maybe he'll acknowledge you but I doubt it people can't handle the truth to bad really.

"You can't handle the truth" what movies that from?

REALLY!! Give it a rest the polio vaccine actually prevents you from getting it for example ,they are nor the same go back to 8th grade science jezus!!!

I answered him in post 553. In the meantime lets look at the definition

Definition of VACCINE

a preparation that is administered (as by injection) to stimulate the body's immune response against a specific infectious agent or disease: such as… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

There is no efficacy implied in Merriams defintion AND it includes MRNA Vax


Your argument is one of efficacy.

Efficacy and authenticity are two different arguments.

Even with 2 doses the polio Vax is only 90% effective, it take 3-4 to get to 100% and there is no guarantee how long it will last

Polio Vaccine Effectiveness and Duration of Protection | CDC

Information about the effectiveness of the polio vaccine and how long it provides immunity against poliovirus.

www.cdc.gov

yeah yeah we dont trust the CDC.....

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Your argument is one of efficacy.

Efficacy and authenticity are two different arguments.

Even with 4 doses the polio vax isnt 100% either.

But we don’t need polio boosters every 6 months either.

And it is not called an annual flu vaccine. This was socialized and sold as a covid “vaccine” to get people to get the shot.

It’s looking like the flu is gonna kill around as many people as Covid going forward... why none of the theatrics for the flu ever before?

 

[Uncle Dave]

But we don’t need polio boosters every 6 months either.

And it is not called an annual flu vaccine. This was socialized and sold as a covid “vaccine” to get people to get the shot.

Annual no, but you may need a boost to travel.

Even if you were fully vaxxed as a kid - You need a booster if you travel to areas it is prominent.

Polio: For Travelers

Check if you need a polio booster shot to travel.

www.cdc.gov

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Annual no, but you may need a boost to travel.

Even if you were fully vaxxed as a kid - You need a booster if you travel to areas it is prominent.

Polio: For Travelers

Check if you need a polio booster shot to travel.

www.cdc.gov

Agreed, and not a “Vaccine” either. But a lot closer to one than the Bi-annual Covid jab.

 

[Uncle Dave]

It’s looking like the flu is gonna kill around as many people as Covid going forward... why none of the theatrics for the flu ever before?

Im not sure that true, but Im open to it, but the two aren't identical in hospitalization rates for certain.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Agreed, and not a “Vaccine” either. But a lot closer to one than the Bi-annual Covid jab.

It went through at least two revision with the inactivated version being better than the first and a horrible case of poor manufacturing that lead to lots of deaths.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Im not sure that true, but Im open to it, but the two aren't identical in hospitalization rates for certain.

It remains to be seen. But if we don’t see any more huge spikes in cases and deaths, the trending is in the ballpark. I will grant you the hospitalization rates are different. Just like the flu.. if you are at risk go get the shot. That’s it, move on.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

It went through at least two revision with the attenuated version being better than the first and a horrible case of poor manufacturing that lead to lots of deaths.

Now you know why half the country does not want covid shot 1.0...

 

[Uncle Dave]

Now you know why half the country does not want covid shot 1.0...

I totally get it, always have.

Ive had two friends with horrible vaccine problems they get labeled as nutcases for bringing it up, and Im called a nutcase for fronting their stories, its maddening.

I realize Im taking a risk, but I personally take bigger one with covid.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

I totally get it, always have.

Ive had two friends with horrible vaccine problems they get labeled as nutcases for bringing it up, and Im called a nutcase for fronting their stories, its maddening.

I realize Im taking a risk, but I personally take bigger one with covid.

I get it. I agree there is less risk overall with the vaccine.

 

[perky]

What I don't get is the government gave immunity from prosecution to vaccine producers. That's got nothing to do with employers. Company mandates, something goes wrong, you wanna be the one responsible for making other peoples medical decisions. I sure as shit wouldn't wanna be the one that told them they had too if I was company owner . Get it or get fired ? That's gotta be hitting a court room real fast.

 

[Andy B.]

I answered him in post 553. In the meantime lets look at the definition

Definition of VACCINE

a preparation that is administered (as by injection) to stimulate the body's immune response against a specific infectious agent or disease: such as… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

There is no efficacy implied in Merriams defintion AND it includes MRNA Vax


Your argument is one of efficacy.

Efficacy and authenticity are two different arguments.

Even with 2 doses the polio Vax is only 90% effective, it take 3-4 to get to 100% and there is no guarantee how long it will last

Polio Vaccine Effectiveness and Duration of Protection | CDC

Information about the effectiveness of the polio vaccine and how long it provides immunity against poliovirus.

www.cdc.gov

yeah yeah we dont trust the CDC.....

Well the polio vaccine came way before the cdc was even a thought and I'm good 56 years later with a real vaccine.

You keep pulling shit from the cdc website get a clue talk about misinformation wtf you just don't get it, you voted for Biden didn't you? And anyone that did and think he's competent probably believes in rainbows and unicorns!! Get off that website if you want any truth!!!

 

[Andy B.]

Well the polio vaccine came way before the cdc was even a thought and I'm good 56 years later with a real vaccine.

You keep pulling shit from the cdc website get a clue talk about misinformation wtf you just don't get it, you voted for Biden didn't you? And anyone that did and think he's competent probably believes in rainbows and unicorns!! Get off that website if you want any truth!!!

I just looked it up 1946 for cdc 1955 for polio I was wrong on both counts! The cdc is just a propaganda machine now I stand by my Biden comments.

 

[Andy B.]

I will eat my words but the current cdc is a propaganda machine for the democratic party no better than CNN.

 

[Uncle Dave]

I just looked it up 1946 for cdc 1955 for polio I was wrong on both counts! The cdc is just a propaganda machine now I stand by my Biden comments.

Biden? Now thems fightin words. Guy cant string together a 5 word sentence. Nope.

Although we historically agree far more than we disagree, you've given me nothing here I can take forward with any credibility.

I suppose Miriam Webster is also a propaganda machine that has it wrong too?
Or basically anything that disagrees with you is wrong and any lone doctor or tiny fringe group that may agree with you is right.

 

[Uncle Dave]

I get one opportunity a quarter to stand up in front of a group and make a logical case mandatory vax shouldn't be implemented.

what one string of posts from which inmate holds the most water - you guys tell me who makes the best case?

 

[sprintcvx]

I get one opportunity a quarter to stand up in front of a group and make a logical case mandatory vax shouldn't be implemented.

what one string of posts from which inmate holds the most water - you guys tell me who makes the best case?

I don't envy your situation. Good luck with your decision

 

[Tom Slick]

I get one opportunity a quarter to stand up in front of a group and make a logical case mandatory vax shouldn't be implemented.

what one string of posts from which inmate holds the most water - you guys tell me who makes the best case?

Watch the video I posted. It makes the best case.

 

[Tom Slick]

And here’s another:

 

[Uncle Dave]

AGAIN....WATCH THIS VIDEO. It answers all of the questions that you guys continue to argue about. WATCH IT!

Thanks for this Tom. I watched the whole thing and found it interesting, and it points out some of the things we should all be concerned about.

I think it has some truths, a mix of good and questionable sources for its information, and some untruths.

Things it highlights that I've always had a hard time resolving and are still questionable like, how covid deaths and cases are counted, where the mortality is high and what co factors are associated with those.What happened in our nursing homes. We should all take note of these and pay attention. Another thing to consider with infection and death rates is there are also a number of untested infected people and unattributed deaths.

Some of the preso, and the way source material is referenced but not attributed to the specific quotes are questionable like - should we seriously rely on an opinion poll from the japan times- who translated that? How about journeyman pictures, the NY times, and the USA today?
(Typical RD fashion is that when anything supports you position its gospel but when it doesn't its " propaganda")
Which quotes are attributed to which sources? There is no numeric link on the quote to match the source, this is not how doctors normally quote sources because any kind of follow up or factchecking becomes another research project.

At the same time it also has in it some untruths that are very easily checked.
One would be that viral vector vaccines have never been use in humans prior.
The Ebola vaccine and the Zika vaccine are both viral vector type vaccines.

I appreciate you putting forth the link for us to look at.

Ive put up thumbnails if anyone want to look at some of the slides I'm referencing.

 

[94Nautique]

“To get on campus, you’ll need proof of vaccination.
If you’re vaccinated, you’ll get a yellow wristband.
If you aren’t vaccinated, you’ll have to wear a mask.
It discrimination, but I’m ok with it.”

- client conversation yesterday


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Ask what mark the brown shirts will need above their door.

it’s coming

 

[Uncle Dave]

And here’s another:

Dr. Cole had promise as a great source of information early on, but he hurts his own case in a group of his peers.
He has a habit of presenting half truths.

If he would have claimed the early study on Ivermectin looks good, and left it at that - he could make a defensible credible statement.

But instead he claimed that Ivermectin kills Coronavirus 99.9% of the time in Petri dish studies. On its face standalone from any other detail- that part's true.

What he left out was that was at a concentration 100X any recommended dosage of the drug, and that at the recommended dosages for human it comes nowhere near the effectiveness claims.

Getting a chuckle out of otherwise healthy 75 years olds dying is unnecessary, borderline on douchbaggery.

 

[530RL]

Dr. Cole had promise as a great source of information early on, but he hurts his own case in a group of his peers.
He has a habit of presenting half truths.

If he would have claimed the early study on Ivermectin looks good, and left it at that - he could make a defensible credible statement.

But instead he claimed that Ivermectin kills Coronavirus 99.9% of the time in Petri dish studies. On its face standalone from any other detail- that part's true.

What he left out was that was at a concentration 100X any recommended dosage of the drug, and that at the recommended dosages for human it comes nowhere near the effectiveness claims.

Getting a chuckle out of otherwise healthy 75 years olds dying is unnecessary, borderline on douchbaggery.

You know what else kills Coronavirus in a petri-dish?

Clorox.

Now if someone was just smart enough to suggest we inject Clorox?

 

[was thatguy]

You know what else kills Coronavirus in a petri-dish?

Clorox.

Now if someone was just smart enough to suggest we inject Clorox?

I realize it’s the weekend and all...but do you really think it’s wise to be totally shitfaced by noon?

 

[River Dirt 2]

Yup, I’m thinking the J & J jab with no liability is a great idea……what could go wrong?

Johnson & Johnson weighing bankruptcy plan as it considers offloading baby powder liabilities: report

Retailer Johnson & Johnson is reportedly considering spinning off liabilities from its Baby Powder unit due ongoing litigation, with plans to seek bankruptcy protection for that new business.

www.foxbusiness.com

 

[HTTP404]

You know what else kills Coronavirus in a petri-dish?

Clorox.

Now if someone was just smart enough to suggest we inject Clorox?

Ho Ho! You make funny Trump joke, How you think such hilarity.

 

[rmarion]

Or Maybe be proactive... for the best of all the employees....
Offer two choices....
A. Vax
B. Home health kit

 

[rmarion]

 

[rmarion]

 

[rmarion]