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Future lay of the land... and people

Tooms22

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Mods, hopefully this can stay here. It's more related to home prices/availability, jobs, and spread of people away from cities.

I've seen a bunch of threads of Havasu getting crowded and people moving out of cities to smaller towns. It's driving up prices and apparently causing traffic and accidents.

So what do you think will happen in 1-2 years, once Covid is long gone:

- Home prices, will they drop as people settle in and potentially some economic shake up?
- Jobs, will people move back to cities for jobs because companies won't be forced to offer work from home?
- Will people continue to leave cities and spread across the US? Or when nightlife, shopping, and other entertainment open back up, will people migrate back to the hubs (cities) because that's what they like to do?

I think some people are incapable of remote and some people are also into the nightlife, shopping, and other entertainment. I think we'll at least see a moderate flip in migration back to cities. But I also think people have short memories. Those who moved because of Covid, will move back when they forget about it.
 

PlanB

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During the last boom, Havasu exploded and then retracted after the collapse. I think it all depends on how long the economy holds out. If the economy takes a big hit, you will see some people leaving Havasu again because it will be harder to make money out there. You will still see retirees moving in, but some of the people that have overleveraged to buy a vacation house will walk.
 

RiverDave

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I don’t think anyone is moving because of “covid” they are moving because of the leftist that got drunk with power and showed their hand in response to covid..

To put it plainly I have never met anyone that moved to a smaller place and said “I want to go back”. I know people that were forced to go back but not wanting too.

when covid is gone (if covid is ever gone) the problem still remains
 

Ace in the Hole

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Remote working isn't going away...I wouldn't want to be deep into a commercial office RE portfolio right now.

I think people will continue to spread out..more due to costs, and taxes more than anything else.

Housing will depend 100% on what the depends spokesman and kneepad saleswoman choose to do on some things. If interest rates change, prices will drop..they are directly tied.
 

Tooms22

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I don’t think anyone is moving because of “covid” they are moving because of the leftist that got drunk with power and showed their hand in response to covid..

To put it plainly I have never met anyone that moved to a smaller place and said “I want to go back”. I know people that were forced to go back but not wanting too.

when covid is gone (if covid is ever gone) the problem still remains
They must not be that bothered by the leftist politics... why are AZ and TX getting more and more blue?

Remote working isn't going away...I wouldn't want to be deep into a commercial office RE portfolio right now.

I think people will continue to spread out..more due to costs, and taxes more than anything else.

Housing will depend 100% on what the depends spokesman and kneepad saleswoman choose to do on some things. If interest rates change, prices will drop..they are directly tied.
In Socal, commercial office space deals are still happening but a semi slower rate. It is still yet to be seen what post covid commercial space demand looks like.

My wife is fairly aware of that market along with industrial and development in general.
 

Bobby V

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They must not be that bothered by the leftist politics... why are AZ and TX getting more and more blue?
In Socal, commercial office space deals are still happening but a semi slower rate. It is still yet to be seen what post covid commercial space demand looks like.

My wife is fairly aware of that market along with industrial and development in general.
Yep. We do a lot of T.I's in DTLA, Century City and the OC. Still bidding a bunch of new tenants and spec suites. Industrial hasn't seemed to slow down either.
 

Riverbound

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In my opinion. Working remote is here to stay for a while. Even with the loss of productivity the overhead costs can be cut substantially not having to lease a building, utilities, etc.

Commercial office RE is going to be in trouble. But would be a great investment if you can hold it for a while.

Retail is always volatile, but it will take a lot to overcome the convenience of online shopping. I try to avoid Amazon but in many cases they have it in stock and I can get it delivered more convenient and faster than me having to head to a retail location, wait in line, mask up and then most likely not even have the item I need. Don’t even get me started on the attitudes of “essential” retail workers. They are securing their own downfall.

With the mass exodus of people leaving Ca to go to other states. I’m hunkering down here. I have been looking for Havasu homes for a while and have lost interest as the money is better spent upgrading my home here and moving closer to the beach. The Havasu market is growing bubble and it baffles me the money people are justifying for a city with no economy to support the pricing.


I don’t think we have even begun to see the financial fall out from all If this yet. I’m watching people spend like the faucet isn’t ever going to shut off. Financing toys and depleting reserves. 🤦‍♂️

I’m in construction and you swear they are all lottery winners right now. Every where you look someone is buying new vacation homes, new boats, cars, etc. like it’s never going to end.
 

Ladsm

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I don’t think anyone is moving because of “covid” they are moving because of the leftist that got drunk with power and showed their hand in response to covid..

To put it plainly I have never met anyone that moved to a smaller place and said “I want to go back”. I know people that were forced to go back but not wanting too.

when covid is gone (if covid is ever gone) the problem still remains
This is dead on. Even with the vaccine coming out it only good for 6 months and you have to start again and you still get covid but you just dont get as sick. Cvid social distancing will be a norm for years.
 

Riverbound

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They must not be that bothered by the leftist politics... why are AZ and TX getting more and more blue?

Exactly.....the pendulum in CA will start to swing the other way before these areas. Already seeing the shift in politics and demographics.
 

monkeyswrench

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I’m in construction and you swear they are all lottery winners right now. Every where you look someone is buying new vacation homes, new boats, cars, etc. like it’s never going to end.
Your last paragraph is what I'm seeing here in central Az as well. Scary, and a repeat of times not long ago. I know, I was one of those very same dumbasses. I remember, but some guys my own age seem to have forgotten.
 

gqchris

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In my opinion. Working remote is here to stay for a while. Even with the loss of productivity the overhead costs can be cut substantially not having to lease a building, utilities, etc.

Commercial office RE is going to be in trouble. But would be a great investment if you can hold it for a while.

Retail is always volatile, but it will take a lot to overcome the convenience of online shopping. I try to avoid Amazon but in many cases they have it in stock and I can get it delivered more convenient and faster than me having to head to a retail location, wait in line, mask up and then most likely not even have the item I need. Don’t even get me started on the attitudes of “essential” retail workers. They are securing their own downfall.

With the mass exodus of people leaving Ca to go to other states. I’m hunkering down here. I have been looking for Havasu homes for a while and have lost interest as the money is better spent upgrading my home here and moving closer to the beach. The Havasu market is growing bubble and it baffles me the money people are justifying for a city with no economy to support the pricing.


I don’t think we have even begun to see the financial fall out from all If this yet. I’m watching people spend like the faucet isn’t ever going to shut off. Financing toys and depleting reserves. 🤦‍♂️

I’m in construction and you swear they are all lottery winners right now. Every where you look someone is buying new vacation homes, new boats, cars, etc. like it’s never going to end.

I agree, I keep watching young real estate agents in the Havasu area on Social Media acting like they are the Kardashians! Living the high life, new cars, new boats, Birken bags, you name it!. Bragging about their yearly totals. I'm just shaking my head, because as much as I love Havasu, it ain't gonna stay this "hot" forever Its still a desert city outside of good ol Needles. LOL Yes, Old people love the place, I love to visit.

Maybe I am wrong I ill miss the boat. Last time I was out there I felt like I was in little cali. The traffic was crap and crowded mroe than I ever seen in my life. Maybe I am already old and grumpy and need to move out to the middle of nowhere:)
 

LargeOrangeFont

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No one is going back to an office. We are at least another year away from large firms even opening campuses back up. Frankly the ones that want to go back are in the minority.

Firms are already realizing they they can find cheaper talent elsewhere if no one is going into the office.

People are moving because now that they have been forced to stay in their houses they realize they don't like their house, their neighborhood or the value they get for the money spent all that much.
 

HTMike

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I know so many that have financed themselves to the gills only to find out their jobs are going to be severed. I'm near Chicago and its going to get UGLY. REAL UGLY. Were in the part of the tsunami wave where it goes out for 20 miles and everyone is laugh and playing on the beach.
 

Riverbound

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I agree, I keep watching young real estate agents in the Havasu area on Social Media acting like they are the Kardashians! Living the high life, new cars, new boats, Birken bags, you name it!. Bragging about their yearly totals. I'm just shaking my head, because as much as I love Havasu, it ain't gonna stay this "hot" forever Its still a desert city outside of good ol Needles. LOL Yes, Old people love the place, I love to visit.

Maybe I am wrong I ill miss the boat. Last time I was out there I felt like I was in little cali. The traffic was crap and crowded mroe than I ever seen in my life. Maybe I am already old and grumpy and need to move out to the middle of nowhere:)

Big fish in a small pond.....once food gets scarce shit will get real.
 

Ace in the Hole

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I’m in construction and you swear they are all lottery winners right now. Every where you look someone is buying new vacation homes, new boats, cars, etc. like it’s never going to end.
Same field, and I agree with you for the most part.....however a lot of people are sitting on cash they would otherwise be doing things with and as such they are buying boats/cars/second homes remodels etc with that cash. Ive probably done more cash solar deals this year than financed....previous years I'd maybe do 10% cash if I was lucky... Markets are bubbled and people know it.
 

wash11

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As someone who lives pretty remote- I can give you a peek into it since covid hit.
Land prices around us are going up fast. So much that we likely couldn't afford to buy here again if we were starting over. What used to be 25k 5 years ago is now 80-130k.

People are spending real money on projects, large stick built homes, nice shops, fenced garden areas and livestock infrastructure. Real money like 350-450k and up on top of the property price. A 40 acre property with an older 2 bedroom mobile and nothing special about it just sold for $350k. One guy has several million tied up in a compound just a couple miles from us. The simple "homestead" idea is getting priced out.

I know of four RDP members that now own property within a 30 mile radius of us. Thankfully, these are the types of like minded people coming in for the most part. For now.

Working remote is how this is being accomplished for working couples. It's also killing our internet speeds and beating up our community maintained roads. If this keeps up, there will be some infrastructure issues that need to be addressed. I swear, if one more person sets up shop on this Verizon network, my Pornhub premium days are over.

These same people are paying anything contractors bid, they are just happy to have someone show up. They are also paying retail and then some for equipment. Try to find a reasonably priced backhoe in the area.................. The way they are lighting $100 bills on fire, you'd think the entire country won the lottery.

Point being, there's some people that are real serious about "getting out" and spending so they don't have the option to ever go back.
 

Havasu blue label

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They didn’t move cause of COVID-19 the moved out of California sold there home made cash overpaid in havasu then reality sets in we own 3 doors in havasu bought in 1999 2000 2003 and a condo 2019 it went up 60 grand good luck on the recent purchase be smart
 

HB2Havasu

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I agree, I keep watching young real estate agents in the Havasu area on Social Media acting like they are the Kardashians! Living the high life, new cars, new boats, Birken bags, you name it!. Bragging about their yearly totals. I'm just shaking my head, because as much as I love Havasu, it ain't gonna stay this "hot" forever Its still a desert city outside of good ol Needles. LOL Yes, Old people love the place, I love to visit.

Maybe I am wrong I ill miss the boat. Last time I was out there I felt like I was in little cali. The traffic was crap and crowded mroe than I ever seen in my life. Maybe I am already old and grumpy and need to move out to the middle of nowhere:)
You are correct. I believe what your seeing is a combination of growth caused by the Commiefornia Evacuation and people who already owned vacation homes in Havasu now are working remotely from there. It would be even worse but the Snowbird population appears to be down with Covid and the Canadian Border closures.

I don’t think that many people are ever going back to their offices if they are still currently working remotely. Many companies have permanently closed offices. It was bound to happen eventually with technology advances. Covid just seemed to create a Hyper Leap
 

OldSchoolBoats

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People also need to realize there are people with money and lots of it.

There is someone making more than you and you make more than another.

It’s just what you do with yours.
Nailed it!!

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RodnJen

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A couple of thoughts. People tend to leave CA for a simpler life, quiet living, more land etc. That is nothing new although we are seeing it in record numbers. Whenever there is an asset bubble, people start moving. If in 2010 you had a solid piece of real estate in CA (maybe multiple) and you had good footing in the stock market, you have lots of choices now. Are some moving due to politics, yes.

One thing to remember, every time someone moves out there has been multiple people ready to buy, even in the city. How did those buyers make their money, don't know, but they are spending it.

There have been four homes sell on my street in the last year that all sold to young families. This is not entry level housing. The only thing that is consistent among them is that none of them seem to load up a work truck or put on a suit and go to work, like many of us have. I don't know what they do for a living but they spend a lot of time doing it from home and they spend lots of time with their kids. Is it due to COVID, maybe. Working from home has been on the rise the last 20 years and has been made more public and acceptable due to COVID and advances in technology.

I've stated before that residential building in DTLA has been unprecedented pre-COVID. Is that sustainable, I wish I knew. From a macro economic prospective, measured in sales tax, LA and OC were down approximately 6.5% in 2020 from 2019. What that means is that the economy as a whole is spending money. The hit was not nearly as hard as what took place during the Great Recession, again on a macro level. We have yet to see the impact to to families and small business in terms of what that will do to jobs and real estate market.

Like someone said earlier, there is a lot of money out there and it's being spent in a lot of different ways.
 

rampster

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Looking at the prices of everything around me I'm starting to feel like I'm in a 3rd world country with hyper-inflation. I need to figure out how to best capitalize on this trend.
 

ChiliPepperGarage

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They must not be that bothered by the leftist politics... why are AZ and TX getting more and more blue?
Three main reasons.

First, the ongoing indoctrination of our youth. As time goes on this will cause all areas to become more blue. Some kids are smart enough to wake up many more are indoctrinated for life.

Second, many leave because of how the leftist leaders fucked up their state but are too stupid to realize it and continue to vote for the same kind of morons that fucked up their state. When the new state goes to hell they will wonder how it happened.

Third, massive importation of illegal aliens. The Marxists create more and more programs of free benefits and open the borders to let them in.

Of course there is also things like dead people voting, republican votes being thrown out, and votes being counted multiple time.
 

Singleton

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With a majority of companies realizing remote workforce’s still get work done, you will see a transition.
You no longer need to be 20-30 minutes (in CA 45-90) from your office, you can live father out where you have more land (more then 10’ between houses). I forecast urban condo living going down in valve and what we knew as city living (bars and restaurants), will look very different in 2-3 years. It will cycle back in 10-12 when everyone has forgotten about C19. NYC the $4M and up market is stable, anything under that is losing value faster then most thought.

Folks want to live in the burbs where you can have land and space and C19 is allowing them to realize that.
 

OldSchoolBoats

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With a majority of companies realizing remote workforce’s still get work done, you will see a transition.
You no longer need to be 20-30 minutes (in CA 45-90) from your office, you can live father out where you have more land (more then 10’ between houses). I forecast urban condo living going down in valve and what we knew as city living (bars and restaurants), will look very different in 2-3 years. It will cycle back in 10-12 when everyone has forgotten about C19. NYC the $4M and up market is stable, anything under that is losing value faster then most thought.

Folks want to live in the burbs where you can have land and space and C19 is allowing them to realize that.
And if they bought in 2011-2013 in some coastal areas, or designated high cost counties, they are moving to places like Temecula/Murrieta and can either pay cash or only take on a small mortgage.

If a couple making $15k combined, just reduced house payment from $3500 to $1500, that is a pretty significant change and could afford for other expenditures, if they choose.

One thing I will never understand is why everyone around here is so concerned with what other people are doing with their money. It isn't anyones business and unless you KNOW the person, then don't make assumptions.

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Singleton

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Three main reasons.

First, the ongoing indoctrination of our youth. As time goes on this will cause all areas to become more blue. Some kids are smart enough to wake up many more are indoctrinated for life.
Biggest argument I have had with my 25yo son was this Christmas.
When I asked him why he voted blue, he said ”I want the free stuff”. When I told him, mom and I are the ones paying higher taxes for that free stuff and one day so will you. His response “once I own 100% of the business, I will vote against the free stuff, so I don’t have to pay for it.” Since mom and I own his business, he makes payments to us, it was a long conversation. At one point I was so heated, I told him, “you are an employee of the company still and have only purchased 10% of ownership from us, so before I fire your ass, think long and hard on how your response sounds like a spoiled ass kid.” The next morning he had a change of heart. If his attitude stays as is, I will be selling the company ASAP and he will learn the hard way.

this is the thinking in the 20-30yo ago group. Give me everything for free now and when it is my turn to pay for it, I will vote differently so I don‘t have to pay. if parents don‘t wake these young adults up, we are F’d
 

Cdog

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I know so many that have financed themselves to the gills only to find out their jobs are going to be severed. I'm near Chicago and its going to get UGLY. REAL UGLY. Were in the part of the tsunami wave where it goes out for 20 miles and everyone is laugh and playing on the beach.

I think you nailed it.
 

Cdog

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Biggest argument I have had with my 25yo son was this Christmas.
When I asked him why he voted blue, he said ”I want the free stuff”. When I told him, mom and I are the ones paying higher taxes for that free stuff and one day so will you. His response “once I own 100% of the business, I will vote against the free stuff, so I don’t have to pay for it.” Since mom and I own his business, he makes payments to us, it was a long conversation. At one point I was so heated, I told him, “you are an employee of the company still and have only purchased 10% of ownership from us, so before I fire your ass, think long and hard on how your response sounds like a spoiled ass kid.” The next morning he had a change of heart. If his attitude stays as is, I will be selling the company ASAP and he will learn the hard way.

this is the thinking in the 20-30yo ago group. Give me everything for free now and when it is my turn to pay for it, I will vote differently so I don‘t have to pay. if parents don‘t wake these young adults up, we are F’d

They learned well from their boomer elders. We're in a shit storm for the foreseeable future as every boomer I know, even the diehard conservatives rant and rave that they want their SS and Bennys they were promised as if there is a bank account with all that money sitting there. They dont understand that cash was spent 20 years ago.

30 Trillion in debt later........
 

riverroyal

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I commute on the 5 in north san diego. Traffic is down, its not gone. I can stay at 70 mph at 5 pm. I havent seen that in 25 years. This tells me people that can work at home do. Which means they can work anywhere.
 

Cdog

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Keep in mind the wealth transfer happening right now as the older boomers are aging out. With most of you older GenXers you most likely have parents in their 70's. As they die off and their assets become inheritance allowing a typical Gen X family to buy some nice things, cash out and go find what they are looking for anywhere..
 

Tooms22

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Biggest argument I have had with my 25yo son was this Christmas.
When I asked him why he voted blue, he said ”I want the free stuff”. When I told him, mom and I are the ones paying higher taxes for that free stuff and one day so will you. His response “once I own 100% of the business, I will vote against the free stuff, so I don’t have to pay for it.” Since mom and I own his business, he makes payments to us, it was a long conversation. At one point I was so heated, I told him, “you are an employee of the company still and have only purchased 10% of ownership from us, so before I fire your ass, think long and hard on how your response sounds like a spoiled ass kid.” The next morning he had a change of heart. If his attitude stays as is, I will be selling the company ASAP and he will learn the hard way.

this is the thinking in the 20-30yo ago group. Give me everything for free now and when it is my turn to pay for it, I will vote differently so I don‘t have to pay. if parents don‘t wake these young adults up, we are F’d
I definitely can't tell you why your son believes the way he does. It could be that his future is already set up (if the business is successful already), college indoctrination, social pressure in our generation to vote blue and be "caring," etc.

But I'm 32 and I've never once considered voting blue. I can also tell you that I have around 10 close friends who are the same way. We all have different upbringings but understand to own guns, excel in business, keep more of what you worked hard to make, and not support criminals... you vote red. These buddies are law enforcement, attorneys, a doctor, commercial real estate, tech, financial advisors, pool builder, etc. We exist. We're out here. And our "morally superior" lib friends look down upon us. We definitely hang out with them less. But I'm confident they will pull the typical blue to red change as they get older and see decades of lib policies cost trillions but not work out. But it will interesting to see if they actually admit they should've realized it sooner.

And if they bought in 2011-2013 in some coastal areas, or designated high cost counties, they are moving to places like Temecula/Murrieta and can either pay cash or only take on a small mortgage.

If a couple making $15k combined, just reduced house payment from $3500 to $1500, that is a pretty significant change and could afford for other expenditures, if they choose.

One thing I will never understand is why everyone around here is so concerned with what other people are doing with their money. It isn't anyones business and unless you KNOW the person, then don't make assumptions.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
I think a lot people are concerned because they don't want another Great Recession. I care what people are doing with their money for the purpose of following the market. When will a place I want to buy have a small dip? Right now is definitely the ultimate peak. But will it sit here? Go up? Go down due to anything discussed in this thread?

I will say it's tough when you try to save and be conservative and you see other people making less but spending money like they're using the money gun in the strip club 😂 . We bought off Green River in 2015, 1850 sq ft. and we have friends making less but spending $1.5 million and $1.750 million this year on houses in Socal. But we're staying to true to the plan of saving and investing while still having reasonable fun. The no kids thing makes that a lot easier.
 

petie6464

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Agree with many, people working from home will continue long after covid is gone.

ANY employer that can have a body out of sight is going to do it. Who the heck wants to babysit employees, send them out as contract laborers and put them on 1099.

Retail and store fronts will continue to decline, they are just not going to be financially feasible, that's already here.

Housing will always be a safe investment, slum lord's will be making steady income as the rats need holes to nest.
 

Cole Trickle

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Biggest argument I have had with my 25yo son was this Christmas.
When I asked him why he voted blue, he said ”I want the free stuff”. When I told him, mom and I are the ones paying higher taxes for that free stuff and one day so will you. His response “once I own 100% of the business, I will vote against the free stuff, so I don’t have to pay for it.” Since mom and I own his business, he makes payments to us, it was a long conversation. At one point I was so heated, I told him, “you are an employee of the company still and have only purchased 10% of ownership from us, so before I fire your ass, think long and hard on how your response sounds like a spoiled ass kid.” The next morning he had a change of heart. If his attitude stays as is, I will be selling the company ASAP and he will learn the hard way.

this is the thinking in the 20-30yo ago group. Give me everything for free now and when it is my turn to pay for it, I will vote differently so I don‘t have to pay. if parents don‘t wake these young adults up, we are F’d
This is the same kid you paid for him to go to out of state college while still footing the bill and then bought him a carpet cleaning biz?

Perfect example of why i won't be paying my kids 4 year college bill and i could give two shits about them going out of state to "live the college life".

I would have kicked him out years ago. That's a crazy entitled attitude...lol
 

Cole Trickle

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We are going to see some big changes in the work force in the next 10 years. Sooner or later this CA pay while you move out of state is going to go tits up.

Why wouldn't a large company lay off all the CA employees and replace them with midwest workers that are used to getting paid half.

Mark my words the middle class is fucked and the large biz owners will continue to shit on employees while stacking billions.
 

Flyinbowtie

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As IT technology continues to improve I think more and more people will seek to work from home in jobs where it is possible. COVID is accelerating the process for sure. As high speed internet gets out into the hinterlands on a cheaper basis more urban people will move further out. Crappy internet is still an issue where I live and where we plan to move to, but I will trade it off for a lack of people. Forgive me, but some of the urban people just bring their problems with them when they come. I kinda believe if you had a hand in fouling the nest you should have to stay in the stink, not move to some other clean place and foul it too.
This whole rural internet thing reminds me of the history I have read about the process of bringing electricity to rural America in some ways.
Remember the stories of the TVA dropping off electric wringer washing machines and refrigerators at rural homes with new electric service, and coming back a year later and the units are still sitting in the yard, right where they were dropped? LOL.
Saw an article somewhere that GM is working on a passenger capable electric drone deal that you will be able to call like a taxi to pick up up from some "vertiport" on top of a building to whisk you away to your home in the Residential Zone. Sounds like they will fly about 55 MPH. Reminds me of some of the post apocalyptic sci-fi movies, doesn't it? Supposed to be here by 2035. Maybe they are gonna build holographic flight routes above the freeways so now the 405 can be 20 lanes across and 10 lanes tall or something, so the drones can stay in line and not crash into each other.
Other than that, well...lets just say I am not optimistic.
Of course, I am probably wrong. The country was doing great not long ago, and there is no reason to think we can't get it going full steam soon, as soon as when the pandemic is over, and we all get another check, as the printing presses go humming along, and the debt continues to skyrocket, but our government knows what is going on, and they will get a handle on it all, soon. Good Times just around the bend. Our Friends the Chinese will be marching towards the new dawn right next to us.
And soon, we will all be drinking that Free Bubble Up, and eating that Rainbow Stew.

Those of you old enough to remember that little phrase will remember a political commercial that started with "Morning in America"
So very long ago.
 

Flyinbowtie

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Biggest argument I have had with my 25yo son was this Christmas.
When I asked him why he voted blue, he said ”I want the free stuff”. When I told him, mom and I are the ones paying higher taxes for that free stuff and one day so will you. His response “once I own 100% of the business, I will vote against the free stuff, so I don’t have to pay for it.” Since mom and I own his business, he makes payments to us, it was a long conversation. At one point I was so heated, I told him, “you are an employee of the company still and have only purchased 10% of ownership from us, so before I fire your ass, think long and hard on how your response sounds like a spoiled ass kid.” The next morning he had a change of heart. If his attitude stays as is, I will be selling the company ASAP and he will learn the hard way.

this is the thinking in the 20-30yo ago group. Give me everything for free now and when it is my turn to pay for it, I will vote differently so I don‘t have to pay. if parents don‘t wake these young adults up, we are F’d

We already are fucked, my friend. Already done.
Those people in that age group are the ones who will be running the show soon. If they are saying it they are thinking it too. If that is their mindset at that age nothing will change it. Nothing, without that hard lesson you spoke of being put into play. just my opinion
 

Racey

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What many in this thread have stated, plus this added wild card. When SpaceX's Starlink system is fully up and running you will have fiber speed internet coverage 100% around the entire globe, meaning you can literally live in the middle of nowhere and telecommute, not just to the suburbs.

Previously living purely rural (Like Wash11 for example) has meant you have to forego the luxury of high speed internet, in some cases internet alltogether. This won't be the case in another 3 or so years when they have thousands and thousands of satellites in orbit. They have 955 of them up and operating now, with another 1000+ scheduled to be launched in 2021 alone.
 

2Driver

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Cavemen stole meat from each others caves while the other caveman was out hunting.

Nothings changed, never will. LOL Lifes not fair, blame the person who told you it was supposed to be.
 

Flyinbowtie

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What many in this thread have stated, plus this added wild card. When SpaceX's Starlink system is fully up and running you will have fiber speed internet coverage 100% around the entire globe, meaning you can literally live in the middle of nowhere and telecommute, not just to the suburbs.

Previously living purely rural (Like Wash11 for example) has meant you have to forego the luxury of high speed internet, in some cases internet alltogether. This won't be the case in another 3 or so years when they have thousands and thousands of satellites in orbit. They have 955 of them up and operating now, with another 1000+ scheduled to be launched in 2021 alone.

Racey we are on a wireless repeater for internet at my place, No cable available, even though it goes across my property. NO DSL. Hughesnet, dial up or this deal, which is a line of sight set up that originates 50 air miles up the road and is shot into our little valley to the antenna on my roof. Just enough speed to stream without too many hiccups. Elon is going to make a whole 'nother fortune when he gets this thing up and running.
 

grumpy88

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Biggest argument I have had with my 25yo son was this Christmas.
When I asked him why he voted blue, he said ”I want the free stuff”. When I told him, mom and I are the ones paying higher taxes for that free stuff and one day so will you. His response “once I own 100% of the business, I will vote against the free stuff, so I don’t have to pay for it.” Since mom and I own his business, he makes payments to us, it was a long conversation. At one point I was so heated, I told him, “you are an employee of the company still and have only purchased 10% of ownership from us, so before I fire your ass, think long and hard on how your response sounds like a spoiled ass kid.” The next morning he had a change of heart. If his attitude stays as is, I will be selling the company ASAP and he will learn the hard way.

this is the thinking in the 20-30yo ago group. Give me everything for free now and when it is my turn to pay for it, I will vote differently so I don‘t have to pay. if parents don‘t wake these young adults up, we are F’d
Good for you for being a good parent . Its never easy but you said the right things
 

Singleton

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This is the same kid you paid for him to go to out of state college while still footing the bill and then bought him a carpet cleaning biz?

Perfect example of why i won't be paying my kids 4 year college bill and i could give two shits about them going out of state to "live the college life".

I would have kicked him out years ago. That's a crazy entitled attitude...lol
yes - mom and I paid for his college education

yes - mom and I purchased the carpet cleaning business and he makes quarterly payments to us for ownership shares. No payment received, no transfer of ownership shares. Not $1 has gone from my pocket to the company. I signed the loan agreements and run the financial side with him (he spends 8+ hours with me weekly reviewing the numbers and gaining the knowledge to run the business). He is paid like every other employee and is treated no different. Negative feedback from customers impacts his annual merit and bonus just like the 2 other guys. Only reason I purchased business, he was making very little and brought the business plan to me and mom. He also leveraged his degree to modify the marketing plan. He plays on environmentally friend carpet disinfection, etc. 100% natural, no harmful chemicals. The Denver hippy business owners love him. 65% of business are Dr’s offices

he also lives 100% on his own in Denver.
 

Singleton

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We already are fucked, my friend. Already done.
Those people in that age group are the ones who will be running the show soon. If they are saying it they are thinking it too. If that is their mindset at that age nothing will change it. Nothing, without that hard lesson you spoke of being put into play. just my opinion
I agree.
The kids who grew up with everyone gets a trophy never learned losing and HOW you lose is huge.
my sons attitude shocks me, but if he does not figure it out quick, the business will be sold and he will be shit out of luck.
 

was thatguy

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yes - mom and I paid for his college education

yes - mom and I purchased the carpet cleaning business and he makes quarterly payments to us for ownership shares. No payment received, no transfer of ownership shares. Not $1 has gone from my pocket to the company. I signed the loan agreements and run the financial side with him (he spends 8+ hours with me weekly reviewing the numbers and gaining the knowledge to run the business). He is paid like every other employee and is treated no different. Negative feedback from customers impacts his annual merit and bonus just like the 2 other guys. Only reason I purchased business, he was making very little and brought the business plan to me and mom. He also leveraged his degree to modify the marketing plan. He plays on environmentally friend carpet disinfection, etc. 100% natural, no harmful chemicals. The Denver hippy business owners love him. 65% of business are Dr’s offices

he also lives 100% on his own in Denver.
8 WHOLE hours??

Not judging, but I am available for adoption if you’re looking!
 

Singleton

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8 WHOLE hours??

Not judging, but I am available for adoption if you’re looking!
that is 8hr on the finance side weekly (going over revenue, expenses, etc) on top of customer work. I control all the accounts, he has no access to any of the business $$. Corporate card for expenses and any personal expenses on that card are held from his paychecks. He averages 57hr a week out at customers, so 8 on top is OK for now.
 
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