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Jet Fuel dumped on kids at school in L.A.

Discussion in 'RD's Lounge' started by The Prisoner, Jan 14, 2020.

  1. The Prisoner

    The Prisoner Well-Known Member

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  2. stephenkatsea

    stephenkatsea Well-Known Member

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    Reports indicated it was a Delta 777 bound for Shanghai. It had recently departed LAX when engine problems forced it to return. Would typically expect the fuel dump necessary to safely land the plane would have occurred over the ocean.
     
  3. Sleek-Jet

    Sleek-Jet Well-Known Member

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    We used to drink jet fuel as a kids... Freaking snowflakes. :D
     
  4. 2Driver

    2Driver Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunate but they will live. Shit we got more fuel on us siphoning cars during the 70's gas crisis then those kids will ever get. :D

    “ The victims were treated by dozens of firefighters and paramedics at the school”

    LOL I’m sure they were.
     
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  5. OLDRAAT

    OLDRAAT inadequate member

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    Better than having skydrol falling. Glad there were no serious issues. Still wondering why not a water dump?
     
  6. The Prisoner

    The Prisoner Well-Known Member

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    They just up it to 6 schools and 60 injuries.
     
  7. Yellowboat

    Yellowboat Well-Known Member

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    Atc almost never lets them dump over populated areas.

    Fuel dumps are done becuase max take off wieght and safe landing wieght are drasticaly different. If they land heavy they will do damage to the gear/ aircraft.

    Jet a is kerosene with some additives.
     
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  8. DaveC

    DaveC Car-boat motors

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    Poor inner city yutes.

    Only in CA where kids can play in a inner city playground that exposes them to human feces and used junky needles that might have Hep, TB or HIV and thats no big deal.

    But someone dumps a little bit of jet A that disperses in the air and everyone loses their shit.

    Only in CA.

    :p;)
     
  9. was thatguy

    was thatguy living in a cage of fear

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    That happened a couple times when I lived in Anchorage. Dumped over neighborhoods. One time an engine fell off and landed in some dudes back yard. Dodged a BIG bullet that time!
     
  10. monkeyswrench

    monkeyswrench Well-Known Member

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    Gonna be some new Escalades in the hood:rolleyes:
     
  11. CoolCruzin

    CoolCruzin Well-Known Member

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    Should of lite a match and burn down LA
     
  12. DaveC

    DaveC Car-boat motors

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    To clean up all the bum dookie, I agree. :cool::D
     
  13. Danger Dave

    Danger Dave Well-Known Member

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    Trump's fault?
     
  14. Yellowboat

    Yellowboat Well-Known Member

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    I would be pissed, not becuase it happened, but becuase of all the fed state and local agents that would be in my back yard for days.
     
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  15. bilz

    bilz Well-Known Member

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    Still smells like kerosene in Whittier
     
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  16. buck35

    buck35 Well-Known Member

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    It would be interesting to see the altitude and % of saturation that may have hit the ground.
     
  17. Sleek-Jet

    Sleek-Jet Well-Known Member

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    They used to go out to sea and dump fuel, I'm guessing that doesn't happen anymore.
     
  18. HGP3

    HGP3 Well-Known Member

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    2,375 ft when it flew over the schools shown in the article.

    Screenshot_20200114-184921.png
     
  19. Angler

    Angler Tritoon Racing

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    They can't contaminate the ocean but inner city kids are OK,
    EPA is a mother f'r to deal with...:p
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
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  20. Yellowboat

    Yellowboat Well-Known Member

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    Dumping fuel is a big deal. Its an ask for permission and vectors to do it. Either atc cleared them, or they did not. Either way this is going to get expesnive for the airline
     
  21. grumpy88

    grumpy88 Well-Known Member

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    Plane tickets will be going up !
     
  22. Singleton

    Singleton Well-Known Member

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    Plane has engine mechanical at 8k - last thing ATC is worried about is fuel falling to ground.
    Sounds and looks like that plane needed to land ASAP and was dumping fuel until the last minute.
    Better fuel then plane falling to ground - more people live that way
     
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  23. Yellowboat

    Yellowboat Well-Known Member

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    Yeah...





    Some one will not be flying for awhile. Ask if needed to dump fuel said no. No mention of dumping.

    Yes i know aviate, navigate , communicate, but this time its going to hurt.
     
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  24. Jed-O

    Jed-O Shitter was full!

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    Sounds like a shit design from the get go if it can't land with a full load of fuel because the landing gear is a piece of shit.
    What the hell is the world coming to...
     
  25. Bobby V

    Bobby V Well-Known Member

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    From the link in post #1

    David Soucie, an aviation safety analyst, told CNN there are maximum takeoff and landing weights for aircraft, so in order for a plane with full fuel tanks to land, it must dump the fuel to avoid potentially crashing upon landing.
     
  26. Member: 71

    Member: 71 M ǝ ɯ q ǝ ɹ : 7 1

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    Came in hot and low... caught it outside my office window.
    DL89.jpg
     
  27. Member: 71

    Member: 71 M ǝ ɯ q ǝ ɹ : 7 1

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    I got to say...It was dumping fuel well before the turn over West Covina, spraying many schools.
     
  28. 4Waters

    4Waters Well-Known Member

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    That's what I heard. ATC asked the pilot if he needed to dump fuel, pilot replied no, then decides to dump anyways.
     
  29. Racer56

    Racer56 Well-Known Member

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    Would have loved to see him dump fuel over Chevron in El Segundo.
     
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  30. OLDRAAT

    OLDRAAT inadequate member

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    Waiting for some additional info, but unless the established flight routes for departure/arrival had heavy traffic, rerouting to a West reloop over water for a large release should have been a consideration IMO.
    Even after a fuel purge, I think a heavy would still have fuel for a go around and E-landing?
     
  31. monkeyswrench

    monkeyswrench Well-Known Member

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    FAE, Thermobaric?
    Good thing Jet A isn't like gas...
     
  32. Beautiful Noise

    Beautiful Noise Well-Known Member

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    I was working at the Airport when they rolled out the Emergency Vehicles next to Us BUT didn’t know anything about the Plane till I heard it on the News after I got off Work .......
     
  33. Jed-O

    Jed-O Shitter was full!

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    I read it. And I'm not a aviation expert. But as a human being with two eyes and fuckin brain, it seems pretty retarded to design a obviously necessary component to not be able to handle the entire load of the aircraft in the event of an emergency or any other reason.
    Seriously, I don't feel the need to dump 3/4 of my boat fuel before I pull up to Fox's so my fenders don't explode...
    Just my thoughts...
     
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  34. bilz

    bilz Well-Known Member

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    Dude dumped all over our neighborhood according to my neighbors.
     
  35. Bobby V

    Bobby V Well-Known Member

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    How fast do you ram the docks at Fox's. lol :)
     
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  36. Jed-O

    Jed-O Shitter was full!

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    Hahahaha!
     
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  37. 4Waters

    4Waters Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty sure the plane can handle a landing fully loaded but not recommended as testing is done with all systems working normal and an actual emergency landing could be hard due to loss of an engine or hydraulics etc....

    Just my thoughts.
     
  38. Yellowboat

    Yellowboat Well-Known Member

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    Wieght on am airplane is huge. Every extra once is one you cant use to make money. So they design a plane to land at a given weight that would be an average of what a realistic landing wieght would be. It may seem stupid, but it saves millions over the life time of the aircraft.

    It gets even more crazy with small aircraft. Take the cessna 172, the most common plane. The newest version 172r. Holds 4 people hasa gross max at 2450 holds 56 gallons, but wieght in at 1691 empty. Now 100 ll wieghts in at 6.02/ gallon. Top off the tanks and it brings your wieght up to 2028# that means your 4 passengers can weight 105.5# so what do you do? You drop the fuel load, which drasticly cuts your range. It sucks but a part of flying
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
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  39. JayBreww

    JayBreww Well-Known Member

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    Our aircraft do it all the time before landing back at Norton. They usually dump it off west of the 330 near McKinley peak.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
  40. monkeyswrench

    monkeyswrench Well-Known Member

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    In thinking about it, a large plane probably has the equivalent to a swimming pool in each wing. Holding say 25# in each arm, outstretched, you could walk keeping them somewhat steady. Now, same thing, but step down maybe a foot, wearing only one shoe. Between the unsteadiness, and the accelerated drop to a stop, most people's arms will dip, or give.
    If a planes decent angle and speed aren't good, I'm sure all kinds of crap can go bad. A lot worse than bottoming out the shocks in a truck, I'm sure.
     
  41. Jed-O

    Jed-O Shitter was full!

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    Like I said, I'm no aviation expert. What you're stating makes perfect sense, and as a small business owner I can understand the fact that saving every buck you can on a job or "flight" is completely legitimate in business.
    What I don't understand is why can our military fly tanks overseas, land and not have to worry about the fucking landing gear!?
    I'm a building contractor, and I have to deal with engineers all the time. They design shit to withstand three times the stress that they allow us to use it for. So even if we the builders fuck up with a little "field engineering" (yeah, everything works fine on paper) we are all good most of the time.
    So my case is:
    1. If an aircraft cannot land fully loaded under any circumstances due to shitty landing gear, why should the FAA allow it fly? (in lament terms, if you have an ailment in your legs knees and/or back I'm not going to ask you to help move my refrigerator)
    2. If the fuel in the wings is "Way too heavy" and they might snap off! (for the love of God I'm never flying again unless the IRS gets a hold of me) Jesus Christ! Use better materials and fasteners!
    3. Also a thought. If wings are too heavy to land, put the gear back on the fucking wings where they belong like a B-25.
    4. If you are a brand new engineer, leave the fucking vacuum cleaner switch at the Goddamn handle! Quit moving the motherfucker! You don't have to justify your position. It works just fine in or around the immediate reach of my fingertips and thumb. Halfway between my feet and hands isn't a good deal when I accidentally suck up the pet's tail or the Goddamn phone charger. (yeah, fuck you new engineer dude. Suck my...)
    5. It's Tuesday and I'm pretty drunk. Fuck you IRS and New Engineer dude!
    6. Wait... It's almost Wednesday...
    Or is it almost Thursday?
    7. Fuck it. I'm going to the river this weekend.
     
  42. welldigger00

    welldigger00 Well-Known Member

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    Uh oh, Jed’s gonna have a bumpy morning


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
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  43. YumaRivernaut

    YumaRivernaut Well-Known Member

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    That aint no bullshit :eek:
     
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  44. WhatExit?

    WhatExit? Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  45. SkyDirtWaterguy

    SkyDirtWaterguy Well-Known Member

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    This

    Also, it’s funny reading all these opinions on a boating forum. Until your are sitting in a seat in that cockpit and understand the details of what is happening at that moment, it’s best to reserve judgment until the facts come out.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
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  46. Singleton

    Singleton Well-Known Member

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    Pilot dumped fuel last minute. Something not on the ATC audio video triggered that
     
  47. Kachina26

    Kachina26 Inmate #RDP158

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    What's the fun in that.
     
  48. YumaRivernaut

    YumaRivernaut Well-Known Member

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    They don't worry. If the load falls within MLW, (Maximum Landing Weight) the gear will support it as designed. The Military dumps fuel all the time as well. Besides tanks don't sue and one cannot sue the Military anyway.
    It can land with a full passenger, cargo and fuel load and probably more as all designs and systems on aircraft are purposely over engineered and have multiple redundancies. If it did not conform to it's original Type Certificate of MTOW (Maximum Take Off Weight) MLW, The FAA would not allow it to fly. I have seen no record of the 777 having shitty landing gear, Airworthiness Directives, and/or Service Bulletins alluding to this currently or in the past.
    Aircraft wings/spars are extremely robust as well as extremely over engineered by design and undergo severe testing requirements to be certified involving stress tests to observe when and how much force they can withstand before snapping. To repeat these stresses, it would involve forces in nature that are so severe that rarely, if ever will the wings be subjected to these kinds of loads in it's normal lifespan. The severe weather events to exert these kinds of forces do happen, but are so rare as to be rendered negligible at best. Other than from corrosion and/or maintenance neglect, wings snapping off aircraft does not really occur.
    It is standard procedure in an emergency RTB (Return To Base) to dump fuel. Reason being, The MLW adherence and it's obviously better for everyone for the aircraft to be empty of flammable fuel when attempting an emergency landing than ending up in a cascading fireball when mother earth rises up and smites thee.
    While I have no love lost for the airline companies, (understatement) I find it ironic as to why people who live in a valley of toxic fumes and pollution every day get so upset about an aircraft dumping fuel in an attempt to land the plane safely with minimal loss of life.
    Must be the optics, sensationalism and always...about those poor children :rolleyes:
     
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