WELCOME TO RIVER DAVES PLACE

**LAKE MEAD MAN MADE DOOM AND GLOOM ????**

Racey

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Fuck, you are way harder headed than you Dad told me.... so where did the water go????? all the water that powel dumpped??? well I'll tell you... it went to mead... and then like I said mead just dumped 30' of water in little over a year,,,,, here's how it works,... just so you know... not say'n you will learn or understand, as you argue with the sign post and take the wrong road home.... just think what would happen if you lived in vegas or LA..... but there is no way we used 30' of water... that 30' got dumped out, just like the 150' they dumped out... believe what you want... and justify you own thoughts... but whats going on is ridiculous, the fact that they blame every thing on something else to hide what they do... Oh and tell me again how the FEDS. protect every one and makes sure the gov doesn't do any thing wrong to the people and how transparent they are
Lol, you talkin to yourself again? 🤣 🤣

Do you know how many acre feet 30' of water in mead is at the 1100 level to the 1070 level?

Let me explain it to you since you can't seem to fathom where this 'phantom water' goes.

At the current elevation mead is holding about 9 million acre feet.

The compact is that Mead must release 9 million acre feet per year, 4.4 to CA, 2.8 to AZ, .3 to NV, 1.5 to MX.

Do you comprehend that? Can you understand where the 30' is?

Let me explain this a different way.

If they shut off the water from Powell and stopped filling Mead period, the current water deliveries would DRAIN THE ENTIRE LAKE MEAD in 12 months.
 
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2FORCEFULL

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Lol, you talkin to yourself again? 🤣 🤣

Do you know how many acre feet 30' of water in mead is at the 1100 level to the 1070 level?

Let me explain it to you since you can't seem to fathom where this 'phantom water' goes.

At the current elevation mead is holding about 9 million acre feet.

The compact is that Mead must release 9 million acre feet per year, 4.4 to CA, 2.8 to AZ, .3 to NV, 1.5 to MX.

Do you comprehend that? Can you understand where the 30' is?

Let me explain this a different way.

If they shut off the water from Powell and stopped filling Mead period, the current water deliveries would DRAIN THE ENTIRE LAKE MEAD in 12 months.
feb 1 1935 they started filling mead, it took 6 years to fill it 1200' all the will they were letting 9 million acre ft out...from 1941 to 2000 they still let out the 9 m ac/ft... but durring that time it over filled, and in 65 it dropped.. but for the most part... it re filled... but now, from 2000 to 2021, it has dropped exact like the guy told me.. and every time it try's to refill... they pull the plug.... kinda like a bath tub with a hole in the the plug, you can turn the water on if the tub gets too low, or pull the plug when it gets to high,... and like I said 21 years ago,... they said they will never let mead get to those water levels again... and i think the target is 1050'... so... is there doom and gloom, do we need to conserve water... absolutely... but ... it's man made doom and gloom... every thing works on account balance...
 

2FORCEFULL

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the lake is like a checking account.... having 1200' of water in mead is like having a million dollars in your checking account... if you don't do something with the money,.. inflation will....same with the water... 1200' of water looses 9 million acre ft to evaporation... so use it or loose it,.. in this case they sent it down river, and thats why durring all this drought.... the river now flows all the way to the sea of cortez... some thing that didn't happen for 50 years..
 

Racey

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the lake is like a checking account.... having 1200' of water in mead is like having a million dollars in your checking account... if you don't do something with the money,.. inflation will....same with the water... 1200' of water looses 9 million acre ft to evaporation... so use it or loose it,.. in this case they sent it down river, and thats why durring all this drought.... the river now flows all the way to the sea of cortez... some thing that didn't happen for 50 years..
You ever seen how much river makes it to the sea of cortez?


They have only done it a couple times since 2014. It aint enough to even put a dent in the lake here
 

cofooter

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LMFAO...."FORECAST"....but... now I can see whats happening for sure with the help of the lake graph ...so in 2016 the water level was 1084'... but because of the extreem drought... and water orders (LOL) ... the fk'n lake rose 5' to 1089... in 17 & 18 .... then from 2018, worst drought in the history of the planet,... even more water orders and such.... correct me if i'm wrong... but all that drought for 2 years cause the lake to rise another 10' so it was at 1098' so with every thing the same....no rain... construction still booming..... you're telling me that someone put water orders that took 30' of water out of lake mead in a little over a year????? with today level @ 1068... and a year ago @ 1098,... they predicted that???? and you know they didn't dump it out, even though the river is near flooding,... water goes up the sea wall in havasu...... splane that again LUCY!!!!!
Mexico ordered it, lol...............
 

2FORCEFULL

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You ever seen how much river makes it to the sea of cortez?


They have only done it a couple times since 2014. It aint enough to even put a dent in the lake here
It didn't for 50 yrs. now during the extrema drought it does ???... lol...
 

Racey

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It didn't for 50 yrs. now during the extrema drought it does ???... lol...
It's not extreme drought until 1025 at Mead. per the 1944 Minute 319 agreement.

And it has flowed a piss trickle two or three times, for just a few weeks.
 

rrrr

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It's not extreme drought until 1025 at Mead. per the 1944 Minute 319 agreement.

And it has flowed a piss trickle two or three times, for just a few weeks.
B-bu-but the guy on the boat ramp...
 

grumpy88

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feb 1 1935 they started filling mead, it took 6 years to fill it 1200' all the will they were letting 9 million acre ft out...from 1941 to 2000 they still let out the 9 m ac/ft... but durring that time it over filled, and in 65 it dropped.. but for the most part... it re filled... but now, from 2000 to 2021, it has dropped exact like the guy told me.. and every time it try's to refill... they pull the plug.... kinda like a bath tub with a hole in the the plug, you can turn the water on if the tub gets too low, or pull the plug when it gets to high,... and like I said 21 years ago,... they said they will never let mead get to those water levels again... and i think the target is 1050'... so... is there doom and gloom, do we need to conserve water... absolutely... but ... it's man made doom and gloom... every thing works on account balance...
So why dont you put the pool in ?
 

welldigger00

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Ok, riddle me this Batman; we were just out on mead for a week on a houseboat. My question is this. If the lake is the lowest it’s been since they’ve filled it up, how come there were the remnants of bushes that were about three to five feet under water? Like small bushes too. Ones that would only be a few feet tall. Don’t tell me that them bushes were preserved for 80 or so years.


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Runs2rch

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Ok, riddle me this Batman; we were just out on mead for a week on a houseboat. My question is this. If the lake is the lowest it’s been since they’ve filled it up, how come there were the remnants of bushes that were about three to five feet under water? Like small bushes too. Ones that would only be a few feet tall. Don’t tell me that them bushes were preserved for 80 or so years.


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They get blown into the water. The wind easily reaches over 70 mph in bad storms. Also waves crashing pull them in. Bring a mask and snorkel. You will see there are plenty of preserved trees. At Middle Point under where we camped a huge forest.
 

Racey

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They get blown into the water. The wind easily reaches over 70 mph in bad storms. Also waves crashing pull them in. Bring a mask and snorkel. You will see there are plenty of preserved trees. At Middle Point under where we camped a huge forest.
Some can even grow under water.
 

rivermobster

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Ok, riddle me this Batman; we were just out on mead for a week on a houseboat. My question is this. If the lake is the lowest it’s been since they’ve filled it up, how come there were the remnants of bushes that were about three to five feet under water? Like small bushes too. Ones that would only be a few feet tall. Don’t tell me that them bushes were preserved for 80 or so years.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
You know the rule...
 

Racey

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rivermobster

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CA doesn't have to give up a drop until 1045 Mead level.... AZ and NV have been giving up water (small amounts in relative terms) starting at 1090' and below
I'll believe you. No way I'm reading all that jazz!

I think what most people don't realize is that there is not one entity that decides what to do here. There are literally thousands of people working on this issue, trying to make sense of it all. And like any issue, there are people that have their own (paid for by someone else) interests at heart, and people that truly care.

All us mere mortals can do is watch and see what happens. OR maybe break out the peyote and to a rain dance or two?

:cool:
 

Racey

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I'll believe you. No way I'm reading all that jazz!

I think what most people don't realize is that there is not one entity that decides what to do here. There are literally thousands of people working on this issue, trying to make sense of it all. And like any issue, there are people that have their own (paid for by someone else) interests at heart, and people that truly care.

All us mere mortals can do is watch and see what happens. OR maybe break out the peyote and to a rain dance or two?

:cool:
The only thing that will fix it is to reduce the water rights that were distributed in the 20's.

Some people gonna be real pissed when that happens.
 

pcrussell50

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Lake Mead was never meant for Las Vegas, it was always storage for California, just like all of those solar fields in the Eldorado valley, most of that power goes to California. I'm not disagreeing with you, but I have more questions.
It has certainly become that way, but it didn't start that way.*

Back about the same the the Bureau of Reclamation started on Hoover Dam/Mead, which was eventually to be built out to what we have today, with the four dams and four big lakes, they were working with the Central Valley Water Authority in CA, to build out three phases of aqueducts and reservoirs to bring the wild, flood prone waters of Southern Oregon, down to CA. It would be to the benefit of the Oregon farmers who get wiped out by floods all too often, and the benefit of SoCal, which even then, every body knew was going to be huge. BUT in about 1970 Jerry Brown, in his first round as Governor, canceled Phases II and III, leaving CA with only a fraction of the water supply we were supposed to have. Since then, the CA population has tripled, and the Southwest in general (AZ and NV) has quintupled, and there has been no more buildout of water infrastructure besides the now complete, CO River system. So now we have an only partially capable storage and delivery system, feeding five times the population since Phase I was finished and Phases II and III were canceled.

There is some other political slime mixed in such as the original planned mix of water for CA was supposed to be 80% or so agricultural irrigations and 20% to the cities. Beginning in the late 1990's CA politicians started taking from the ag allotment to irrigate perennial streams year round. And they started doing it a lot. Enough so that it's adding up. And they are doing it quietly and without asking for a vote.

*Yes, the CO River water was meant to irrigate the Imperial Valley in CA. It was not meant to be a free for all for the entire state of CA to use, to cover for the fact that they canceled their dams and delivery systems back when they were only a third done.

TL;DR... Too many people, not enough infrastructure = TOTALLY man made

Was just looking at the Tahoe level. It's down four feet. Four.

-Peter
 
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Loo Dog

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It’s not only the water allocation, but more than half of the power generation from Hoover goes to Southern California as well. Power generation is now down to 66% from full pool levels. At this rate of continuing drought, it’s not looking good. And too little too late for even the most expensive of alternatives if things don’t turn around in the form of snow pack. Buckle up, folks. We, meaning “mankind”, have completely fucked this up.
26884A23-45EF-4E08-A472-DD18C170A651.jpeg
 

rivermobster

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This is a really cool vid. It clears up at least one misconception I had about why the farmers are sending alfalfa over seas. Well worth the watch!

 

Racey

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This is a really cool vid. It clears up at least one misconception I had about why the farmers are sending alfalfa over seas. Well worth the watch!

Exactly, "If you don't use your water you lose it"....

They make you rip out your lawn, which makes up single digit percentages of water usage, fine, in the long run it's smart to conserve a scarce resource wherever possible.

But at the same time probably 70% of the water from the lower basin is used to flood irrigate farm fields, the absolute most wasteful use of water imaginable.
 

rivermobster

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Exactly, "If you don't use your water you lose it"....

They make you rip out your lawn, which makes up single digit percentages of water usage, fine, in the long run it's smart to conserve a scarce resource wherever possible.

But at the same time probably 70% of the water from the lower basin is used to flood irrigate farm fields, the absolute most wasteful use of water imaginable.
Oh I dunno about that...

Working at car dealerships all my life, they waste some Major league water! Ever notice how all the cars on the lot are always nice and clean? They wash em every morning with spot free water machines. Can you imagine the billions of cars that get washed every single day??

Not to mention customers cars, used cars, employee cars (yeah, I would wash mine all the time) and the owners get their cars washed every day too.

It's a tough call for the top spot of the most wasteful use of water! 😜
 

mjc

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Exactly, "If you don't use your water you lose it"....

They make you rip out your lawn, which makes up single digit percentages of water usage, fine, in the long run it's smart to conserve a scarce resource wherever possible.

But at the same time probably 70% of the water from the lower basin is used to flood irrigate farm fields, the absolute most wasteful use of water imaginable.
Problem is they have the oldest and strongest water rights and nobody can get that changed.
 

Racey

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Oh I dunno about that...

Working at car dealerships all my life, they waste some Major league water! Ever notice how all the cars on the lot are always nice and clean? They wash em every morning with spot free water machines. Can you imagine the billions of cars that get washed every single day??

Not to mention customers cars, used cars, employee cars (yeah, I would wash mine all the time) and the owners get their cars washed every day too.

It's a tough call for the top spot of the most wasteful use of water! 😜
It aint even close. Agri is by far the biggest consumer by several times over the rest of water usage. Car washes for an entire year would just be a few farm fields of flooding.

Especially with spot free and pressure washers

There is more than 300,000 gallons in an acre foot.
 

2FORCEFULL

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It aint even close. Agri is by far the biggest consumer by several times over the rest of water usage. Car washes for an entire year would just be a few farm fields of flooding.

Especially with spot free and pressure washers

There is more than 300,000 gallons in an acre foot.
is an acre ft, one square acre , 1 foot deep???
 

Racey

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is an acre ft, one square acre , 1 foot deep???
Yessir.

We all know how small an acre is in the farming world, if they flood 2 or 3 inches per field that's an acre foot for ever 4-6 acres. 640 acres per square mile.

I'm not sure what the normal field flooding level is, but if i had to guess i would imagine it couldn't be less than 2" to get the water to actually flow...
 

riverroyal

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I just washed my car...
Pressure washer and soft water. Used maybe 4 gallons.
 

rivermobster

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It aint even close. Agri is by far the biggest consumer by several times over the rest of water usage. Car washes for an entire year would just be a few farm fields of flooding.

Especially with spot free and pressure washers

There is more than 300,000 gallons in an acre foot.
I'm sure you are right. 👍

But at least we get food from the farm deal. Car wash water is a complete waste of water.
 

2FORCEFULL

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More fodder for the debate. Never mind how many golf courses there are in Palm Springs, Palm Desert, etc. In my opinion it’s simply bad timing on Utah’s part.
very interesting....
 

angiebaby

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There is always some back door BS going on nowadays
Comifornia hasn't built a water reservoir since Roosevelt ------why not ??????

MORE CONTROL ------------Water is life not lawn food -----------
I don't know about Roosevelt Lake, but Diamond Valley Reservoir was completed in 2000. It is my understanding it is the most recent. I could be wrong. They should still be building more. I think the problem is the cost of the land and the messiness of eminent domain.
 

angiebaby

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Your rumors don't surprise me, Steve. This conflict goes back nearly 100 years to the Parker Dam Conflict/Parker Dam War, between California and Arizona in the 1930s.
 

rivermobster

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I don't know about Roosevelt Lake, but Diamond Valley Reservoir was completed in 2000. It is my understanding it is the most recent. I could be wrong. They should still be building more. I think the problem is the cost of the land and the messiness of eminent domain.
You are not wrong.

Even though we got Completely ripped off...

They sold it as a recreational lake, and it ended up being a zero body to water contact lake. It's mainly a reservoir for SD.

Also, the problem with building anything new is the libtards. Not only do they oppose any new reservoirs, they want to teardown the ones we have!

As usual, they make absolutely no sense. They don't call em libtards for nothing...


Fuckers. 😡
 
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Racey

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More fodder for the debate. Never mind how many golf courses there are in Palm Springs, Palm Desert, etc. In my opinion it’s simply bad timing on Utah’s part.
The climate change stuff is pure bs. Like the guy from Utah said, these states have only recently been developing their water rights to the full allotment. The allotments were based on an average flow estimate taken in the 1920s that was about 25% inflated from the true average. They just didn't have a great way of measuring the flows in 1920...
 
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rrrr

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Also, the problem with building anything new is the libtards. Not only do they oppose any new reservoirs, they want to teardown the ones we have!

As usual, they make absolutely no sense. They don't call em libtards for nothing...


Fuckers. 😡
Complete morons. The reservoir provides 30% of the Bay Area's water. If it was drained, the valley would require decades to grow vegetation, and that assumes the affected area wouldn't suffer drastic erosion during snowmelt runoff. The mud and silt from the erosion would destroy downstream fish, plant, and wildlife habitat.
 

angiebaby

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You are not wrong.

Even though we got Completely ripped off...

They sold it as a recreational lake, and it ended up being a zero body to water contact lake. It's mainly a reservoir for SD.



Fuckers. 😡
I remember. I lived 10 miles from it and was very excited to have something besides Smellsomemore and the cesspool Perris to recreate on. They originally had a waterskiier in their model when they sold it to the local public and explained how much local revenue it would bring in due to the recreation. Once it was approved and they had confiscated all the ranches in the valley, they changed their minds. Waterskiier disappeared from the model.

So I never went there. Not once. I refused.
 

angiebaby

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Complete morons. The reservoir provides 30% of the Bay Area's water. If it was drained, the valley would require decades to grow vegetation, and that assumes the affected area wouldn't suffer drastic erosion during snowmelt runoff. The mud and silt from the erosion would destroy downstream fish, plant, and wildlife habitat.
Yes. The beautiful valley has already been destroyed :(
 

angiebaby

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Why doesn't Kalifornia use desalination facilities?
 

rivermobster

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I remember. I lived 10 miles from it and was very excited to have something besides Smellsomemore and the cesspool Perris to recreate on. They originally had a waterskiier in their model when they sold it to the local public and explained how much local revenue it would bring in due to the recreation. Once it was approved and they had confiscated all the ranches in the valley, they changed their minds. Waterskiier disappeared from the model.

So I never went there. Not once. I refused.
Bastards...

I went and looked at the museum they put there. Lots of cool stuff they found digging the place up!

Last time I went was to see the dam under construction.

I'll never spend a dime there either. 👎
 

rivermobster

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2FORCEFULL

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Why would they if they legally get 4.4 million acre feet per year from the Colorado at a price that essentially is free by comparison? No incentive to change
why doesn't cal use salt water for pools and to flush toilets???
 
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