Self-driving Tesla crashes and burns for hours

[WhatExit?]

Key words: Cul-de-sac and no one behind the wheel

Two dead after driverless Tesla slammed into tree and burst into flames, police say
It took 4 hours for firefighters to extinguish the fire

Two dead after driverless Tesla slammed into tree and burst into flames, police say | Blaze Media

It took four hours for firefighters to extinguish the fire

www.theblaze.com

 

[RitcheyRch]

30K gallons of water to put the fire out. Not very eco-friendly.

 

[WYRD]

30K gallons of water to put the fire out. Not very eco-friendly.

Yeah burden on the taxpayers to four 4 hours of firefighter overtime and Hazard pay for something that should have taken 10 minutes

Not to mention the release of hazardous chemicals evaporating into the air but hey it's a green vehicle right?

 

[pronstar]

30K gallons of water to put the fire out. Not very eco-friendly.

If this happened in CA, there wouldn’t be any left for the state to drink!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[LowRiver2]

Concrete powder works good
I carry a bag in my Bomb truck now after several scooter batteries have ignited during render safe pricedures
Lithium ION burns very hot, water and air basically enhance the burn.
Ive witnessed enough of the smaller ones burning to be the last guy to own an EV

 

[Flatsix66]

Driver jumped into the backseat during a joyride and somehow made the "autopilot" driver presence inputs artificially. Sound like driver is at fault. I have a Tesla, no way in hell I would trust the "autopilot" feature beyond just being an adaptive cruise control, the Tesla system fucks up more than my Ram truck ACC.

 

[coolchange]

Concrete powder works good
I carry a bag in my Bomb truck now after several scooter batteries have ignited during render safe pricedures
Lithium ION burns very hot, water and air basically enhance the burn.
Ive witnessed enough of the smaller ones burning to be the last guy to own an EV

I thought water on those was not the way to go. Those first ev Saturn or Honda’s protocol was clear 50’ perimeter and burn through the asphalt.

 

[Racey]

Nobody Behind the wheel = Play Stupid Games, Win Stupid Prizes.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1383548841438236674

 

[LowRiver2]

I thought water on those was not the way to go. Those first ev Saturn or Honda’s protocol was clear 50’ perimeter and burn through the asphalt.

It’s not but some smaller department don’t have anything but mass amounts of water
it will eventually work, but yes powder and other forms of solids put it out faster

 

[Taboma]

This shit keeps up Elon's going to require an IQ test in order to qualify for purchase -- This is just plain fucking nuts and what scares me is how many of these potentially "Killer Cars" with so many apparently moronic drivers I'm sharing the highway with. My son said he heard drivers are hanging things off the steering wheel to fool the car into thinking somebody is actually there --- how come it can't tell there's nobody in the driver's seat ???????????????? My dumb ass car knows there is, or in the passenger seat. because the seat beat alarm will go off.

"He said his brother-in-law, who owned the vehicle, backed out of the driveway and likely hopped in the back seat, only to crash a few hundred yards down the road of the subdivision. He added that relatives watched as deputies worked for hours to put out the flames resulting from the accident."

 

[Taboma]

Nobody Behind the wheel = Play Stupid Games, Win Stupid Prizes.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1383548841438236674

Fine, they can kill themselves, I could care, the problem is how many of us are they going to take out with them playing these games ??????????

 

[coolchange]

This shit keeps up Elon's going to require an IQ test in order to qualify for purchase -- This is just plain fucking nuts and what scares me is how many of these potentially "Killer Cars" with so many apparently moronic drivers I'm sharing the highway with. My son said he heard drivers are hanging things off the steering wheel to fool the car into thinking somebody is actually there --- how come it can't tell there's nobody in the driver's seat ???????????????? My dumb ass car knows there is, or in the passenger seat. because the seat beat alarm will go off.

"He said his brother-in-law, who owned the vehicle, backed out of the driveway and likely hopped in the back seat, only to crash a few hundred yards down the road of the subdivision. He added that relatives watched as deputies worked for hours to put out the flames resulting from the accident."

The steering wheel “checks” by sensing resistance on the wheel. I know a guy who does that and reads while “driving”.

 

[Husqy510]

I thought water on those was not the way to go. Those first ev Saturn or Honda’s protocol was clear 50’ perimeter and burn through the asphalt.

When all else fails, copious amounts of water is always the answer. None of us carry enough powder or specialty foam to address that issue. Their was a tesla crash in the bay area, and the car kept re-igniting for days. I believe they eventually had to submerge the car in water at the wrecking yard.

That being said I own a Tesla and have no concerns putting by family in it.

 

[pronstar]

"He said his brother-in-law, who owned the vehicle, backed out of the driveway and likely hopped in the back seat, only to crash a few hundred yards down the road of the subdivision. He added that relatives watched as deputies worked for hours to put out the flames resulting from the accident."

I wonder why on earth are deputies fighting a fire for hours?

How far away is the fire station from a subdivided neighborhood...I thought they placed fire stations for 2 min max response times?



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[LowRiver2]

When all else fails, copious amounts of water is always the answer. None of us carry enough powder or specialty foam to address that issue. Their was a tesla crash in the bay area, and the car kept re-igniting for days. I believe they eventually had to submerge the car in water at the wrecking yard.

That being said I own a Tesla and have no concerns putting by family in it.

I’ve dealt with five scooter/ bike batteries that were attempts at IED’s or ended up being improvised chargers.
A 60 lb bag of crete powder puts these out, so yes, I carry ,have enough for what I encounter.
I saw the burns on the Cop’s arms trying to save a guy with a burning Tesla battery a few years back.
Real world experience for me to make a haed pass at sitting next to these batteries in a collision for now. The car batteries are as energetic or more than this scooter battery.

 

[Racey]

Fine, they can kill themselves, I could care, the problem is how many of us are they going to take out with them playing these games ??????????

Not very many, i'm not even sure if there has been a single death of the occupant of another vehicle where it was blamed on the autopilot. The autopilot has a far better track record than human drivers per hours driven, as Musk states, 10x better.

Every day someone innocent is killed many times by human drivers doing dumb shit.

 

[WhatExit?]

Cul-de-sac! Good way to “test” the autopilot feature

 

[sintax]

Concrete powder works good
I carry a bag in my Bomb truck now after several scooter batteries have ignited during render safe pricedures
Lithium ION burns very hot, water and air basically enhance the burn.
Ive witnessed enough of the smaller ones burning to be the last guy to own an EV

oh come on, just hose that Lithium down with water.... whats the worst that could happen

 

[Taboma]

Not very many, i'm not even sure if there has been a single death of the occupant of another vehicle where it was blamed on the autopilot. The autopilot has a far better track record than human drivers per hours driven, as Musk states, 10x better.

Every day someone innocent is killed many times by human drivers doing dumb shit.

I've read all the spreadsheets from the US and other countries. Was out yesterday and the old saying "Sunday Drivers" was fully engaged.

 

[Flynryan]

Driver jumped into the backseat during a joyride and somehow made the "autopilot" driver presence inputs artificially. Sound like driver is at fault. I have a Tesla, no way in hell I would trust the "autopilot" feature beyond just being an adaptive cruise control, the Tesla system fucks up more than my Ram truck ACC.

I fell asleep 1 night after a 14hr day and auto pilot engaged, when I woke up after a few seconds the car was straight as an arrow cruising down the freeway. These guys were doing something stupid as described above.
I dont believe full self drive is even available yet but I could be wrong

 

[Husqy510]

I’ve dealt with five scooter/ bike batteries that were attempts at IED’s or ended up being improvised chargers.
A 60 lb bag of crete powder puts these out, so yes, I carry ,have enough for what I encounter.
I saw the burns on the Cop’s arms trying to save a guy with a burning Tesla battery a few years back.
Real world experience for me to make a haed pass at sitting next to these batteries in a collision for now. The car batteries are as energetic or more than this scooter battery.
View attachment 994067

I absolutely understand those concerns, and I'm sure our concerns are based largely in our professions. I can tell you as a member of the LAFD I have yet to see anyone injured in a Tesla. I have seen one catch fire, and it took a long time to breach the occupant area.

That being said I have seen more than a few people trapped in burning cars, which almost always ends badly. I believe our chance of survival is based on a few factors. The first is not getting in an accident, and I believe the Tesla has proven to be good at avoiding accidents, when operated appropriately. Second is getting out of the vehicle after the accident, which the Tesla also excels at. Third would be the amount of time the occupants are shielded from fire, and again I think the Tesla gets the nod in most accidents.

 

[LowRiver2]

I absolutely understand those concerns, and I'm sure our concerns are based largely in our professions. I can tell you as a member of the LAFD I have yet to see anyone injured in a Tesla. I have seen one catch fire, and it took a long time to breach the occupant area.

That being said I have seen more than a few people trapped in burning cars, which almost always ends badly. I believe our chance of survival is based on a few factors. The first is not getting in an accident, and I believe the Tesla has proven to be good at avoiding accidents, when operated appropriately. Second is getting out of the vehicle after the accident, which the Tesla also excels at. Third would be the amount of time the occupants are shielded from fire, and again I think the Tesla gets the nod in most accidents.

The crash where the Cops got burns was borderline BH/LA jurisdiction
I got the adivce for concrete powder from my cohorts at 95 HAZMATEER guys

 

[MK1MOD0]

Nobody Behind the wheel = Play Stupid Games, Win Stupid Prizes.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1383548841438236674

Its posted by Tesla on the internet, so it must be true.

 

[throttle]

Two words...

High Voltage!!!


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[bonesfab]

It was late at night and by there age, so it probably went something like Hold my scotch and watch this.

 

[Christopher Lucero]

four hour firefight including a call to Tesla about extinguishing a fire? that is astonishingly negligent. In North Houston...the home of NASA ops no less. Ben franklin said it best

We can only hope this raises awareness so that response can be more prepared. sheesh.

 

[MeCasa16]

I absolutely understand those concerns, and I'm sure our concerns are based largely in our professions. I can tell you as a member of the LAFD I have yet to see anyone injured in a Tesla. I have seen one catch fire, and it took a long time to breach the occupant area.

That being said I have seen more than a few people trapped in burning cars, which almost always ends badly. I believe our chance of survival is based on a few factors. The first is not getting in an accident, and I believe the Tesla has proven to be good at avoiding accidents, when operated appropriately. Second is getting out of the vehicle after the accident, which the Tesla also excels at. Third would be the amount of time the occupants are shielded from fire, and again I think the Tesla gets the nod in most accidents.

If I were you, I'd be advocating the loudest to keep that autopilot off the road. Their autopilot cant decipher a stopped firetruck on the road and will crash directly into it.

Why Tesla's Autopilot Can't See a Stopped Firetruck

Semiautonomous driving systems are designed to ignore unmoving obstacles because otherwise, they couldn't work at all.

www.wired.com

 

[Racey]

Its posted by Tesla on the internet, so it must be true.

That's not much of an argument...

There is no shortage of Tesla haters out there, if those claims were false you can guarantee they would be exposed left right up and down.....

 

[rivermobster]

Its posted by Tesla on the internet, so it must be true.

Pretty much what I was thinking as well.

And that crash per miles stat? How does that even make sense!

 

[rivermobster]

That's not much of an argument...

There is no shortage of Tesla haters out there, if those claims were false you can guarantee they would be exposed left right up and down.....

If you Google NHTSA crash per mile...

They base their reports on crashes REPORTED only.

Tesla is tracking every mile their cars are driven.

I think that's a tiny bit skewed...

 

[Christopher Lucero]

If I were you, I'd be advocating the loudest to keep that autopilot off the road. Their autopilot cant decipher a stopped firetruck on the road and will crash directly into it.

Why Tesla's Autopilot Can't See a Stopped Firetruck

Semiautonomous driving systems are designed to ignore unmoving obstacles because otherwise, they couldn't work at all.

www.wired.com

WELLL...
I have a shameful admission. I had this exact thing happen to someone who was behind me on the freeway.

I am in my f150 traveling around 65 in lane 2 ( Carpool left of me as lane 1) I have a smaller vehicle behind me...don't recall what it was...but it was following typically for any freeway where (we ALL trust that) flowing traffic will continue flowing.

Up ahead, I see the traffic in my lane is slowing, so I check mirrors and there is one car in the lane to the right of me, about 40 feet behind me so I gas it and thread the needle to change lanes to the next lane to the right. Guy behind me had the same surprise (and same result) that the autopilot had with the firetruck in the article.

Firetrucks typically move pretty slow, so its probably no surprise that approaching traffic would 'reveal' the slower vehicle in a surprising way to traffic following. Tesla could improve the problem by making the autopilot follow much further back and processing novelty images (stuff appearing suddenly) as if they are emergencies. Tesla could also improve by utilizing a 'car ahead of the car I'm following' algorithm of some sort.

 

[monkeyswrench]

four hour firefight including a call to Tesla about extinguishing a fire? that is astonishingly negligent. In North Houston...the home of NASA ops no less. Ben franklin said it best
View attachment 994082
We can only hope this raises awareness so that response can be more prepared. sheesh.

Although this is true, and fire authorities need to be equipped for the new threats, people need to be more intelligent while operating a Tesla. Just because it has cool technology, is not a reason to assume it will make perfect decisions. It has no fear, no sensing of pain. Without those, it can never really learn.

 

[Christopher Lucero]

Although this is true, and fire authorities need to be equipped for the new threats, people need to be more intelligent while operating a Tesla. Just because it has cool technology, is not a reason to assume it will make perfect decisions. It has no fear, no sensing of pain. Without those, it can never really learn.

the creator of the technology is unlikely to create an intelligence superior to himself, even if some suffering is inbuilt. it is likely he will discount and take some things for granted, and the invention will be flawed more than the creator.
FWIW, this is exactly the reason that people do dumb things, as you intone. God created us in his image, but I think he stopped at external appearance and left everything else to trial and error...
that leaves room for some of us to make big errors. like darwin observed.

 

[MK1MOD0]

Well. If a friggin aircraft with untold amount of $$$$$$ spent on its systems will fly itself into the ground. A car doesn’t stand a chance.

 

[monkeyswrench]

the creator of the technology is unlikely to create an intelligence superior to himself, even if some suffering is inbuilt. it is likely he will discount and take some things for granted, and the invention will be flawed more than the creator.
FWIW, this is exactly the reason that people do dumb things, as you intone. God created us in his image, but I think he stopped at external appearance and left everything else to trial and error...
that leaves room for some of us to make big errors. like darwin observed.

If the driver truly did jump into the back seat, he is definitely a front runner for the Darwin Award this year.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Not very many, i'm not even sure if there has been a single death of the occupant of another vehicle where it was blamed on the autopilot. The autopilot has a far better track record than human drivers per hours driven, as Musk states, 10x better.

Every day someone innocent is killed many times by human drivers doing dumb shit.

Yup. The data absolutely shows autopilot to be better in terms of accidents per mile driven. Like Tesla or hate them.

If this dope had actually been behind the wheel (like he agreed to be when he used the software) these guys would be fine today.

 

[MK1MOD0]

Yup. The data absolutely shows autopilot to be better in terms of accidents per mile driven. Like Tesla or hate them.

If this dope had actually been behind the wheel (like he agreed to be when he used the software) these guys would be fine today.

the data........ you mean Tesla’s data. Oh ok.

 

[Uncle Dave]

 

[Uncle Dave]

the data........ you mean Tesla’s data. Oh ok.

The data is shared with the NHTSA.
You can always prove them wrong.

 

[MK1MOD0]

Oh ok. Dude. I know you’re Elon’s biggest fan. So I’ll just leave.

 

[Christopher Lucero]

how to defeat the tesla steering wheel sesnsors? Can you fill a couple of nitrile gloves with sand and then lash them to the wheel at 9 o'clock and 3 o'clock with velcro? That would eplain the car going straight even when the road is curving, since the wheel would react to the input of weight on each side.
it would provide a hillbilly solution to the " I want to limo my tesla by fooling it"...
Spring, Tx cops should be looking for nitrile and sand evidence in the charred detritus near the drivers position.

ON THE OTHER HAND this does seem to point to a very large white space in the design if this can happen...does it seem to be a brick on the accelerator thing? I mean, if FSD and Autopilot were not engaged, then ...how?

 

[Uncle Dave]

how to defeat the tesla steering wheel sesnsors? Can you fill a couple of nitrile gloves with sand and then lash them to the wheel at 9 o'clock and 3 o'clock with velcro? That would eplain the car going straight even when the road is curving, since the wheel would react to the input of weight on each side.
it would provide a hillbilly solution to the " I want to limo my tesla by fooling it"...
Spring, Tx cops should be looking for nitrile and sand evidence in the charred detritus near the drivers position.

ON THE OTHER HAND this does seem to point to a very large white space in the design if this can happen...does it seem to be a brick on the accelerator thing? I mean, if FSD and Autopilot were not engaged, then ...how?

at one point you could defeat it by jamming an orange in the wheel opening.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Oh ok. Dude. I know you’re Elon’s biggest fan. So I’ll just leave.

To be clear on my position -

Tesla as a company - love to see America on top
Spacex as a company - same.

Elon personally, not so much.

 

[Christopher Lucero]

To be clear on my position -

Tesla as a company - love to see America on top
Spacex as a company - same.

Elon personally, not so much.

It is truly lonely at the top

 

[LowRiver2]

I absolutely understand those concerns, and I'm sure our concerns are based largely in our professions. I can tell you as a member of the LAFD I have yet to see anyone injured in a Tesla. I have seen one catch fire, and it took a long time to breach the occupant area.

That being said I have seen more than a few people trapped in burning cars, which almost always ends badly. I believe our chance of survival is based on a few factors. The first is not getting in an accident, and I believe the Tesla has proven to be good at avoiding accidents, when operated appropriately. Second is getting out of the vehicle after the accident, which the Tesla also excels at. Third would be the amount of time the occupants are shielded from fire, and again I think the Tesla gets the nod in most accidents.

Im old school
My personal and work trucks have decent records in collision survival

 

[YeahYeah01]

Concrete powder works good
I carry a bag in my Bomb truck now after several scooter batteries have ignited during render safe pricedures
Lithium ION burns very hot, water and air basically enhance the burn.
Ive witnessed enough of the smaller ones burning to be the last guy to own an EV

Back when I was working haz waste, we dealt with a shit ton of water recitative earth metals. Always kept a shit load of kitty litter on hand in case it went up. Lucky I never had to use it.

 

[Uncle Dave]

It is truly lonely at the top

Im fascinated with the mans intellect and drive.

Im dismayed by his handling of the press and inability to control his mouth.
His lack of control threatens investors money. Its one thing for him to threaten his own
something else to threaten the investors when its so easily avoidable.

I would say since Larry Ellison put his hand on Elons shoulders the mouth has been kept in much better check and perhaps I should cut him some slack.

 

[Taboma]

That's not much of an argument...

There is no shortage of Tesla haters out there, if those claims were false you can guarantee they would be exposed left right up and down.....

I certainly don't hate the car, in fact I think the S and 3 are pretty damned cool looking and certainly quick. I also don't fault the car, or how the automation functions as much as it's effect on the human in command.
When I'm personally in full control of the vehicle, or even with cruise on, I'm fully engaged in it's operation. I'm attentive to the vehicle as well as other vehicles and I'm observing well ahead in anticipation of their moves and how they'll affect me. These activities and the responsibility for them and our safety, helps to keep me awake, aware and attentive.

The semi or fully autonomous nature of the Tesla and others, with more to follow, encourages inattentiveness at a minimum to that of being fully asleep. The driver is now dependent on the vehicle's choices, which although might be faster than a human in immediate reaction, certainly doesn't compare in the ability to anticipate based on driver or vehicle behavior we might detect far in advance.

As one example, I know with a high degree of accuracy, when a big rig up ahead is approaching a slower truck and about the time I arrive, will be without warning, swapping lanes. I can see things far ahead that will prepare me, in the vast majority of cases, the Tesla can only react to avoid, not avoid by anticipation.

No Tesla driver is going to drive even semi-autonomously from OC or LA to Vegas or Havasu and just sit there twiddling their thumbs, bored out of their minds and remain engaged. They're going to be watching a movie on their Ipads, or phones, or playing cards, hell I don't know, but they're not going to be as much a participant as they are simply a passenger.

Tesla anticipated that, so they programmed the car to assure you are awake and aware, but alas, hang a couple of weights off the wheel, car's hacked and you can just doze off with no worries. Except me apparently, I guess I just don't trust the tech that much and even if I owned one, I'm not sure I could just ask it to drive me to Havasu and sit back and relax.

 

[LowRiver2]

Back when I was working haz waste, we dealt with a shit ton of water recitative earth metals. Always kept a shit load of kitty litter on hand in case it went up. Lucky I never had to use it.

I was told from my Hazmateers (Sta. 95 and JHAT)
That the litter and powder both work good but the powder does better for flare ups after tamping down.

I went with powder , has never flared up.....,yet lol

 

[Christopher Lucero]

Im fascinated with the mans intellect and drive.

Im dismayed by his handling of the press and inability to control his mouth.
His lack of control threatens investors money. Its one thing for him to threaten his own
something else to threaten the investors when its so easily avoidable.

I would say since Larry Ellison put his hand on Elons shoulders the mouth has been kept in much better check and perhaps I should cut him some slack.