Snooping around.. Pontoons! Lol

[RiverDave]

Every person that spent more than $50K on their floating couch.

most of these are more than 4x times that

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

most of these are more than 4x times that

Correct. If there is performance left on the table from unbolting the engine and sliding it up and inch, certainly you might as well make an adjustment.

 

[Ladsm]

I would raise it just to save the prop from low water situations.

 

[throttle]

Have you tried another prop? Or two?

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[Singleton]

Have you tried another prop? Or two?

View attachment 996579


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Pontoons where supposed to be cheap booze cruise boats.
More $$ in that prop then the money I spent getting a toon for the family cabin in WI. The pontoon boat was the happy hour cruiser and a blast for all family members. Sold it when i sold my share of the cabin to my nephew.

 

[throttle]

Hey Dave, here is a set up on a 30’ Bennington QX. Pretty comparable to your set up except it’s a 10’ beam boat.

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[bk2drvr]

I talked to a Mercury Mechanic about this last week. One thing he mentioned was that steering gets better when the motors are set properly.

However If you go too high you risk cavitation when turning. There is a sweet spot for prop and motor height and each boat is different. Gotta play with it. I’m considering going up a bolt hole on my 25’ with single 300 and going to a 16 prop.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Pontoons where supposed to be cheap booze cruise boats.
More $$ in that prop then the money I spent getting a toon for the family cabin in WI. The pontoon boat was the happy hour cruiser and a blast for all family members. Sold it when i sold my share of the cabin to my nephew.

Demographics, they are changing.

These pontoon guys will soon be growing laws in Havasu so they can yell at people to stay off them.

 

[HALLETT BOY]

Maybe a dumb question but why would a jack plate void a warranty (other than "because they can" and it's in the mfr's best interest to void warranties )

Because if you raise the engine too high , you lose cooling water flowing around pick up holes . Easy to overheat .

 

[throttle]

The hydraulic jack plates are gonna give Dave the best results. But it’s not gonna be cheap.

I don’t think comparing other manufacturers set ups will be fair. The Avalon’s weight and construction is unlike any of the others that I have seen in my search for another toon.

A picture below is of a twin trifecta with jack plates.

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[Flying_Lavey]

Maybe with the old school two strokes.. I don’t see people doing that with 400-450 motors

You don't trust the strength of the skeg on a torque master that's designed to steer heavy boats through the water? 2 guys on the side just balance it. No weight on them. Unless they aren't paying attention and try to catch the motors balance.

That sounds like a circus...

Not at all really. 3 people is pretty easy too. Just the one guy has to go back and forth from the engine to the tongue jack. I've done it a few times on my boat.

gosh, dave. this got me thinking... with so much wetted surface do pontoons really ever get an advantage with a prop in surface operation? and if the hull DID fly does kiting become hazardous? IDK, maybe there is very little wetted surface. ??

Allowing the prop to pierce the surface allows a higher pitch to be ran while maintaining, or even reducing slip %. No matter the wetted surface of the hull. A surfacing/surface piercing prop will also provide additional transom lift from the blades hitting the surface which a pontoon can benefit from.

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[TomD]

If you add set back and jack plates I'd keep an eye out for cracks in the mounting areas. Invest in a water pressure gauges.

As RiverMobster said, its a toon kick back and enjoy the cruise.

 

[LowRiver2]

Pontoons where supposed to be cheap booze cruise boats.
More $$ in that prop then the money I spent getting a toon for the family cabin in WI. The pontoon boat was the happy hour cruiser and a blast for all family members. Sold it when i sold my share of the cabin to my nephew.

There are a few of us left:
$34k in 2011 with 130 hours on it.
300 hp small block, 43 mph top end.
Pulled skiers and tubes aplenty with it.
I still get asked about going to a toon from Fiberglass every time I park it.
After hearing what I paid for it, usually get asked if I’ll sell it.
Nope
Seats 17 and I don’t stress with it.
Been with me longer than my marriages
The owner of the trifecta pictured moved up to a double OB version since this pic.
Mine’s the OBS Suburban of boats: not pretty or fast, but reliable and the family stays together on it.

 

[Blackmagic94]

I went through this for a while. Played with props, want to pull the cats, tune the ecm etc. everyone’s answer was... Seems like a lot of wasted time, energy, effort, and money. If you want to go faster buy a different boat.

Literally the dumbest post of the day. Why would you not maximize something that is literally bolted on and adjustable.

 

[BHC Vic]

Literally the dumbest post of the day. Why would you not maximize something that is literally bolted on and adjustable.

Are you stupid? The answer is literally in the post you quoted. I don’t have time for stupid people today. Sorry

 

[throttle]

Just gonna leave this here for thought after lessons learned. my next one isn’t gonna be fast. Well, maybe 50.


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[JB in so cal]

Don't get a toon if you want.....oh, fer fux sakes!!!! Really? Is this where were at? Hey I got motorhome on the water and I want it to do a faster even though I've got 800 horsepower hanging off the back....

Oye vey!

 

[brgrcru]

Go for it . Dave
Fuck with it , until it's all fucked up.
Then you go back , to factory settings ,where it works great .

 

[brgrcru]

It is usually about 1k per mph

That's about right , especially after 80 mph .
Or you could just throw nitrous at it ,

 

[SKIDMARC]

You know how you know your old? You try to hot rod your pontoon boat!

Just kidding ....kinda

 

[robert1050]

Wait 'till you throw a gallons of fuel per hour gage on it. I helped a buddy install one on his tri-toon, when he was trying to find an economical RPM setting on his 300 Merc motor. He sold the 'toon shortly thereafter.

Needless to say, he never found an RPM/MPG setting he liked. And this was back, a half dozen or so, years ago, when gas was cheaper.

 

[RiverDave]

Have you tried another prop? Or two?

View attachment 996579


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20 cleavers coming soon..

 

[RiverDave]

If you add set back and jack plates I'd keep an eye out for cracks in the mounting areas. Invest in a water pressure gauges.

As RiverMobster said, its a toon kick back and enjoy the cruise.

only smart post so far!

 

[RiverDave]

View attachment 996651
There are a few of us left:
$34k in 2011 with 130 hours on it.
300 hp small block, 43 mph top end.
Pulled skiers and tubes aplenty with it.
I still get asked about going to a toon from Fiberglass every time I park it.
After hearing what I paid for it, usually get asked if I’ll sell it.
Nope
Seats 17 and I don’t stress with it.
Been with me longer than my marriages
The owner of the trifecta pictured moved up to a double OB version since this pic.
Mine’s the OBS Suburban of boats: not pretty or fast, but reliable and the family stays together on it.

love it!! But we are talking about a different category of boats as ya know.. I can sell yours for 75 right now though!

 

[RiverDave]

Wait 'till you throw a gallons of fuel per hour gage on it. I helped a buddy install one on his tri-toon, when he was trying to find an economical RPM setting on his 300 Merc motor. He sold the 'toon shortly thereafter.

Needless to say, he never found an RPM/MPG setting he liked. And this was back, a half dozen or so, years ago, when gas was cheaper.

screens x 3 already have it!

 

[CoolCruzin]

I went through this for a while. Played with props, want to pull the cats, tune the ecm etc. everyone’s answer was... Seems like a lot of wasted time, energy, effort, and money. If you want to go faster buy a different boat.

your boat , pull the cats off

 

[LowRiver2]

love it!! But we are talking about a different category of boats as ya know.. I can sell yours for 75 right now though!

I was only replying to Singleton. I fully support your quest for speed. I would do it if I was in your pay scale, lol.

Yeah Bennington wants $120k for my model boat new.
I don’t know who in the hell would buy an I/O toon anymore?

It was a good option in 07’ when mine was made. Not now.
I’d say I could fetch $55 for mine.
I want property over a new toon so I’ll keep cruising my tank lol.

 

[Christopher Lucero]

Allowing the prop to pierce the surface allows a higher pitch to be ran while maintaining, or even reducing slip %. No matter the wetted surface of the hull. A surfacing/surface piercing prop will also provide additional transom lift from the blades hitting the surface which a pontoon can benefit from.

thanks for the lesson.
making a flying brick go fast is always interesting. I was going to suggest that the tonneau and everything above deck be removed to reduce drag, but that is not what is going on here. Still, I am ready for these to start racing and for an APBA class to be established. Rowland has gone 114.

 

[185EZ]

I know it's not a perfect scenario for all types of boats especially twins but my theoretical and actual speed is right on with 11% slip

Prop Slip Calculator | Mercury Racing

Quickly determine slip for Mercury Racing propellers using our prop slip calculator.

www.mercuryracing.com

I'm at 5800 rpm and only gain 2 mph if I can get it to 6000 rpm
I think a toon is going to be harder to gain speed unless the factory set up is way off

 

[Tamalewagon]

Roll a couple of jack plates on those Dave. You'll be set for any kind of condition.

 

[Sigus]

I am running jackplates and 300’s on my Trifecta. Props are 25 Revolutions with a set of 27’s waiting to go on. These motors seem to be happiest when they are loaded up. I don’t think I will see the rev limiters with the 27s but my fuel to forward thrust will be very efficient. Once I get the 27’s on I will let you know how it goes.


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[Flying_Lavey]

I am running jackplates and 300’s on my Trifecta. Props are 25 Revolutions with a set of 27’s waiting to go on. These motors seem to be happiest when they are loaded up. I don’t think I will see the rev limiters with the 27s but my fuel to forward thrust will be very efficient. Once I get the 27’s on I will let you know how it goes.


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What are you running now with the 25's? I think that's a bigger wheel than most are running with the same power, or more in some cases.

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[RiverDave]

What are you running now with the 25's? I think that's a bigger wheel than most are running with the same power, or more in some cases.

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it has to be a different gear ratio

 

[Sigus]

What are you running now with the 25's? I think that's a bigger wheel than most are running with the same power, or more in some cases.

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65 at the rev limiters.


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[2FORCEFULL]

 

[2FORCEFULL]

Best way I have found to do a prop test is with pen and paper.......start at about 25mph, and record rpm and speed,... do the same every 10 mph increase to WOT... then check numbers on a prop slip calc. for results... that will tell you the silp #'s.... my honda went from over reving @ 36/38 mph, to 45 mph with a prop change, also went from a 3 blade to a four blade..

 

[LakeBeard]

love it!! But we are talking about a different category of boats as ya know.. I can sell yours for 75 right now though!

That's crazy, what are you selling mine for?
2004 24' Crestliner Merc 4.3 35 top end - System by Wired for Sound - (2) 12" ,(8) 8", (2) 6"

 

[lbhsbz]

Prop shaft height makes a huge difference. I put jack plates on my 28 Skater and went from 109 mph to 117 mph without changing anything else.

My little Lavey will run a bit over 60 WOT (with a 24P 4 blade ET style prop) with the propshaft buried....as I soon as I lift it up about 4 inches and get the propshaft a bit above the keel and give it a bit of trim I'm doing 83-84. I could go faster with more prop but the 24 has much better lower speed manners than a 28P chopper.

Jack plate was $200 on craigslist...lol

 

[Blackmagic94]

I wonder how fast a 25' 25" log single 450R would run with a jack plate and extension box

 

[PlanB]

I am waiting to see some single 600 powered toons and see how they compare with twins.

 

[RiverDave]

That's crazy, what are you selling mine for?
2004 24' Crestliner Merc 4.3 35 top end - System by Wired for Sound - (2) 12" ,(8) 8", (2) 6"

View attachment 997343

I originally thought his was one of the rare reverse lounger IO’s that Bennington made..

I don’t know what yours is worth but add about 10k to what it cost new and that would be pretty close

 

[lbhsbz]

What you need to do Dave is put delta pads on the outer toons and get a bit smaller center toon so it's dry when you're running on the pads. Get the propshafts even with the pads and add about 4" to the prop pitch.

Then it'll be fast.

 

[LowRiver2]

I originally thought his was one of the rare reverse lounger IO’s that Bennington made..

I don’t know what yours is worth but add about 10k to what it cost new and that would be pretty close

No lounger , but the 3’ long swim step is a hit with the kids.
At 39’ total length on trailer, my tank toon is 2’ longer than my bumper pull 32’ Attitude
Not everyone’s boat can look like a big rig

 

[2FORCEFULL]

 

[Bullhead bully]

With the torque master lower you can only go as high as the water pressure will allow you being that it picks up on the side of the gear case above the prop shop. The other thing is once you go to high you start losing efficiency on the Propellers in essence side paddling rather than pushing forward.

Jack plates definitely make it an easier to find the sweet spot . And no I’ve never heard of Jack’s Place voiding the warranty. Especially not on a pontoon.

 

[2FORCEFULL]

so according to the above pics.... the drive works harder the lower,... and goes faster the higher... so my thought is this,... if you have a way over powered rig,... raise the motors till they do ill performance,... if you do one hole at a time... keep going till ill happens then drop back down a hole.... the jack plate on my trick let the motorwiggle alot.... that would get real weird with twins..

 

[2FORCEFULL]

I personally don't know of any water intakes below the gear case.... some mercs and imco's have nose cone intakes though....if you look a pic 8-10 you will see the water intake is complete above the bottom of the boat,... thats why I like to put a center cav plate on boats, the water rise off the transom to the prop shaft is about 8'' and gets marbled by the time it hits the prop,... with the plate the water is cleaner at the prop... that and if the splash or cav plate is below the water it muches up the water and makes the slip rise.., that what was happening on the twin 270 I had..

 

[throttle]

I am waiting to see some single 600 powered toons and see how they compare with twins.

two weeks

 

[Christopher Lucero]

once you go to high you start losing efficiency on the Propellers

without power steering, jacking high becomes a real wrestling match as well.

 

[DuttonDave]

My friend has twins on his trifecta with hydraulic jack plates.
He said once he found the sweet spot he hasn't messed with them.
As long as my lower plate is even with my center tube I think that's the best spot.
I think you need to watch out the back and see where the water is hitting your lower unit at speed and go from there.
View attachment 996541

I agree... Can't wait for my new Trifecta with Twin 300’s