WELCOME TO RIVER DAVES PLACE

Thoughts on 2000 Howard 22 Offshore vs 2001 Laser Vision 22

Bedrock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2016
Messages
55
Reaction score
31
I am looking at these 2 boats and interested in getting feedback. The Howard 22 Offshore is a 2000 496 Merc with 180 hours in great condition and asking $30k, the Laser Vision 22 is a Merc 350 with 550 hours, original owner, listed as solid condition and asking $21k. I haven’t seen either boat In person yet as they are both quite a distance away from me. Looking for a lake/river boat for tubing, wake boarding and cruising around. As this is my first boat, the Laser is appealing because they are asking $9k less. Heard a lot of good things about Howard.
 

SS-C

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2020
Messages
228
Reaction score
399
I am looking at these 2 boats and interested in getting feedback. The Howard 22 Offshore is a 2000 496 Merc with 180 hours in great condition and asking $30k, the Laser Vision 22 is a Merc 350 with 550 hours, original owner, listed as solid condition and asking $21k. I haven’t seen either boat In person yet as they are both quite a distance away from me. Looking for a lake/river boat for tubing, wake boarding and cruising around. As this is my first boat, the Laser is appealing because they are asking $9k less. Heard a lot of good things about Howard.
The Howard is unequivocally top shelf, as for the Laser, well…

The Howard will always hold a great resale value, the Laser, well…

Howard with the big block vs Laser with small block, well…

The Howard will always put a smile on your face, the Laser, well…
 

DRYHEAT

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2010
Messages
3,720
Reaction score
5,533
The Howard has a deeper V in the entry and is a heavier layup and will handle rough water better.
There’s nothing wrong with the laser, it is a less expensive semi-custom entry-level boat that works well. If it has been taken care of and is more budget friendly it would be worth a look.
 

BHC Vic

cobra performance boats
Joined
May 24, 2014
Messages
22,384
Reaction score
13,165
I want my brother to buy the Howard, but since I don’t think he’s going to... I wouldn’t even consider the other
 

Done-it-again

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 3, 2016
Messages
4,331
Reaction score
3,808
Just don’t post the location or sales add for the howard. It would be bought from under neath you.

I would jump on the Howard, if it’s as clean as you say with those hours, it’s under priced.
 

fmo24

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2008
Messages
5,685
Reaction score
3,263
As stated if the price for the Howard is in your range you will be getting a lot more boat for the additional 9 thousand
 

Riverfamlee

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2019
Messages
1,481
Reaction score
3,208
Howard for sure.

we looked at a laser 2 boats ago before we bought our cobra. The 22 laser counts the swim step which made the inside tight. It’s more like a 21. They did the rear jumper seats that left like 6 inches to the rear bench. Wasn’t a fan.

as others have said, it’s priced low. If you’re serious you better pack a bag and get a move on.
 

Riverfamlee

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2019
Messages
1,481
Reaction score
3,208
Also, this will probably not be you’re forever boat. So as mentioned resale is important. A 550 hr laser after a few years becomes a 700 hr laser. Tough sell. A 180 hr Howard after a few years is a little over 300hrs. Prime resale hours with a Howard name=quick sale.
 

dribble

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
Messages
2,876
Reaction score
3,121
I’ve always liked the look of the Laser. I wouldn’t even consider it over the Howard.
 
Last edited:

RiverDave

In it to win it
Joined
Sep 13, 2007
Messages
104,475
Reaction score
85,780
If those 2 I’d take the Howard.. that laser is so cheap though like I said you can run it for years abd end up selling it for more. Lol
 

Bullet28

Nor Cal Delta
Joined
Apr 10, 2017
Messages
2,049
Reaction score
1,688
Obviously I’m a Howard guy and on my second one. I would by the Howard and never look back.
 

LargeOrangeFont

Steering RDP Towards Political Moderation 😁
Staff member
Joined
Sep 4, 2015
Messages
26,422
Reaction score
34,555
If you can afford it the Howard will be a better boat and ride better.

That said, the resale is not a concern. The Laser is not going to lose much more value unless you trash it.
 

FreeBird236

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2012
Messages
10,567
Reaction score
7,328
Not trying to be negative and I realize Howards are great boats, but is this the 22 offshore that has been known to have some handling issues?
 

92562

Distinguished Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2007
Messages
895
Reaction score
894
The Howard is by far the better value and boat. The Laser might not be a bad choice if you are concerned about getting "bruises" on your first boat and it's far batter than any "corporate" production boat. IMO, I would not buy a boat with a small block in that size range. As someone stated earlier, the Howard will always put a smile on your face!
 

Bedrock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2016
Messages
55
Reaction score
31
Not trying to be negative and I realize Howards are great boats, but is this the 22 offshore that has been known to have some handling issues?
Handling issues? Can you help me out on this, not sure what you mean. Thanks!
 

JJK94

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2011
Messages
229
Reaction score
140
Handling issues? Can you help me out on this, not sure what you mean. Thanks!
Over 70 it can tend to get a little loose but not a problem
if the laser includes the step the Howard is true 22 1/2 without
 

FreeBird236

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2012
Messages
10,567
Reaction score
7,328
Handling issues? Can you help me out on this, not sure what you mean. Thanks!
Someone with more knowledge of this particular boat then me should actually speak to this, but I thought certain models of the 22 offshore not only had problems with chine walking, but also had problems getting on plane. If I'm off base I apologize, the model I remember the discussion about may have been a different model.
 

ka0tyk

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2010
Messages
7,514
Reaction score
5,989
Someone with more knowledge of this particular boat then me should actually speak to this, but I thought certain models of the 22 offshore not only had problems with chine walking, but also had problems getting on plane. If I'm off base I apologize, the model I remember the discussion about may have been a different model.
my dads 220 offshore mcob Howard def chine walks at high speed. It just feels “loose” but that’s how the hull goes fast. No planing issues though.
 

RiverDave

In it to win it
Joined
Sep 13, 2007
Messages
104,475
Reaction score
85,780
The Howard is by far the better value and boat. The Laser might not be a bad choice if you are concerned about getting "bruises" on your first boat and it's far batter than any "corporate" production boat. IMO, I would not buy a boat with a small block in that size range. As someone stated earlier, the Howard will always put a smile on your face!
In the 21-23 size I always felt small blocks ran better than big blocks. They come on plane faster and are generally better balanced.
 

FreeBird236

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2012
Messages
10,567
Reaction score
7,328
I stand corrected, carry on.:oops:😁
 
Last edited:

farmo83

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2008
Messages
1,490
Reaction score
977
Howard has been around forever and people are still getting in line over a year out for their stuff, Is laser still even in business ?

Howard all day every day.
 

Jay Dub

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2020
Messages
217
Reaction score
272
X2, X3 Get the Howard. The build quality is top shelf. You will not regret buying.
 

3queens

Detachable Member
Joined
Jun 1, 2008
Messages
1,722
Reaction score
1,035
Wasn't or may still be -----didn't the brothers that ran Essex made the Laser line also ? if so stay faaaaaaaar away
 

92562

Distinguished Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2007
Messages
895
Reaction score
894
Wasn't or may still be -----didn't the brothers that ran Essex made the Laser line also ? if so stay faaaaaaaar away
Yes, Essex it their "premium" line and Laser is their "budget" line.
 

RiverDave

In it to win it
Joined
Sep 13, 2007
Messages
104,475
Reaction score
85,780
Wasn't or may still be -----didn't the brothers that ran Essex made the Laser line also ? if so stay faaaaaaaar away
I have honestly never heard a back thing or horror story about Essex in 20+ years around the industry.. LOL. As a matter of fact a lot of people kind of revered there no bull shit no price negotiation tactics back in the early to mid 2000's.

It's weird you almost never hear about them anymore even though they are still very much in business. I have never had much l luck getting to talk to the owners, but honestly after the secretary broomed me 3-4 times I never bothered calling back.. If they are that busy they obviously don't need me.. :D
RD
 

RiverDave

In it to win it
Joined
Sep 13, 2007
Messages
104,475
Reaction score
85,780
Howard for the win!
Honestly in this situation If they are both clean.. I'd do the Howard.

Financially the Laser makes more sense because you honestly can't lose with it.. the Howard you might lose 5-10K depending on economy and usage.. That laser is always gonna be right around the 20 mark though. It's not 1/2 the boat the Howard is though when it comes to rough water.

RD
 

havasuhusker

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2008
Messages
500
Reaction score
298
Honestly in this situation If they are both clean.. I'd do the Howard.

Financially the Laser makes more sense because you honestly can't lose with it.. the Howard you might lose 5-10K depending on economy and usage.. That laser is always gonna be right around the 20 mark though. It's not 1/2 the boat the Howard is though when it comes to rough water.

RD
I agree. With the way the river and the zoo are on most weekends, better to get a better handling boat IMO, if these are the two options to choose from.
 

Bedrock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2016
Messages
55
Reaction score
31
I really appreciate everyone's input. I was also looking at a 2003 Laveycraft 21 XTSkier that I thought was gone when the owner went silent on me. It is listed here on RDP, the trailer is the main issue and sounds like it needs replacing. Boat has approximately 500 hours and he is willing to work with me on price but not sure it would make sense to pursue if it ends up not much less than the Howard after I deal with the trailer. Anyone know where I can get a quote for a trailer?

Here is the link for the Lavey: https://www.riverdavesplace.com/forums/threads/laveycraft-21-xtski-walk-through-open-bow.222921/#post-3855009
 

Gonefishin5555

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2020
Messages
66
Reaction score
59
If it was me I would probably try to buy the laser for 19. That or I would look at some eliminators in that price range. Keep looking in my opinion you will know when you find the right deal.
 

SS-C

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2020
Messages
228
Reaction score
399
I really appreciate everyone's input. I was also looking at a 2003 Laveycraft 21 XTSkier that I thought was gone when the owner went silent on me. It is listed here on RDP, the trailer is the main issue and sounds like it needs replacing. Boat has approximately 500 hours and he is willing to work with me on price but not sure it would make sense to pursue if it ends up not much less than the Howard after I deal with the trailer. Anyone know where I can get a quote for a trailer?

Here is the link for the Lavey: https://www.riverdavesplace.com/forums/threads/laveycraft-21-xtski-walk-through-open-bow.222921/#post-3855009
I looked at the link you provided and from the pics it really doesn’t look all that bad, even the trailer.

It’s hard to tell though; either there are some gouges in the gell, or a reflection of sorts.

That seat stitching is an easy repair for an experienced upholsterer.

I would be concerned with the 500 hours.

You mentioned it needs a new trailer?

What’s wrong with it?
 

Bedrock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2016
Messages
55
Reaction score
31
Not sure but he said he had $1200 of work done on the trailer last year and I guess there are issues from the previous owner taking it in saltwater.
 

SS-C

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2020
Messages
228
Reaction score
399
I would pass on that boat.

I personally wouldn't want one that has been in salt.
 

BAS

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2009
Messages
416
Reaction score
145
The big blue is awesome! I’m just scared of sharks lol. I look at it as a excuse to head to Catalina, harbor cruises and lots of good times. If the motors are washed correctly, it just another hiccup durning maintained them. Trailers take the biggest beating but there are some options for that.
 

Backlash

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Messages
7,183
Reaction score
9,485
Almost 50 posts and majority of the folks have suggested the Howard. That should tell you something. That hull is going to ride FAR better than the Laser and will be a better all around boat. They tend to hold their resale value too, so if you wanted to sell the Howard down the road, you wouldn't lose your a$$. If I was in the market, that's what I'd buy.
 

Jay Dub

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2020
Messages
217
Reaction score
272
Not sure but he said he had $1200 of work done on the trailer last year and I guess there are issues from the previous owner taking it in saltwater.
I also would pass just because of the trailer issues. "new" trailers for used boat = no-go for me.
 
Top