Trailer Fabrication - Phoenix

[Orange Juice]

I've have an extra trailer that I picked up about 5 years ago to be used under my 21’ Eliminator. When I got it home and compared it to my original trailer, the axles were wider, and the Bunks were 14” shorter than the original. Im now ready to move on to this project.

This is what I'm starting with. It did have a 21’ Searay on it at one point in its life, and its been inside a climate-controlled building as well, before I got it. Nothing special except the steel appears like new ( we’ll see, price was free).

Stainless steel fenders polish up appear new ( even inside the wells).

Axles and springs will be cut off and replaced with narrower axles w/electric disc brakes on two shoes. I need to add 14” to the frame (some where).
The Tongue is already a swing-a-way style. The surge brake reservoir will need to be removed.

Who’s the fabricators in Phoenix?

 

[spectra3279]

Why narrow it? Wider trailer is more stable

 

[Orange Juice]

Why narrow it? Wider trailer is more stable

Storage space.
fenders stick out about another 6-10”, enough to make in difficult parking something next to it. Also, driving takes up a good chunk of highway.
I’ll probably try and trade the wider axles for something interesting I don’t really need,

Narrow trailer also gives you more wiggle room around the ramp.

 

[Orange Juice]

My original trailer did not have such a large gap between the frame rails, and the inside fender. That’s almost 5-6” to adjust on each side.

Also going to chop off this training wheels

I also need another 14-16” of bunk length. Changing the bunk length is going to change its towing weight and balance. I could change the mounting points on the frame, when I install the new axles.

 

[mash on it]

The center of the rear axle on mine is 55/56" to the rear of the bunks.
Competitive Trailer.
Lights/bumper? Is ~8" beyond the bunks.
21' Eliminator jet

Dan'l

 

[Orange Juice]

The center of the rear axle on mine is 55/56" to the rear of the bunks.
Competitive Trailer.
Lights/bumper? Is ~8" beyond the bunks.
21' Eliminator jet

Dan'l

This one has 48” center of rear axle to end of bunk/frame. I’ll check the original trailer when I have a chance.

Spacing between the two axles is 36”.

 

[Orange Juice]

Rechecked project trailer, and the original.

The rear axles to rear of trailer/bunks is 46” on both trailers. That’s probably going end up being my distance on the project trailer. (Mercruiser)

I checked the length of the long bunks.
Project trailer 10’-8”
Original trailer 13’-8”

Looks like I’m adding approximately 3’ to the trailer length some where.

The original trailer towed well for its first 30 years, and never saw salt, but it is 2x4 tubing, and past 10 years was no longer a distance hauler.

Stand by for axle dimensions and offsets.

 

[Orange Juice]

Didn’t get out to measure axles, but doing some research on basic design, and measurements.

 

[HydroSkreamin]

OK, I don’t know all of your requirements, but as an observer, here’s some ideas that pop into my head. (You kinda asked…)

If the trailer spindles have the typical 5x4.5” pattern, I’d consider using later model Mustang rims that are offset the other way. This would allow you to simply move the fenders while upgrading your wheels, and not have to disrupt your axle situation.

As far as the length, if it had a 21’ SeaRay on it, why can’t you use it as-is? Do you really need the extra bunk support? Otherwise I’d consider adding the length in the tongue with good material (thick wall). You didn’t say if your Eliminator was a Vee or Tunnel. I could see concerns if it’s a tunnel, otherwise run it!

I think you can convert it with minimal overthought. Good luck!

 

[Orange Juice]

I need to grow the bunks 3 feet to fit the boat, so I need to extend the frame rails. Other than that, my boats going to fit the trailer.

The plan is to cut the frame rails, and add 3’ of rail, and then reattaching the tongue.

The Axle width is the same on both trailers, and the rear of the trailer to the centerline of the rear axle are the same, so weight distribution should be identical (for the most part). If I run into a weight Distribution issue, I’ll redo all the axles, and add a third one for all the hassle. Those big training bumpers will be cut off.

That should be enough to get my boat on the trailer, and figure out the bow eye location, and if the bunks are located ideally.

 

[Orange Juice]

OK, I don’t know all of your requirements, but as an observer, here’s some ideas that pop into my head. (You kinda asked…)

If the trailer spindles have the typical 5x4.5” pattern, I’d consider using later model Mustang rims that are offset the other way. This would allow you to simply move the fenders while upgrading your wheels, and not have to disrupt your axle situation.

As far as the length, if it had a 21’ SeaRay on it, why can’t you use it as-is? Do you really need the extra bunk support? Otherwise I’d consider adding the length in the tongue with good material (thick wall). You didn’t say if your Eliminator was a Vee or Tunnel. I could see concerns if it’s a tunnel, otherwise run it!

I think you can convert it with minimal overthought. Good luck!

The searay hung over the back of the trailer about 15-20”. It didn’t fit right.

 

[HydroSkreamin]

Well there’s your starting point.

I’ve got a slew of Mustang wheels you’re welcome to try, I’m over in Glendale by Camelback Ranch.

I’m actually converting my car trailer from surge brakes to electric, changing the axles because my buddy is in the trailer business and it’s cheaper to change the entire axle instead of each spindle hardware set, and we’re actually putting wider axles in so I can run 17” rims with readily available and reasonably priced LT truck tires.

 

[Orange Juice]

Well there’s your starting point.

I’ve got a slew of Mustang wheels you’re welcome to try, I’m over in Glendale by Camelback Ranch.

I’m actually converting my car trailer from surge brakes to electric, changing the axles because my buddy is in the trailer business and it’s cheaper to change the entire axle instead of each spindle hardware set, and we’re actually putting wider axles in so I can run 17” rims with readily available and reasonably priced LT truck tires.

eBay has a bunch axle dealers.

I looked at electric brakes, but for my boat weight, surge should be ok. I don’t want to deal with batteries/switches/and relays. Just more crap to get wet and ruin my day, down the road.

My current boat trailer has surge, and they worked great. I think Disc brakes require the electric setup, because they are similar to “power brakes” on a car, and need a pump to supply pressure.

Question for the followers: does anyone have more than one axle with brakes, and if you have more, does one axle wear the pads faster than the other, or is there a way to balance the pressures? If that makes any since?

Not sure about the wheel lug patterns, but all my trailers use the same pattern, (and same tires), after I’m finished with this projects. I should be able to rotate my tires around a little easier. Especially if I’m doing more than 300 miles from home, and can borrow a wheel/tire for those long trips from the other trailer.

 

[HydroSkreamin]

Just to clarify my post, I’m switching to electric brakes for my car trailer, you really don’t want electric at the wheel/under water, I didn’t want you to think I was suggesting that.

Lighter trailers generally brake with one axle, heavier use two. Your 21 Eliminator shouldn’t require more than one.

Being able to take spares from other trailers along is definitely nice to have for long trips. I do that with the enclosed.

 

[Orange Juice]

I noticed a difference in Bunk supports. Those skinny supports on the project trailer held that big pig of a 21 searay, but I like how my originals from 1985 looked.

I’ll change these out on the project trailer, after I see how the boat fits on the extended trailer. Baby steps.

 

[Orange Juice]

Thinking about how to keep the frame straight after the cut is made.

Thinking the best way to approach it is to fabricate and weld in the bulk head, and then make the cut between the two pieces. I think that marker light cutout would be a safe place to make the cut.

I’ve got 220v 50 amp in my garage. I might practice a little bit on my own, using YouTube as my instructor, and a few outdated welding books from a better day.

Then hire a professional to actually do the work.

How hard can it be? It took me 30 minutes to master sweating pipe I can pull my boat out of the garage for a few weeks if necessary, and get the the front section welded onto 4 jacks stands, a new bulkhead welded in place, roll the trailer back 3’, and seam together the two pieces.

 

[Orange Juice]

Just to clarify my post, I’m switching to electric brakes for my car trailer, you really don’t want electric at the wheel/under water, I didn’t want you to think I was suggesting that.

Lighter trailers generally brake with one axle, heavier use two. Your 21 Eliminator shouldn’t require more than one.

Being able to take spares from other trailers along is definitely nice to have for long trips. I do that with the enclosed.

Does your car trailer use the 4” drop axles? Or is that primarily a boat trailer/situation?

 

[mash on it]

@Orange Juice

What is the length over all of each trailer?
Competitive measures 24' 11"
Roadrunner measures 24' 1"
Both were made for 21' day cruiser jets.

Sounds like the 21' SeaRay was on an 18'/19' boat trailer.

Hope this helps.

Dan'l

 

[Backlash]

I'm happy someone else is pondering the same exact things I am.

I'll be adding some length to my Ellis trailer, but it will be added at the rear. It doesn't "Need" it; it will support my Howard the way it sits. I'm doing it more for aesthetics. I had to cut off the V-drive guard and one crossmember that I didn't want/need. I simply replaced it with a section of steel that didn't hang down as low. I'm also adding a third axle "Just because." So I'm leaving the front leaf spring hangers and adding the remaining two hangers from those points on the frame. I'll also be adding brakes to the front axle. On this trailer, I kept the original American Racing Torq Thrust D wheels and polished them up. I like the look. I'll be moving the axles closer together and lowering the entire trailer.

This project has been slow-going, but I've learned there is a lot more to take into consideration when doing this work.

I haven't even finished THIS trailer and I'm already putting together a game-plan for another....

 

[Orange Juice]

I'm happy someone else is pondering the same exact things I am.

I'll be adding some length to my Ellis trailer, but it will be added at the rear. It doesn't "Need" it; it will support my Howard the way it sits. I'm doing it more for aesthetics. I had to cut off the V-drive guard and one crossmember that I didn't want/need. I simply replaced it with a section of steel that didn't hang down as low. I'm also adding a third axle "Just because." So I'm leaving the front leaf spring hangers and adding the remaining two hangers from those points on the frame. I'll also be adding brakes to the front axle. On this trailer, I kept the original American Racing Torq Thrust D wheels and polished them up. I like the look. I'll be moving the axles closer together and lowering the entire trailer.

This project has been slow-going, but I've learned there is a lot more to take into consideration when doing this work.

I haven't even finished THIS trailer and I'm already putting together a game-plan for another....

I looked at adding another axle. If you’re going to use leaf spring suspension, the distance is set by the length of the leaf spring. 36” is what I’m seeing is standard.

If you want to move the axles closer together, you’ll need to transition to torsion axles. They don’t use springs, therefore spacing is set by the builder.

 

[Backlash]

I looked at adding another axle. If you’re going to use leaf spring suspension, the distance is set by the length of the leaf spring. 36” is what I’m seeing is standard.

If you want to move the axles closer together, you’ll need to transition to torsion axles. They don’t use springs, therefore spacing is set by the builder.

I like making my life even more challenging than it already is by doing things differently....

I've got a few ideas that will help me complete the look I'm going for.

 

[cj222]

I looked at adding another axle. If you’re going to use leaf spring suspension, the distance is set by the length of the leaf spring. 36” is what I’m seeing is standard.

If you want to move the axles closer together, you’ll need to transition to torsion axles. They don’t use springs, therefore spacing is set by the builder.

I use 20-3/8 long leaf springs when doing a triple axle and I achieve 27" center to center on axle spacing. I run 25" tires which keeps the grouping nice and tight for a clean look.

 

[HydroSkreamin]

Does your car trailer use the 4” drop axles? Or is that primarily a boat trailer/situation?

I converted my car trailer from a deck boat trailer It does not have the drop axles, as it didn’t need to clear a V-bottom keel.