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Truck Prices...WTF

LargeOrangeFont

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Were you on the high school debate team? You sure love to argue and be right all the time.

You remind me of a politician, your argument always changes. You said that apples to apples you can buy a new truck for not much more than you could 10 years ago. That's not true, so you went on argue tow ratings LOL.
It hasn't changed.. If you want to tow 10K lbs, and spend around $40K buy a new 1/2 ton, the end 🤣. That's not me being right, that is the price and capability of the truck, just look it up for yoreself it is listed on all of the truck MFG websites, unless you think they are all lying on the standardized SAE tow rating tests.

If you want to tow your 21' boat with an $70K diesel, that is your choice.
 
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Racey

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Like I said.. everyone is free to buy what they want.
I agree, everyone should do what is best for them....

My old duramax isn't the fastest, or the strongest truck, but it's a good truck, and it gets just shy of a true 20mpg at 80mph on the hwy. I've had 14k on the hitch and went right up cajon without overheating doing 60-65 with the flow of traffic 😊. There are plenty of things that will out perform it, but none of them are 1/2 tons.

What you are suggesting defies physics... a heavier object in motion is easier to stop 😂
Not true when talking about tires and contact patch, and the ability of the vehicle to overcome the inertia of the dead weight it is carrying under a braking failure.


If was gonna buy again, and was gonna spend 40k, i would be buying a used cummins, not a new 1/2 ton. But that's just me, and there is an ass for every seat.

I only paid 15k for mine with 100k on it, i think those days are over 🤣
 

PaPaG

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Buddy of mine that swore that the new model gas Fords and Chevy trucks would outdo the older diesels any day of the week, at first he almost had me convinced getting 18mpg towing his car trailer and jeep but 12 months into ownership and towing 80% of max tow limit he blew a trans, then three months later he blew the motor...and he is now back to his old diesel with 200k miles on it that has never let him down. I guess it is personal preference. I personally cannot see spending 75-110k for a new truck when I am so happy with both the performance and reliability of the older diesels without all the added electronics and smog crap....but I guess it is all about personal choice.
 

LargeOrangeFont

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I agree, everyone should do what is best for them....

My old duramax isn't the fastest, or the strongest truck, but it's a good truck, and it gets just shy of a true 20mpg at 80mph on the hwy. I've had 14k on the hitch and went right up cajon without overheating doing 60-65 with the flow of traffic 😊. There are plenty of things that will out perform it, but none of them are 1/2 tons.



Not true when talking about tires and contact patch, and the ability of the vehicle to overcome the inertia of the dead weight it is carrying under a braking failure.
Dude, please don't become one of the towing idiots that can't read. NO ONE IS TALKING ABOUT TOWING 14K lbs. That is more than the tow rating of either the 3/4 ton or the 1/2 ton anyway. I'm talking 10k or less here, and using it for recreation, not weekly or daily for work.

Brakes don't stop a vehicles, the tires do. If the brakes fail on the trailer.. the tires have to find the traction to stop the entire combined weight. We can go round and round if the extra weight of the diesel is a help or a hindrance in that situation, and there are probably too many variables to figure it out definitively. The fact is the brakes on the older truck are smaller with less thermal mass and will fade more easily than the new truck's larger brake rotors and calipers. I've never met anyone on at any racetrack that said, "Gee I'd really like a heavier car with smaller brakes, I think it will work better".
 
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Brokeboatin221

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My question is who cares about towing in circles if you are towing around a 5000 lb boat, or even a smaller toy hauler or trailer under 10k lbs.

The question is do you want to spend $80k to use 30% of a 3/4 ton truck or $40k to use 75% of 1/2 ton a truck.

If you are just using the truck for recreation on weekends, which scenario makes more sense?

If you want to spend more just to say you have a $80k diesel that can tow 20k lbs to tow your 21’ bote or enclosed trailer, go ahead, just don’t bitch about the prices, because that $80k price tag is based on the capabilities of the truck that you won’t even use.

Everyone I know with a 3/4 ton mid 2000s Dmax can only tow about 11-12k lbs anyway. The cooling system can’t keep up if they get on it so they just tiptoe around when towing :) But yea there is more power in reserve than with a 1/2 ton. Last time I checked everyone here tows at 55MPH always anyway, and leaves 5 football fields of space in front of them on the road.

But the towing police will be here soon to say their 2-3 decade old diesel trucks with smaller brakes, Wet noodle chassis and no safety features are better in every way for any towing job imaginable 😂 compared to any modern truck.

View attachment 1031321
I will enjoy no payment and pull whatever I want with my old turd…. New trucks remind me of my daughters Barbie toys sorry.
 

Racey

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Dude, please done become one of the towing idiots that can't read. NO ONE IS TALKING ABOUT TOWING 14K lbs. I'm talking 10k or less here, and using it for recreation, not weekly or daily for work.

Brakes don't stop a vehicles, the tires do. If the brakes fail on the trailer.. the tires have to find the traction to stop the entire combined weight. We can go round and round if the extra weight of the diesel is a help or a hindrance in that situation. The fact is the brakes on the older truck are smaller with less thermal mass and will fade more easily than the new truck's larger brake rotors and calipers. I've never met anyone on at any racetrack that said, "Gee I'd really like a heavier car with smaller brakes, I think it will work better".
I take it you've never been in a situation where the dead of the trailer overpowered the mass of the vehicle.... on the race track you aren't towing around 1.5 the mass of the car as dead weight behind you. A longer wheelbase is your friend here too, long beds do better.

As for brake fade, none of them are going to have brake fade in an emergency stopping situation, brake fade is gonna happen when you have been riding the brakes for a prolonged period.
 

LargeOrangeFont

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I take it you've never been in a situation where the dead of the trailer overpowered the mass of the vehicle.... on the race track you aren't towing around 1.5 the mass of the car as dead weight behind you.

As for brake fade, none of them are going to have brake fade in an emergency stopping situation, brake fade is gonna happen when you have been riding the brakes for a prolonged period.
It's happened to me before.. I'm not convinced more weight would have resolved the situation any better. That is what ABS, and sway control and is for, (better systems in newer trucks) But again.. we are talking about towing within the limits of the vehicle here.
 

Racey

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It's happened to me before.. I'm not convinced more weight would have resolved the situation any better. That is what ABS, and sway control and is for, (better systems in newer trucks) But again.. we are talking about towing within the limits of the vehicle here.
More vehicle weight makes it harder for the load to start a jacknife, gives the load less authority over the vehicle. The flip side is you pay for it when you aren't towing by dragging an extra 1500lbs around.

BTW: I should have known better than to take the bait on an F-150 argument 🤣 🤣 🤣, still love ya dude.
 

bldrinker

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You can absolutely compare the 2 by their tow ratings. If you are towing 10k lbs a modern 1/2 ton can handle it, which was about what a 3/4 ton SRW 2008 Duramax was rated for. A modern half ton with a higher end engine will ride better, stop faster, and out accelerate the 08 Dmax. The new 1/2 ton has bigger brakes and a stiffer chassis.

Covid pricing aside, you can get a 1/2 ton with the same CAPABILITIES and features as a 12-15 year old 3/4 ton for about the same price.

Would I tow 10k every day with a half ton? No. Is the 1/2 ton that can tow about 10k fine for occasional recreational towing, yes.

If you are going to talk about the Dmax being underrated, that is irrelevant, we are going by the ratings here, I’m not advocating anyone tow beyond what their vehicle was rated for, as that is breaking the law. You picture has your truck towing a 21’ boat A modern 1/2 ton will tow that with ease.

If you want to idle up the cajon pass while towing 5k lbs, spend $80k for a diesel and don’t cry about it. Or spend mid $40s on a 1/2 ton and give the truck 1/2 throttle up the pass. It is up to you.
You just fuckin went there....

Dave must pay you start shit
 

LargeOrangeFont

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More vehicle weight makes it harder for the load to start a jacknife, gives the load less authority over the vehicle. The flip side is you pay for it when you aren't towing by dragging an extra 1500lbs around.

BTW: I should have known better than to take the bait on an F-150 argument 🤣 🤣 🤣, still love ya dude.
Again, I'm not arguing its not "better" I'm just arguing if its "needed". Agreed the extra weight helps on the jacknife aspect, but A Freightliner towing your jet ski is better still. You just have to draw the line somewhere.

🤣 Its all good brother.
 

Brokeboatin221

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I know you’re not talking crap I just can’t believe how much these new trucks are and there’s no way in hell I want a 1k payment on something that still hasn’t been proven or something I can’t even work on myself because that’s where it’s going. After just doing the smog on my truck I refuse to buy anything new because you can’t really touch it.
 

LargeOrangeFont

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You just fuckin went there....

Dave must pay you start shit
The towing police fall for it every time.. "I've towed 30,000 lbs with my 97 F950, for 345,000 miles! 1/2 tons can't do that!!!"

That's not what we are talking about here.
 

bldrinker

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The towing police fall for it every time.. "I've towed 30,000 lbs with my 97 F950, for 345,000 miles! 1/2 tons can't do that!!!"

That's not what we are talking about here.
Well what are we talking about? Set us straight ‘ole wise one.
 

was thatguy

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Mid blue book on my C7 (2014) is $10k more than I paid almost 2 years ago, and the price on similar cars on line are $5K above that. (12K miles, Z51 vert)

A new C8 ordered is about $20K cheaper than a 1 year old used C8 last time I looked. Might be different now.
 

LargeOrangeFont

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Well what are we talking about? Set us straight ‘ole wise one.
Read the thread. I'm not talking about towing over 10K lbs and I'm not talking about exceeding the rated tow limits of 15 year old trucks. It is really simple - A 15 year old 3/4 ton is rated to tow 10,000 to ,11,000 lbs. A new half ton is rated to tow a little beyond 10,000 lbs. If you are using your truck to tow several times a year under 10,000 lbs, Do you really need a 3/4 ton?

I don't care who wore it better, I don't care if you tow over the rating with yore old truck, that is not what I am advocating.

A new half ton will tow that rated weight. for about the same price you paid 15 years ago with more creature features than you had 15 years ago. All you have to do is press the gas pedal a little harder.

If you want to spend $70K to idle up a hill with a new diesel truck that can tow 20k lbs be my guest. But don't cry the truck is too expensive. You are paying 2X for a truck that can tow 2X of your 15 year old old one. Seems like a fair deal to me. And if you just want to tow your jet ski with it, go ahead.
 
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DRYHEAT

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Mid blue book on my C7 (2014) is $10k more than I paid almost 2 years ago, and the price on similar cars on line are $5K above that. (12K miles, Z51 vert)

A new C8 ordered is about $20K cheaper than a 1 year old used C8 last time I looked. Might be different now.
And it can tow a 10,000 lbs toy hauler because it’s got big brakes and power. 😉
 

bldrinker

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Read the thread. I'm not talking about towing over 10K lbs and I'm not talking about exceeding the rated tow limits of 15 year old trucks. It is really simple - A 15 year old 3/4 ton is rated to tow 10,000 to ,11,000 lbs. A new half ton is rated to tow a little beyond 10,000 lbs. If you are using your truck to tow several times a year under 10,000 lbs, Do you really need a 3/4 ton?

I don't care who wore it better, I don't care if you tow over the rating with yore old truck, that is not what I am advocating.

A new half ton will tow that rated weight. for about the same price you paid 15 years ago with more creature features than you had 15 years ago. All you have to do is press the gas pedal a little harder.

If you want to spend $70K to idle up a hill with a new diesel truck that can tow 20k lbs be my guest. But don't cry the truck is too expensive. You are paying 2X for a truck that can tow 2X of your 15 year old old one. Seems like a fair deal to me. And if you just want to tow your jet ski with it, go ahead.
My ram 1500 was rated for 8800. Only difference between it and the model that was rated for 10k was 3.92 vs my 3:55.
10k is absolutely fucking retarded. I’m sorry.

I was at 7500ish and the truck was barely in control. The gears difference would make no difference in control.

I know you will argue but 10k in a half ton is retarded.
they have the power and the stop. But put it in the wind and kiss your ass good bye.
 

LargeOrangeFont

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My ram 1500 was rated for 8800. Only difference between it and the model that was rated for 10k was 3.92 vs my 3:55.
10k is absolutely fucking retarded. I’m sorry.

I was at 7500ish and the truck was barely in control. The gears difference would make no difference in control.

I know you will argue but 10k in a half ton is retarded.
they have the power and the stop. But put it in the wind and kiss your ass good bye.
You evidence is dismissed because you brought up a Fiat truck :)

You know they make things called sway bars and air bags to add stability while towing.

You are free to do whatever you want, as is anyone else.
 

Ace in the Hole

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My ram 1500 was rated for 8800. Only difference between it and the model that was rated for 10k was 3.92 vs my 3:55.
10k is absolutely fucking retarded. I’m sorry.

I was at 7500ish and the truck was barely in control. The gears difference would make no difference in control.

I know you will argue but 10k in a half ton is retarded.
they have the power and the stop. But put it in the wind and kiss your ass good bye.
We will tow our boat to and from the ramp with the Tahoe whenever we fly in vs drive in..even equipped with max tow etc it's load and under no circumstances would I get on the 40 with it..its right at capacity I think.. Can't beat the weight, towing/stopping ability of a newer HD truck.

I'm one of those buy what you can afford, and what you want....bc in the end I don't give a damn what someone else thinks if its what I feel like I need to get the job safely done.
 

bldrinker

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You evidence is dismissed because you brought up a Fiat truck :)

You know they make things called sway bars and air bags to add stability while towing.

You are free to do whatever you want, as is anyone else.
Dismiss my point with a Fiat comment. Noted.

keep looking in your tow ratings for things like wind and type of trailer 10k box trailer is wildly different than a 10k boat or utility trailer with a piece of equipment.
 

attitude

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Dismiss my point with a Fiat comment. Noted.

keep looking in your tow ratings for things like wind and type of trailer 10k box trailer is wildly different than a 10k boat or utility trailer with a piece of equipment.
10k in a half ton is stupid lol. As far as f150s go my dads f150 has 70k ish miles never has town more than 7k lbs and the rear end is on the way out, damn fords…
 

LargeOrangeFont

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Dismiss my point with a Fiat comment. Noted.

keep looking in your tow ratings for things like wind and type of trailer 10k box trailer is wildly different than a 10k boat or utility trailer with a piece of equipment.
Noted! Those standardized towing ratings don’t account for anything like that I’m sure!

SAE J2807 isn’t a thing I guess..


They use the same testing standard for all trucks and tow up Davis Dam in the wind, or in a simulation thereof.

As far as the Maxtow F150s, they even have an upgraded frame and a bunch of other changes to the cooling system and other upgrades, unlike the Fiat truck that is just a final drive change. 😉
 
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LargeOrangeFont

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10k in a half ton is stupid lol. As far as f150s go my dads f150 has 70k ish miles never has town more than 7k lbs and the rear end is on the way out, damn fords…
He should have bought a Chevy.
 

boatnam2

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While were on the subject, what the best place to sale a used car these days? Not including CarMax, Carvana.
 

rrrr

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I bought my 2001 V-10 4X4 Excursion Limited in 2008 for $10K. It now has 74,000 miles on it.

In the last six months, I've been offered $15K and $16K for it by guys in a parking lot, and notes with phone numbers have been left under a wiper four times.
 

Javajoe

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I'm going to sell a 2011 Silverado, extended cab with a topper (tool doors/shelves each side) and ladder rack with 200,000 miles. Runs great, maint records.

I was thinking of listing it at $9k but sounds like maybe I should bump that up.
I sold my 04 Toyota Tundra w 178,000 for 8k in 20 minutes on Craigslist in Nov. Bought it 7 years ago for 10 w 78k miles
 

LargeOrangeFont

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I sold my 04 Toyota Tundra w 178,000 for 8k in 20 minutes on Craigslist in Nov. Bought it 7 years ago for 10 w 78k miles
Can’t beat that.. this was a few years before Covid, but I bought our first 4runner and put 100k miles on it and sold it for $3k less than I paid for it.
 

Ladsm

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The truck bubble is about over, Manheim Auto auctions lots are filling back up with used truck inventory and that will start driving the used market back down. Prices dropped 30% in July already.
 
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poncho

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Paid 55K for my 2018 Sierra Denali and just sent the last payment this month. Dealers have been hitting me up for over a year with offers at what I paid or more.

I would still need to replace it so I ignored the offers. I will say I'm glad my toys can be towed with a half ton gas truck, the prices for 3/4 ton trucks are insane.

Truck has 16K on it so i'm feeling pretty good, might be ahead of the payoff versus value curve for once.
 
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Ziggy

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The truck bubble is about over, Manheim Auto auctions lots are filling back up with used truck inventory and that will start driving the used market back down. Prices dropped 30% in July already.
Imagine how much the prices will get affected once 1 to 2 yr old brand new trucks with brand new computer chips get dumped into the market.
Hell, I panicked if I still had last years model on site in inventory come January 1.
 

poncho

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Imagine how much the prices will get affected once 1 to 2 yr old brand new trucks with brand new computer chips get dumped into the market.
Hell, I panicked if I still had last years model on site in inventory come January 1.
I bought my 18 in November and the new body style was already on the lot, I had their ear.
 

DWC

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The truck bubble is about over, Manheim Auto auctions lots are filling back up with used truck inventory and that will start driving the used market back down. Prices dropped 30% in July already.
This was a low $70’s truck 30 days ago. Definitely coming down.
BE6D4165-2D75-4763-A8FE-25A11872499C.jpeg
 

LargeOrangeFont

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Imagine how much the prices will get affected once 1 to 2 yr old brand new trucks with brand new computer chips get dumped into the market.
Hell, I panicked if I still had last years model on site in inventory come January 1.
This.. The market is gonna be flooded.
 

GRADS

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just got a call from the local Ford dealership telling me they're "in dire need of my truck". It's tempting.
 

SummitKarl

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Imagine how much the prices will get affected once 1 to 2 yr old brand new trucks with brand new computer chips get dumped into the market.
Hell, I panicked if I still had last years model on site in inventory come January 1.
kind of my conclusion as well, 6-12 month delay ;), In the mean time I'll just turn Barney into the x-cab,2x, pre-runner version of post 44, which I should have done 20yrs ago lol
 

Dennis-19

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This was a low $70’s truck 30 days ago. Definitely coming down. View attachment 1031674
All those vehicles have branded/salvage titles. I was looking at a truck that they had earlier This week and came to find out that dealer only Sells vehicles with screwed up titles. That’s why the prices are so low there. They’re up in Ogden Utah they claim to buy them at the auctions and fix them all up.
 

bldrinker

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The truck bubble is about over, Manheim Auto auctions lots are filling back up with used truck inventory and that will start driving the used market back down. Prices dropped 30% in July already.
Shush!!!
Sale pending😉
 

pkbullet

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Most of the prebuilt inventory waiting on chips is presold. The supply of trucks based on past and current production schedules do not meet demand much less make up for the national 10 day supply of in stock units. The only reason dealers have any stock is from raising prices to slow demand. Used prices will be volatile since most dealers have doubled or tripled there normal used inventory. Dealers are very concerned with missing the timing on liquidating this inventory. A ten or fifteen percent correction can be very expensive when you have 5-10 million in used inventory, which is very common. Dealers historically don’t turn down truck allocation, production cannot meet demand without a major economic collapse. Manufacturers are still cutting current build weeks, much less the full year of lost production that has occurred. Additionally, major parts shortages are effecting the manufacturers besides chips. My current months allocation across the five brands we own is between 15-30% of a normal monthly build. They would have to produce 2-300% of normal to start to fill the supply side.
 
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