WELCOME TO RIVER DAVES PLACE

Trying to hire people... wtf

Christopher Lucero

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2018
Messages
671
Reaction score
400
change in American culture that is anti-trade skill and physical labor.
I respect your perspective. We need a solution. Now I am no partisan, but there was a speech the other day that seemed to intone the exact same observed problem.

ME? I think that we are at a bit of a crossroads...we have been specializing people into tinier and tinier skill sets, so an electrician or a A/C guy on staff is specialized in the same way a software engineer or a physicist or a journalist is specialized, artifactual of the 100 year old 'factory business model' started by Ford's assembly line. Thus it is hard for the employer and the employee to find common ground...and hence leads to scavenging or cannibalization by competitors when good staff are known by their public reputation.

we made people into 'human resources', and then we found out they were not resources at all
 

74 spectra20 v-drive

74 spectra20 v-drive
Joined
Nov 27, 2008
Messages
1,570
Reaction score
1,540
Why any business would want anyone who would work for $15/hour baffles me.

Find someone that’s worth 25+, pay them that or more, and they’ll get twice as much done with half the fuckups, being a better value in the end.
There are business's where this is a solid business model, I work for a 4 Billion plus Sales and Marketing company and we have thousands upon thousands of folks that work in this $30k a year window. Not everyone on the street has the talent or desire to make 6 figures plus, the problem is that our society has diluted salaries so much that there is not a lot of reality left. There are more people that live a life style conducive to this salary range than most are aware of, and they are very happy and it works well for them. For us its entry level positions to move thru the organization but we have some folks who have been in role for decades and do love what they do and live quality lives.
 

Hammer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2010
Messages
20,353
Reaction score
8,182
That’s what people don’t understand.

If you bring value to a business, then you’re worth the high cost of labor. And the company will be loyal to you, because they want you to stay.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Unfortunately, that is not always the case.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Done-it-again

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 3, 2016
Messages
4,671
Reaction score
4,241
We agree. The people we currently have are useless and will not change if we pay them more. If we fire them and replace them with more $15/hr people we will get equally shitty morons. If we fire them and hire some $25/hr people, who wouldn't even consider the job at $15/hr, then we will likely get a better quality employee who will deliver better quality work, thus being a better value for the company.
I have a different thought than you apparently. Imo you will get the same worker, but paying them more with the same mistake. A $25hr doesn’t always mean
a better work ethic.
 

WYRD

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
1,910
Reaction score
3,531
This is what they are paying High School students in Lake Havasu...

View attachment 997863
In-N-Out has always paid their employees higher than the industry average. I think the service might be a tad friendlier at In-N-Out then say McDonald's but I don't think the Fry Guys or the burger flippers are any less qualified at one than the other.

I have also studied up a little bit on Millennials in the workforce most of them are not money driven theyre rewards driven. Offering free lunch to a millennial can really go a long ways. This is the model that big tech companies like Google Facebook Twitter all have adopted. Open schedules lots of perks but low mediocre pay.
 

jones performance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2008
Messages
1,778
Reaction score
1,648
I have also studied up a little bit on Millennials in the workforce most of them are not money driven theyre rewards driven. Offering free lunch to a millennial can really go a long ways. This is the model that big tech companies like Google Facebook Twitter all have adopted. Open schedules lots of perks but low mediocre pay.
nailed it.. i started working for a millennial ran company this year. its been an interesting experience to say the least. gotta watch what i say so not to hurt their soft feelings, or offend any of them.. hard to do when your running a gov compliance program for them. the pay is not what it should be for sure but the perks aint bad. got probably the best health insurance around these days with minimal cost to me, dental, vision, 401k, upcoming stock options, unlimited paid time off, sick time, and i work form home in havasu (ca company). if i was in socal where they're located id get free lunches daily, free gyms, and a bunch of other shit, i just couldnt pay the rent with the pay lol
 

Desert Whaler

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2020
Messages
641
Reaction score
1,707
I'm hopping in here a little late . . . I read the first 2 pages then decided to throw my $.02 . . . when i was out of high-school in 1988 , ( I won't go into the long story) . . . I got into the ceramic tile trade . . . in a short amount of time, journeyman setters would pay me $1 / sq. ft. to grout the 6" quarry tile that they had set . . . . I regularly got between 400-600 sq. ft. per day . . . . one day I did 880 sq. ft. . . . so at 19 years old I was making between $400-$800 per day cash. . . my investment of tools consisted of knee pads, extension chords, buckets, trash cans, moving blankets, gloves, sponges, hose, a milwaukee drill motor, and a boom box . . . . . ohhhh those where the days. . . .LOL.
 

lakemadness

Grobe Bruste Bitte
Joined
Sep 25, 2009
Messages
3,480
Reaction score
2,343
I'm hopping in here a little late . . . I read the first 2 pages then decided to throw my $.02 . . . when i was out of high-school in 1988 , ( I won't go into the long story) . . . I got into the ceramic tile trade . . . in a short amount of time, journeyman setters would pay me $1 / sq. ft. to grout the 6" quarry tile that they had set . . . . I regularly got between 400-600 sq. ft. per day . . . . one day I did 880 sq. ft. . . . so at 19 years old I was making between $400-$800 per day cash. . . my investment of tools consisted of knee pads, extension chords, buckets, trash cans, moving blankets, gloves, sponges, hose, a milwaukee drill motor, and a boom box . . . . . ohhhh those where the days. . . .LOL.
That’s some good coin for the late 80’s. A lot of time on knee pads too. I’m curious though, what does that have to do with hiring people today?
 
Last edited:

hallett21

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2010
Messages
9,617
Reaction score
6,637
That’s some good coin for the late 80’s. A lot time on knee pads too. I’m curious though, what’s does that have to do with hiring people today?
The money then in construction was worth the effort. Or I guess more profitable than it is today.

A good setter today will make 300-350a day (non union).

He was grouting and making more and we’re not figuring in inflation.


And I think that’s the issue. I grew up wanting to make more money and now we’re living in a world where you make $25 hr to sit home. Before the pandemic it’s 11.25 an hour assuming you could pull full unemployment in CA.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Desert Whaler

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2020
Messages
641
Reaction score
1,707
That’s some good coin for the late 80’s. A lot of time on knee pads too. I’m curious though, what does that have to do with hiring people today?
. . . probably nothing more than to demonstrate how backwards things have gotten. My bad if I de-railed the topic, I apologize . . . 30+ years in a 'God Forsaken Trade' and all I have to show for it is the lint in my pockets and a very bad back. I wish things were different.
 

Bowtiepower00

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 20, 2015
Messages
991
Reaction score
1,236
People are wired differently nowadays. I put family first- but my job is a close second, as long as it doesn’t interfere with my family. That being said, I think most people go though times when their career has to become the priority- but hopefully only as a temporary means to get ahead. My wife and I Instill work ethic as a main life lesson to our 9 year old. Right now, his job is to go to school and be the best student he can while maintaining a life/ school balance. My experience is that hard workers usually end up ahead of those with more talent but less work ethic- minus luck. And I explain to him that life is not fair, to expect in life that their will usually be the outlier- the lazy POS who is worse at his job but makes more. And it’s up to him to overcome that and not let it make him bitter.
 

LowRiver2

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2007
Messages
8,171
Reaction score
14,626
That’s some good coin for the late 80’s. A lot of time on knee pads too. I’m curious though, what does that have to do with hiring people today?
No country for old men.
Millennials are up to age 40. Gen Z has differences beyond what millennials “quirks” are.

Nope, I’n not a business owner, but know first hand the issues/ drives/ concerns of hiring 100-250 of these generation a year for the last 15 years in my workplace.
If you don’t have a handle on their motivations, need to hire immigrants with gen x drives, down size, or continue wondering why no one applies.
 

Bowtiepower00

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 20, 2015
Messages
991
Reaction score
1,236
The millennial thing is a slippery slope, and really depends on the age and upbringing of the person in question. I’m technically a millennial- at the top of the age bracket- but I don’t relate to them. I was raised/ managed by brutally honest to-the-point boomers, and that’s what I relate to. But having managed lots of millennials, as well as those from just about every other generation, I see both (all) sides. There is no single answer. And a shitty employee is a shitty employee. Regardless of generation, I find that positive reinforcement for a job well done is well received by employees of every age.
 

YeahYeah01

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2020
Messages
770
Reaction score
720
People are wired differently nowadays. I put family first- but my job is a close second, as long as it doesn’t interfere with my family. That being said, I think most people go though times when their career has to become the priority- but hopefully only as a temporary means to get ahead. My wife and I Instill work ethic as a main life lesson to our 9 year old. Right now, his job is to go to school and be the best student he can while maintaining a life/ school balance. My experience is that hard workers usually end up ahead of those with more talent but less work ethic- minus luck. And I explain to him that life is not fair, to expect in life that their will usually be the outlier- the lazy POS who is worse at his job but makes more. And it’s up to him to overcome that and not let it make him bitter.
You're not wrong at all.

I have guys that are pretty good at there job, but they always sure up on time, will work what ever OT is needed, treats customers well and have a great attitude. But they are not the fastest or most efficient. These are my go to people. Are take a we great attitude and consistent production over a one hit wonder that works fast but then it's late the next day.

And great job with your kid! My daughter is 4 and my we are already working on the "you need to work hard" mindset.
 

78Southwind

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2007
Messages
3,170
Reaction score
2,103
In-N-Out has always paid their employees higher than the industry average. I think the service might be a tad friendlier at In-N-Out then say McDonald's but I don't think the Fry Guys or the burger flippers are any less qualified at one than the other.

I have also studied up a little bit on Millennials in the workforce most of them are not money driven theyre rewards driven. Offering free lunch to a millennial can really go a long ways. This is the model that big tech companies like Google Facebook Twitter all have adopted. Open schedules lots of perks but low mediocre pay.
What I was trying to say without really saying it, is the In-N-Out model of success. Pay your employees really good, train them really well and promote within the business. I have seen people that I thought would never do well, succeed greatly with that concept. In the 40+ years of going to In-N-Out I have never received my order wrong. I can't say that about any other fast food joint.

Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
 

LuauLounge

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2010
Messages
1,657
Reaction score
2,224
What I was trying to say without really saying it, is the In-N-Out model of success. Pay your employees really good, train them really well and promote within the business. I have seen people that I thought would never do well, succeed greatly with that concept. In the 40+ years of going to In-N-Out I have never received my order wrong. I can't say that about any other fast food joint.

Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
And I’ve never been in one of their stores where someone is just standing around. They are talking orders, cleaning up or polishing the tables.
 

Your ad here

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2014
Messages
2,685
Reaction score
3,205
What I was trying to say without really saying it, is the In-N-Out model of success. Pay your employees really good, train them really well and promote within the business. I have seen people that I thought would never do well, succeed greatly with that concept. In the 40+ years of going to In-N-Out I have never received my order wrong. I can't say that about any other fast food joint.

Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
Going to take a guess here but I bet In N Out fires a lot of crappy employees regularly and that is also a key to their success. Something a lot of employers fail to do. I'd rather be under staffed and over worked than over staffed and picking up crappy peoples work thus being over worked again.
 

Ace in the Hole

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
711
Reaction score
1,121
In-N-Out has always paid their employees higher than the industry average. I think the service might be a tad friendlier at In-N-Out then say McDonald's but I don't think the Fry Guys or the burger flippers are any less qualified at one than the other.

I have also studied up a little bit on Millennials in the workforce most of them are not money driven theyre rewards driven. Offering free lunch to a millennial can really go a long ways. This is the model that big tech companies like Google Facebook Twitter all have adopted. Open schedules lots of perks but low mediocre pay.
Im in the middle age range of millenials...I don't give a flying fuck about free lunch, game rooms etc. I'm there for money and money alone. A lot of the reason I work for myself.
 

Christopher Lucero

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2018
Messages
671
Reaction score
400
It may be more cultural than mere $$$.
a friend has stated it like this: nobody wants to work with their hands anymore.
OP @lakemadness never did say what biz he was in
for example - if he were a midwest meatpacker, much of the frustration would be explained. it is well documented that it is hard to find industrial butchers...it is a persistent problem for Perdue, Tyson, Cargill...most find immigrants will take the jobs that the locals refuse
same old story.
 

78Southwind

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2007
Messages
3,170
Reaction score
2,103
Going to take a guess here but I bet In N Out fires a lot of crappy employees regularly and that is also a key to their success. Something a lot of employers fail to do. I'd rather be under staffed and over worked than over staffed and picking up crappy peoples work thus being over worked again.
I am going to take a wild guess too... I think that In-N-Out probably doesn't have to fire lazy workers they probably quit on their own or don't even apply. When I go to In-N-Out, I see a culture of hard work and great customer service.

Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
 

monkeyswrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2018
Messages
11,075
Reaction score
22,449
The free money and the current youth's mindsets are the issue I think. Not the pay...kids, youth...some 20 and 30 somethings, are fat and happy. I'm 44 now. At 21, making 12 and change, my mortgage payment was 975$. Do the math, it wasn't pretty.

Hustle, work, get dirty...maybe even bleed, but keep climbing. What you want to make depends on what you want. I wanted a home, a wife and kids. I have a home...and doublewide at the river...3 good kids and, thank God, 1 wife that puts up with me. 24 years...from 12$ an hour, to lower 6 figures...to a lot less now.

The money paid isn't the issue, it's who wants to make it. The hustlers are few and far between... That's the main reason I haven't pursued a business here. Hard to find a "crew" you can depend on. Let alone a crew that would push more than 40hrs.
 

badgas

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
222
Reaction score
379
I am going to take a wild guess too... I think that In-N-Out probably doesn't have to fire lazy workers they probably quit on their own or don't even apply. When I go to In-N-Out, I see a culture of hard work and great customer service.

Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
Nailed it. They have a good hiring process and people know they have to work. It is not a POS franchise like Mcdonalds, The company has good leadership and you can tell.

I have buddy who works at Costco in HB and he works hard. He said at Costco you wont last to long if you like to try and hide and not get your tasks done. He tells me that everyone is being watched and measured at all times. I hear the line " if you want a job go to Home depot and if you want to work go to Costco"

I don't really like going to Costco but it is because of the customers not the employees. I have never heard " Soory i'm on on a break " or " oh This is not my department at a Costco ever.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DWC

was thatguy

living in a cage of fear
Joined
Apr 28, 2008
Messages
40,499
Reaction score
58,701
Gotta ask: What heck kinda job pays $74/hr!
You kidding?
Bobby won’t get out of bed for that!

Directional drilling used to pay well over $100 an hour (usually a day rate, $1200+ a day, 12 hour shifts)
My first horizontal job I lied and said I had experience. Shadowed the lead hand for 12 hours, learned the math in one night, and was a HZ hand the next day.
Got myself a $400 a day raise...
Ah...the good old days.
Now they have young guys that’ll do it for $35 an hour because they think the 50 hours a week of overtime is a lot of money.
A $250K a year job with a 28/14 schedule is now a $150K a year job with no real schedule.
They pushed us old guys out.
 

Kachina26

Inmate #RDP158
Joined
Sep 28, 2007
Messages
6,033
Reaction score
5,464
HB

I don't disagree with you.

But I still think people getting free $$ should be drug tested. My son has to test clean for his construction job and he has acquaintances who sit home and smoke weed on the taxpayer dime. That was the point I was trying to make.

Good times
It's not free money, you have to pay in to get it.
 

monkeyswrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2018
Messages
11,075
Reaction score
22,449
You kidding?
Bobby won’t get out of bed for that!

Directional drilling used to pay well over $100 an hour (usually a day rate, $1200+ a day, 12 hour shifts)
My first horizontal job I lied and said I had experience. Shadowed the lead hand for 12 hours, learned the math in one night, and was a HZ hand the next day.
Got myself a $400 a day raise...
Ah...the good old days.
Now they have young guys that’ll do it for $35 an hour because they think the 50 hours a week of overtime is a lot of money.
A $250K a year job with a 28/14 schedule is now a $150K a year job with no real schedule.
They pushed us old guys out.
You should have seen the look on my kids' faces when my friend told them what he made. He's a crane operator, operating engineers type. Most of the youth today are taught you need a degree or a doctorate to be anything in life. Maybe that's true to some. Nothing wrong with getting dirty, or learning a trade.
 

monkeyswrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2018
Messages
11,075
Reaction score
22,449
or being skilled at the high tech thing and the trade thing. anymore, you need to do both, understand and be competent at both, just to stay in one place.
It seems as though being skilled in both is increasingly difficult. Technology seems to change and advance at a more rapid pace than most anything else. Trades are kind of interesting at this point in history. Automotive mechanics are being pushed out by manufacturers. The newer cars are more like a computer, both figuratively and literally. Fewer parts can be repaired cost effectively, and are just replaced. This makes a mechanic less a mechanic, and more a technician. That and the cars basically being disposable now, not good for the independent shop owner.

Construction trades still have a good run ahead of them. The human body can still do many things Boston Dynamics has trouble replicating. The human body, and our imperfect brain, can learn things that a computer still cannot. A computer, at this point, is still very rigid in it's parameters. It still needs the "correct" ingredients to make an assembly. A tradesman with more than a few days on the job has learned how to improvise. Most do it to a level that still meets code, even though the blueprints call for other means.

Of course, all this goes away if the overlords want us in high density housing in major metropolitan areas. Easier to control the cattle when in pens...
 

HBCraig

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2008
Messages
5,763
Reaction score
3,875
You should have seen the look on my kids' faces when my friend told them what he made. He's a crane operator, operating engineers type. Most of the youth today are taught you need a degree or a doctorate to be anything in life. Maybe that's true to some. Nothing wrong with getting dirty, or learning a trade.

It seems as though being skilled in both is increasingly difficult. Technology seems to change and advance at a more rapid pace than most anything else. Trades are kind of interesting at this point in history. Automotive mechanics are being pushed out by manufacturers. The newer cars are more like a computer, both figuratively and literally. Fewer parts can be repaired cost effectively, and are just replaced. This makes a mechanic less a mechanic, and more a technician. That and the cars basically being disposable now, not good for the independent shop owner.

Construction trades still have a good run ahead of them. The human body can still do many things Boston Dynamics has trouble replicating. The human body, and our imperfect brain, can learn things that a computer still cannot. A computer, at this point, is still very rigid in it's parameters. It still needs the "correct" ingredients to make an assembly. A tradesman with more than a few days on the job has learned how to improvise. Most do it to a level that still meets code, even though the blueprints call for other means.

Of course, all this goes away if the overlords want us in high density housing in major metropolitan areas. Easier to control the cattle when in pens...
Funny you guys mention this. The crane operators that have multiple endorsements (e.g., crawler cranes, tower cranes, mobile cranes, etc) can make a ton of money. Especially if and when they get OT. $1000 on a Saturday is not unheard of.

That being said, many of my customers are in dire need of skilled labor like operators, techs, iron workers. Many of them put on a sort of job fair. I sponsor every single one i can. This job fair brings in local high school kids that dont want to go to college. We tell them about the opportunities out there. Its pretty cool when you see these kids that are wide eyed. We tell them that if they dont choose college they have every opportunity to learn a trade, make good money and not rack up student loans
 

Christopher Lucero

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2018
Messages
671
Reaction score
400
It seems as though ...
I hear you. AS I posted above, corporate and factory legacy has 'human resourced' us into tinier and tinier specializations. Likewise, productivity and the VERY effective markets we have in our world 'chase down' cost so effectively that spares and repairs are no longer a discipline except in the most expensive or bespoke equipment. We are commoditizing everything, and the result is that commoditization works its way into the product attributes.
Should we resist? Become angry? Fight? Everyone has to determine what their response will be as they see as most useful to their time and their self interest.
I have found the best approach is to adapt, become competent widely, and advocate for others to do the same. It is not impossible...unless you vow not to try, then you put roadblocks in your own way.
AS FAR AS the future of trades and a tech threat...I feel like humanity can reap the benefit from automata and tech or squander the opportunity to let robots do routine boring things while we set ourselves to things more meaningful. That includes special and bespoke and custom work that is mostly craft (like your posts at mercenary mechanic). There is definitely a market for the Bayliners and the Costco products, and they fit a market segment well, but the opportunity to 'do your own thing' your way increases as we eliminate toil from our limited time here.
A 'computer' is unlikely to develop feelings, or true art appreciation. a Von Neumann machine can tell you what us humans like, and how lopsided our judgements are, but it will never really be original in its feelings...those are irrational habits and require a mystical essence that is beyond mere randomness that a computer could generate to simulate the habit.
High Density Housing will work for some. Let's not judge them if that is their choice. Now that tech is reducing the 'office space' necessity, and we are seeing 'work from home' as a widespread likely new norm, commercial property could well be reallocated by property owners to fill that need for housing.
 
Last edited:

Christopher Lucero

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2018
Messages
671
Reaction score
400
Funny you guys mention this. The crane operators that have multiple endorsements (e.g., crawler cranes, tower cranes, mobile cranes, etc) can make a ton of money. Especially if and when they get OT. $1000 on a Saturday is not unheard of.

That being said, many of my customers are in dire need of skilled labor like operators, techs, iron workers. Many of them put on a sort of job fair. I sponsor every single one i can. This job fair brings in local high school kids that dont want to go to college. We tell them about the opportunities out there. Its pretty cool when you see these kids that are wide eyed. We tell them that if they dont choose college they have every opportunity to learn a trade, make good money and not rack up student loans
my BIL has been a HEO Crane specialist in Oregon for over 20 yrs. It fits him well, and he really does like it. Its not for everyone though...lots of time waiting for safety and for measurement and clearance. You have to be a patient man, and disciplined enough to stay focused on the operation. He told me about how he got completely unhinged when he found out one of the other operators was distracted by cellphone crap and it resulted in a loss. Hurt the company reputation, as well as a family and a customer.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DWC

Cole Trickle

Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
21,995
Reaction score
11,745
It's not as easy out there as some people are making it sound. Sure you can work a dead end job for $15 bucks an hour but who in there right mind would take a huge pay cut sitting at home vs working a shit job at home depot/taco bell where you never go anywhere.

The corporate model has changed and this happened in the late 80's when companies stopped offering pensions and would fire you after 20 years of service and hire a kid for half the money. How many millennials/Gen Z's saw there parents give everything to work only to be shit canned when they were 50 or even worse see there parents divorce and all that hard work be for nothing anyways.

The new plan is to outsource/automate or hire cheap labor while managers on up make most of the $$$$. How many billionaires did we have in 1990...How many do we have now yet they offer shit pay and lousy benefits.

My wife got laid off back in october after 16 years and a flawless history with the company. They have let go of over 700 people in the last 2 years sending jobs over seas and guess who they kept? Young kids with less than 5 years on the job making a ton less. How good you were at the job didn't matter one bit. The same thing happened to my mom working for universal right before they sold to GE. Ditch the payroll and make the books look good and sell high. I'm a firm believer in working hard but corporate greed is certainly a thing.

Back to my wife being laid off from a 80K+ job. She applied and busted her ass for a new job(countless applications/networking). Every place has 50+ people going for 1-5 jobs. We were surviving on UE but it was tight. She gets hired on with a fortune 250 company for a position that required 7 years + experience. She had to do insane back ground and what i would call bs progressive testing to see if you would fit in. She gets the job that didn't say a thing about pay until hired and they offered her 40k...lol She told them hell no she made more than that starting off in the biz in 20 years ago. They countered with a final offer of 43k and said they have 45 people that want to fill 10 jobs. She took the job because i needed to get pre approved to build our new house and i needed $$$ on paper. Her first paycheck came in and it's $200 less than UE...hahaha

They invested a ton of money trained her (easy job and the team and managers are already treating and using her as a third manager) mailed out a swag pack with bullshit tumblers,sweatshirt and backpacks. Meanwhile she had been interviewing for several other jobs for far more pay that suits her skill set. Day 1 of being live and she gives notice as she has accepted a job for more than double. They didn't even try and counter and they made her work the entire 2 weeks which i thought was kind of weird.

What i'm saying is most big companies view employees as nothing more than a [place holder. They could really give two shits if you disappear tomorrow and are looking to cut costs to increase profits 24/7 and i don't see it getting better moving forward.
 

gqchris

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
5,600
Reaction score
5,599
I Offering free lunch to a millennial can really go a long ways. This is the model that big tech companies like Google Facebook Twitter all have adopted. Open schedules lots of perks but low mediocre pay.
When I worked in Vegas, I always liked the fact that the Casino would feed you as much as you wanted in the Employee Dining Room. So you can eat before, during and after shift. And it was NO cafeteria, It was a high class order what you want restaurant/buffet! We also had napping stations at the desert inn and you could check in and out when needed. Perks that I have never seen anywhere else!
 

gqchris

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
5,600
Reaction score
5,599
It's not as easy out there as some people are making it sound. Sure you can work a dead end job for $15 bucks an hour but who in there right mind would take a huge pay cut sitting at home vs working a shit job at home depot/taco bell where you never go anywhere.

The corporate model has changed and this happened in the late 80's when companies stopped offering pensions and would fire you after 20 years of service and hire a kid for half the money. How many millennials/Gen Z's saw there parents give everything to work only to be shit canned when they were 50 or even worse see there parents divorce and all that hard work be for nothing anyways.

The new plan is to outsource/automate or hire cheap labor while managers on up make most of the $$$$. How many billionaires did we have in 1990...How many do we have now yet they offer shit pay and lousy benefits.

My wife got laid off back in october after 16 years and a flawless history with the company. They have let go of over 700 people in the last 2 years sending jobs over seas and guess who they kept? Young kids with less than 5 years on the job making a ton less. How good you were at the job didn't matter one bit. The same thing happened to my mom working for universal right before they sold to GE. Ditch the payroll and make the books look good and sell high. I'm a firm believer in working hard but corporate greed is certainly a thing.

Back to my wife being laid off from a 80K+ job. She applied and busted her ass for a new job(countless applications/networking). Every place has 50+ people going for 1-5 jobs. We were surviving on UE but it was tight. She gets hired on with a fortune 250 company for a position that required 7 years + experience. She had to do insane back ground and what i would call bs progressive testing to see if you would fit in. She gets the job that didn't say a thing about pay until hired and they offered her 40k...lol She told them hell no she made more than that starting off in the biz in 20 years ago. They countered with a final offer of 43k and said they have 45 people that want to fill 10 jobs. She took the job because i needed to get pre approved to build our new house and i needed $$$ on paper. Her first paycheck came in and it's $200 less than UE...hahaha

They invested a ton of money trained her (easy job and the team and managers are already treating and using her as a third manager) mailed out a swag pack with bullshit tumblers,sweatshirt and backpacks. Meanwhile she had been interviewing for several other jobs for far more pay that suits her skill set. Day 1 of being live and she gives notice as she has accepted a job for more than double. They didn't even try and counter and they made her work the entire 2 weeks which i thought was kind of weird.

What i'm saying is most big companies view employees as nothing more than a [place holder. They could really give two shits if you disappear tomorrow and are looking to cut costs to increase profits 24/7 and i don't see it getting better moving forward.
You hit this on the head sir. There is no more loyalty and the way our Parents lived and worked is no longer. We are all just a statistic and a number. Gone are the days of pensions. Hell, when my mom was working for Kmart many years back as a part time job, she even got a pension! She received it up till she passed away. No more, there is no longevity and the shit scares me even just typing it out!

Good luck with your wifes new job sir and hang in there!
 

Christopher Lucero

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2018
Messages
671
Reaction score
400
they made her work the entire 2 weeks
sounds like a policy that - if violated - could be a source for legal action. company likely protected both parties by compliance.
Your wife did exactly what a free market in labor would advise. seek self interest. Likewise, the companies have been advocating for individual responsibility for a long time...started long ago.
it is not a political statement to say that individual responsibility is in both business' and employee and consumer interest. There are too many examples of big pensions being impossible to manage properly.
That is what led Keough to implement the plan, and the establishment of ERISA (1974).
 

DWC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2012
Messages
5,733
Reaction score
8,501
It's not as easy out there as some people are making it sound. Sure you can work a dead end job for $15 bucks an hour but who in there right mind would take a huge pay cut sitting at home vs working a shit job at home depot/taco bell where you never go anywhere.

The corporate model has changed and this happened in the late 80's when companies stopped offering pensions and would fire you after 20 years of service and hire a kid for half the money. How many millennials/Gen Z's saw there parents give everything to work only to be shit canned when they were 50 or even worse see there parents divorce and all that hard work be for nothing anyways.

The new plan is to outsource/automate or hire cheap labor while managers on up make most of the $$$$. How many billionaires did we have in 1990...How many do we have now yet they offer shit pay and lousy benefits.

My wife got laid off back in october after 16 years and a flawless history with the company. They have let go of over 700 people in the last 2 years sending jobs over seas and guess who they kept? Young kids with less than 5 years on the job making a ton less. How good you were at the job didn't matter one bit. The same thing happened to my mom working for universal right before they sold to GE. Ditch the payroll and make the books look good and sell high. I'm a firm believer in working hard but corporate greed is certainly a thing.

What i'm saying is most big companies view employees as nothing more than a [place holder. They could really give two shits if you disappear tomorrow and are looking to cut costs to increase profits 24/7 and i don't see it getting better moving forward
Unfortunately, this is every publicly traded company. They need to “leverage” every line on the P&L, every year. Very rarely does any company drop margin, lower turns or increase payroll % on purpose. Wall Street doesn’t reward it, actually quite the opposite.
The next few years are going to be really tough for a lot of companies. Corporate tax increases will need to be offset. If a business has seen record sales over the last year it’s a double “oh shit”. It’ll be painful when the market drops. It will be brutal if the market tanks. Best way to stop a stock from bleeding is announcing cost cutting measures or through acquisitions.
 

DWC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2012
Messages
5,733
Reaction score
8,501
The money paid isn't the issue, it's who wants to make it. The hustlers are few and far between... That's the main reason I haven't pursued a business here. Hard to find a "crew" you can depend on. Let alone a crew that would push more than 40hrs.
Spot on.. Trying to find people that want to work hard, willing to sacrifice and stick with something is getting tougher everyday. The store managers at big box retailers are making a $200k with salary/bonuses. Guessing managers at in and out are about the same. There’s money to made in pretty much every industry. We used to work off the clock as hourly associates and 6 days a week on salary was common. Getting people to show up for a shift is a win nowadays. Call out rates and open positions at all time highs.
We did a round table a couple years ago. Kid on overnights wanted to be promoted. There’s only one salaried position per location. He didn’t want to change locations, didn’t want to switch to days, didn’t want to move to another position. Didn’t understand why we just didn’t add another job. My boss explained that he missed his daughters softball game and his other daughters school event that day because of work. There are sacrifices if you want to move up. Depends on what you want and what you’re willing to do.
 

Bpracing1127

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 31, 2012
Messages
5,524
Reaction score
6,058
Hired a guy 2 weeks ago. Let him go today. Hiring again
Inv tech @18.00 per hour in Carlsbad/vista area
 

CoolCruzin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2008
Messages
2,697
Reaction score
1,694
$15 hr is nothing .
If you can find someone they will not stick around long .
 

monkeyswrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2018
Messages
11,075
Reaction score
22,449
Spot on.. Trying to find people that want to work hard, willing to sacrifice and stick with something is getting tougher everyday. The store managers at big box retailers are making a $200k with salary/bonuses. Guessing managers at in and out are about the same. There’s money to made in pretty much every industry. We used to work off the clock as hourly associates and 6 days a week on salary was common. Getting people to show up for a shift is a win nowadays. Call out rates and open positions at all time highs.
We did a round table a couple years ago. Kid on overnights wanted to be promoted. There’s only one salaried position per location. He didn’t want to change locations, didn’t want to switch to days, didn’t want to move to another position. Didn’t understand why we just didn’t add another job. My boss explained that he missed his daughters softball game and his other daughters school event that day because of work. There are sacrifices if you want to move up. Depends on what you want and what you’re willing to do.
That's what I don't get. Work is work...some days are better than others, but still work. In general, you trade your time and effort for money, which you use to buy what you need or want. Anytime I was at a standstill, in terms of what could be made at my job, I found side work, and started looking for another job. There was always work.

I hear people say they wouldn't show up for X amount. Sure, right now they have food to eat and a place to live. Take that safety away, or give someone the fear of not feeding their kids...It suddenly changes your perspective. 10 years ago I was biding some work that would fill the tank in my truck, and a couple shopping carts at the store...it would work out to being about 10$ an hour after materials. Hard as hell, hot as hell, miserable labor...but I didn't ask for help from anyone, and I got whatever job I bid. It wasn't pretty, but it worked.

I think too many are quick to go for hand outs, dependant upon the state or others. If the meal tickets stop, what can you depend on?
 

Cobalt232

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2018
Messages
545
Reaction score
587
Hiring is really tough right now. We have been trying to hire 2-3 entry-level people per month for the past 4 months and only end up hiring 1-2 per month.

Saw this last week in In Milpitas:

IMG_0304.jpg
 

SBMech

Fixes Broken Stuff
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
9,699
Reaction score
14,977
That's what I don't get. Work is work...some days are better than others, but still work. In general, you trade your time and effort for money, which you use to buy what you need or want. Anytime I was at a standstill, in terms of what could be made at my job, I found side work, and started looking for another job. There was always work.

I hear people say they wouldn't show up for X amount. Sure, right now they have food to eat and a place to live. Take that safety away, or give someone the fear of not feeding their kids...It suddenly changes your perspective. 10 years ago I was biding some work that would fill the tank in my truck, and a couple shopping carts at the store...it would work out to being about 10$ an hour after materials. Hard as hell, hot as hell, miserable labor...but I didn't ask for help from anyone, and I got whatever job I bid. It wasn't pretty, but it worked.

I think too many are quick to go for hand outs, dependant upon the state or others. If the meal tickets stop, what can you depend on?
I learned a valuable trade to bulwark against my own attitude and mentality. Then I strived to be one of the best.

In a pinch, there are many things I can work out, hash together and make something work. I try to pay attention every day and learn something new.

As far as the future, I have no doubt my skills will be sought after until long after I have passed...or put my ID into an android.... 😜

IMO you can never go wrong with a solid trade. Repairing modern vehicles? Such a large knowledge gap there that is continually growing, they don't teach mechanical fuel injection or feed back carbs in any training schools haha...😈

You can make your niche anywhere now a days, just do honest work.
 

welldigger00

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2010
Messages
2,652
Reaction score
3,895
Hiring is really tough right now. We have been trying to hire 2-3 entry-level people per month for the past 4 months and only end up hiring 1-2 per month.

Saw this last week in In Milpitas:

View attachment 999014
My oldest just got hired at in an out a month ago, and has had two raises since he started. He loves it there! And, he gets a free samwich with every shift he works! Definitely helping with his tuition.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

boatnam2

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2007
Messages
11,192
Reaction score
3,876
4 pages, I didn't really seen any jobs listed but one. I have someone looking for a sales job, expertise in medical field but I'm sure she could sale anything. Just getting ready to go back into the workforce.
 

HBCraig

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2008
Messages
5,763
Reaction score
3,875
4 pages, I didn't really seen any jobs listed but one. I have someone looking for a sales job, expertise in medical field but I'm sure she could sale anything. Just getting ready to go back into the workforce.
That trade is a bit rough. You uses to be able to make a ton of money. Now the incentives are unrealistic and you will never meet them. The biggest thing is you are micromanaged to death

If you are a hot female you are in.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DWC

Ol Man

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2007
Messages
592
Reaction score
458
The people who run the company who takes care of our pool cannot hire anyone after the guy who was cleaning ours quit. The owners' wife has done ours for the last few weeks. She and my wife had a nice conversation about sewing though.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DWC

boatnam2

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2007
Messages
11,192
Reaction score
3,876
That trade is a bit rough. You uses to be able to make a ton of money. Now the incentives are unrealistic and you will never meet them. The biggest thing is you are micromanaged to death

If you are a hot female you are in.
Its is a tough gig, but the hotter you are the better it is for sure.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DWC
Top