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Why All Deaths are labeled Covid

Racey

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And yes hospitals ARE getting paid for covid treatment whether it ends in a death or not, it's substantial and one of the only ways they weathered being closed for all elective treatments for the 2-3 months last year, and then the following months of reduced treatments while they sorted out Wu-flu policies and people postponed treatments during this limbo.


It was discussed ad-nauseum in the d&g forum going all the way back to spring last year
 

Waffles

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Can’t due to company policy
But Fuck it, no need for me to talk about IED’s and LAPD shootings unless I post pics of the dead suspects and bomb debris on active cases right ?

Same applies here Einstein
You’re on one 😂.
How does the same apply here? No one questions your POV when it comes to ieds and Lapd shootings because everyone KNOWS you’re in that line of work. *color me shocked*

You pulling the ol “Source: dude trust me” just cause your LEO is laughable
 

SBMech

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I know nothing about KP. I do know that my own mother was claimed to be a CV19 death last year, even after her testing negative. I do know that my local hospital gets paid for CV19 patients (the head admin is a client).
 

shintoooo

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giphy.gif
 

JUSTWANNARACE

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Family is KP
You can PM for further

KP is mainly California so what about the rest of the hospitals in the USA?

And hell maybe Gavin kept the money that was supposed to go to the hospitals to keep plubjack open and buy some new properties 🤷🏻‍♂️ hows that for conspiracy theory?
 

Bear Down

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Facts

It’s either going to be in higher co pays , some type of subsidy (0 now), or KP has to realign and shrink

Pretty much the three paths to go, or a combination of...
So safe to say... KP hasn't received 1 cent due to Covid... but doesn't mean they won't get $? Also, the possibility of some thought, condition or path to possible subsidies correct? If no subsidies, as noted higher premiums... sort of like taking on uninsured emergency cases.. eat it and pass it on...

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JUSTWANNARACE

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I know nothing about KP. I do know that my own mother was claimed to be a CV19 death last year, even after her testing negative. I do know that my local hospital gets paid for CV19 patients (the head admin is a client).

Nope, you're wrong! Just ask LR2.


I actually like the guy and his contributions to this site, look forward what he posts.. but this "holier than thou" shit is over the top in this one SMH
 

Havasu blue label

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Shit I work for a top director for Kaiser that was a guestion I ask him last Saturday his answer was we foot the bill for all patients and drive up show us a death certificate From Kaiser
 

JUSTWANNARACE

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Facts to get you in perspective about KP:

1. Kaiser Permanente operates in eight states (Hawaii, Washington, Oregon, California, Colorado, Maryland, Virginia, Georgia) and the District of Columbia, and is the largest managed care organization in the United States.

2. Ca. And all other states have 0 to do with reimbursement of KP hospitals

3. No Fed $ has reimbursed KP


Yep I get that but all KP is not the same. A retired Socal leo retired and moved to oregon and the KP here wont see him he has to got back to Socal for his treatments🤷🏻‍♂️

And yes we have one in Portland but is no where near the biggest provider around here! And apparently if leo is mainly provided through KP in California but can not be used in oregon?
 

sirbob

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Lots of talk about facts - I’ll share a few. Having worked in hospitals my whole professional life and dealing with reimbursement for most of that time.

Hospitals get paid more if a patient has “co morbidities” that go along with something being treated.

ie - a female patient getting spine surgery that has osteoporosis will generate a higher reimbursement fee that one with out osteoporosis for the same procedure. They add reimbursement to cover the expected additional issues that come up.

High blood pressure - more money

Diabetes- more money

Etc.

They do the same with Covid - you may get pneumonia and need to be on a ventilator- because of the additional expected recovery time etc.

The reason that the 20% was added is because it usually takes a couple years (minimum) to review treatment options and poll hospitals and physicians to figure how much time / effort / cost go into treating a patient when something new comes along (new tech or new treatment option) then coming up with a fair reimbursement in light of the expected treatment. From there they create a new DRG and assign an amount of reimbursement to it.

Covid came on too fast to allow the normal process to be completed and they needed to fairly allow hospitals to be reimbursed for their treatments provided.

While I can’t say I’ve seen a lot of death certs since this started - I have personally seen a few. None of them listed covid as the cause. It may or can be listed as a contributor or co mobility but not the reason - it usually calls out the actual reason for the death... ie pneumonia, cardiac arrest etc and mentions they had covid.

The fact is people with covid that are hospitalized are harder to treat and
take more time. Hence a higher reimbursement.

Lastly my opinion based on having worked with hospital CEOs and CFOs for 30 years is they aren’t going to fake or lie about a co morbidity if it wasn’t present or they couldn’t prove / document it in the patient chart. But they will definitely maximize the reimbursement they are entitled too if the patient can be documented to have had (any co morbidity) covid.
 
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Instigator

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Nice pot shot, but thanks for playing
Got any actual facts to discuss ?
Funny, when I get to the point you get offended ?
Hey man, I never got offended or posted anything related to any fact other than than it appears that you have a very short fuse about this subject for some reason and some of your replies appear dismissive and condescending.
Nothing more and Nothing less.
 

HavaToon

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I wasn’t going to bring my dog into this fight, but what the hell.

My credentials if anyone gives a shit...I manage Kaiser and 4 other of the largest health systems in the US for one of the largest healthcare companies in the world.

Some facts-

- Hospitals are getting paid money for COVID period. The CARES act outlines it plain as day. However not all hospitals are taking the money, while some are flat out exploiting it. I know first hand some that are, including big IDN’s and small rural hospitals profiting. I will never share my actual sources but they include C-suite members and multiple state COVID task force members.

- I don’t know LR2 at all but what he’s saying about KP is true..mostly. Kaiser did receive money from the CARES Act, but later returned more than $500 million. The one exception was the $11.8 million Kaiser received for Maui Health, which is actually a partnership with the state owned hospital system. This is all public record FYI but I also know first hand.

Oh and a fun fact-

- Kaiser is the largest hospital system in the US not in terms of hospitals but it terms of revenue and income, almost doubling the second largest system in revenue HCA which is the largest system in the US in terms of number of hospitals.

- If based on the number of hospitals only Kaiser doesn’t even crack the top 10.

- Kaiser’s massive revenue comes from their membership, self referring and paying. It’s a unique model no other system in the US offers. Because of this massive revenue they indeed weathered COVID better than any other US system.


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HavaToon

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Lots of talk about facts - I’ll share a few. Having worked in hospitals my whole professional life and dealing with reimbursement for most of that time.

Hospitals get paid more if a patient has “co morbidities” that go along with something being treated.

ie - a female patient getting spine surgery that has osteoporosis will generate a higher reimbursement fee that one with out osteoporosis for the same procedure. They add reimbursement to cover the expected additional issues that come up.

High blood pressure - more money

Diabetes- more money

Etc.

They do the same with Covid - you may get pneumonia and need to be on a ventilator- because of the additional expected recovery time etc.

The reason that the 20% was added is because it usually takes a couple years (minimum) to review treatment options and poll hospitals and physicians to figure how much time / effort / cost go into treating a patient when something new comes along (new tech or new treatment option) then coming up with a fair reimbursement in light of the expected treatment. From there they create a new DRG and assign an amount of reimbursement to it.

Covid came on too fast to allow the normal process to be completed and they needed to fairly allow hospitals to be reimbursed for their treatments provided.

While I can’t say I’ve seen a lot of death certs since this started - I have personally seen a few. None of them listed covid as the cause. It may or can be listed as a contributor or co mobility but not the reason - it usually calls out the actual reason for the death... ie pneumonia, cardiac arrest etc and mentions they had covid.

The fact is people with covid that are hospitalized are harder to treat and
take more time. Hence a higher reimbursement.

Lastly my opinion based on having worked with hospital CEOs and CFOs for 30 years is they aren’t going to fake or lie about a co morbidity if it wasn’t present or they couldn’t prove / document it in the patient chart. But they will definitely maximize the reimbursement they are entitled too if the patient can be documented to have had (any co morbidity) covid.

Some great “facts” that are reality gathered from years of experience. Hospitals whether non-profit or for profit are a business and in it to make money.


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Mr. C

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So a pot shot like I posted
Noted

Geeze. Sensitive much. Bomb tech. Short fuse comment. Most got the sarcasm. Get over it.


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Mr. C

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It treats a shit ton of so cal peeps
Majority of inmates are from where ?
Relevant ?
Yes
Have others posted here KP hasn’t received a dime?
Yes
Point proven
I don’t post BS
Over

Majority. How would you know. Keep pumping your chest. Cupcake.


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Waffles

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I’d actually like to see the numbers of those that use KP. None of my family members use KP.....especially after they misdiagnosed my dad which ultimately lead to his death. Non of my Pinoy friends use KP......they might work for them but even they refuse to be cared for by KP DRs......my cousin is a crna at loma linda and even he calls KP the McDonald’s of HC.....whatever the fuck that means 😂
 

PRORACER7474

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I will not get into the who get paid what deal, but if you research Covid-19 you will find that it causes Viral Pneumonia, the pneumonia part of it is what is causing the deaths. How do I know because I got Covid-19 and 6 days later I was in the hospital with Bilateral Viral Pneumonia. I was told by a few Doctors that the pneumonia is what is causing the deaths the exact words doctor looking at e-rays "this is not good you have bilateral viral pneumonia". My understanding again from the doctors was you can treat Bacteria pneumonia with antibiotics but with viral your body has to just fight it by yourself and as long as you still have Covid it is unable to. Lucky for me I was 7 days into and with the help of a experimental drug cocktail I tested neg 3 days later and with breathing excersice and massive doses of vitamins I started getting better at around 10 days
 

EmpirE231

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Whether KP got reimbursed or not... the fact is they officially suck dick! Being someone who has had some “non COVID” health issues the last year or so, they have been a huge joke in terms of medical care.

that’s great and all that they’re not being reimbursed by Medicare and doing it all out of the kindness of my pocket.... because our premiums have been sky rocketing for years now.

and due to them accepting Medicare patients, it now takes 3-4 months to get an appointment. They had damn near the entire hospital closed for the last 3 months due to “COVID surge” what a joke.
 

JUSTWANNARACE

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It treats a shit ton of so cal peeps
Majority of inmates are from where ?
Relevant ?
Yes
Have others posted here KP hasn’t received a dime?
Yes
Point proven
I don’t post BS, I post what is first hand to m
Over

Now, not sure what your profession is but pretty sure I won’t post something about it since I don’t do it or have a direct family member involved in said profession


So now my and others info about hospitals receiving $ for COVID-19 is BS because KP in socal didnt receive any?

Step out of your bubble FFS!

Can you show me where KP was brought up in the OP's post? Nope, no you cant... sooo...

And like I said my info comes from the head of a local hospital that I do work for sooo..🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️..


And ffs we know your wife works for kaiser so I get you are defending it.. but hell man step out of socal for a minute and look at the big picture..
 

JUSTWANNARACE

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@LowRiver2

Your first post could have easily said "I'm glad my family works for Kaiser because thay are not taking the covid $" instead of insinuating and basically calling everyone else that has posted a "lier"!!

Get my point?
 

Waffles

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Choose whatever you want
Point is they are huge in so cal, treated thousands of Covid patients , no money paid to them
About 5k LAPD on Kaiser , probably around 13k+ LA City workers
Easily same numbers for LASD/ LA County

Ford / Chevy , choose what you want

KP is a hell of a lot cheaper when you get old and more advanced care coverage than Blue, but totally different topic
Way more seniors paying way more $ out of pocket for normal prescriptions on all other plans outside KP
Again
To each their own

And KP sucks so bad, they opened their own medical school :
🤣

View attachment 976003
More advanced 😂
Kaiser caters to those that are shortsighted and too dumb to manage their own healthcare. The only idiots I know that carry Kaiser are just that, idiots that would sacrifice care over convenience because muh low deductibles no copays. You’re not the only one that works in government chief 😂

My anthem cdhp is leaps and bounds better than the shit Kaiser offers 😂
 
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JUSTWANNARACE

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The OP said everything Covid is a cash cow, then the band wagon comments about all hospitals make money off Covid
I’ve proven they have not
Game over
If you post up generalities here, get ready for specifics.

I'm still waiting from specifics from you?
More advanced 😂
Kaiser caters to those that are shortsighted and too dumb to manage their own healthcare. The only idiots I know that carry Kaiser are just that, idiots that would sacrifice care over convenience because muh low deductibles no copays. You’re not the only one that works in government chief 😂

My anthem cdhp is leaps and bounds better than the shit Kaiser offers 😂


But does your wife work for them?🤣🤣


Everyone that I know that has Kaiser does nothing but bitch about them but I have no clue and that's why I dont say anything because I have no first hand knowledge of that..
 

Mr. C

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Again
Kaiser of 1990 isn’t Kaiser now
I was blue till 2015 and saw the myth (added charges ), and got smart
Name calling does not look good on you but if you have to resort to that , so be it.

Love the name calling. Which is exactly what you do and diminish everybody else comments because it doesn’t fit yours. Name calling fits you though. It’s what you do and have done for years when people see things differently than you
Have a good night. Cupcake.

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JUSTWANNARACE

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It’s not a lie, it’s passing on a myth that all hospitals are making all kinds of money off Covid
No way near the case .
Also been posted by several here the issue of deaths being mos labeled as Covid vs other causes for money is rare.
Hearsay vs real time info.

Ok you are know all and almighty.. sorry to have had information(first hand) that differs from yours. Obviously your info is all that should be accounted for! Mine from the lady that runs one of our hospitals is bullshit and she knows nothing, kind of like me I guess!?!?
 

Waffles

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Again
Kaiser of 1990 isn’t Kaiser now
I was blue till 2015 and saw the myth (added charges ), and got smart
Name calling does not look good on you but if you have to resort to that , so be it.
I’m not old enough to speak for what happened in the 90’s. I am, however, old enough to speak for the shit that I saw in 11-12 when my dad was under their care and died to present. Fuck Kaiser
 

Mr. C

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Ok you are know all and almighty.. sorry to have had information(first hand) that differs from yours. Obviously your info is all that should be accounted for! Mine from the lady that runs one of our hospitals is bullshit and she knows nothing, kind of like me I guess!?!?

He’s so stuck on his self righteousness it even passes him up on seeing it.


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JUSTWANNARACE

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Does your wife work for LAPD for you to talk about what it does ?

Belittling KP does nothing of the fact the circle jerk in the first page passed the myth all hospitals make money off Covid
Nope

No that's why I dont talk about it🤷🏻‍♂️ duh..


But when I have good info coming from someone that runs one of OUR hospitals and you basically call me a liar.. then yes.. you dont know all, but I'm glad you got it cleared up that KP(which I said in my first post that I dont give a fuk about) doesnt make covid $!
 

tostark

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The OP said everything Covid is a cash cow, then the band wagon comments about all hospitals make money off Covid
I’ve proven they have not
Game over
If you post up generalities here, get ready for specifics.

For a guy that is big on "specifics", the OP was talking aboutn Illinois, not SoCal.....pay attention
 

EmpirE231

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Was my point here they didn’t get paid when others said all hospitals are making money off Covid ?
Yep
Remember the OP’s point
Higher Premiums?
That’s partly due to your plan/employer

Mine have not gone up in six years
Again , off topic

my premiums are paid directly by me. Not an employer / union. So there’s a god chance your premiums have gone up as well...but your employer / union is paying it.
 

buck35

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The OP said everything Covid is a cash cow, then the band wagon comments about all hospitals make money off Covid
I’ve proven they have not
Game over
If you post up generalities here, get ready for specifics.
Well youve stated a case and proven nothing if we're talking about facts, although you have been backed.
 

tostark

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You are new here as for posting
The first page turned into all hospitals making money and mass amounts of mislabeling Covid deaths
Not the case
My point
29 years on , 9 to go
As afar as attention , when you can school me on collapsing circuits and ECM, we’ll talk specifics
Until then, enjoy retirement.

Check post #12. Not new on this thread. Guess you missed that. As for Bomb Squad stuff, i have no idea. But why would u throw that one at me? That wasn’t the topic of this thread.
 

Mr. C

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You are new here as for posting
The first page turned into all hospitals making money and mass amounts of mislabeling Covid deaths
Not the case
My point
29 years on , 9 to go
As afar as attention , when you can school me on collapsing circuits and ECM, we’ll talk specifics
Until then, enjoy retirement.

Holy fuck. There you go again. Trying to make yourself better then everybody. Even someone who just said they do what you do. Looking at his profile. Not new. Been here years. Fuck your ego must be hard to live with.


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Mr. C

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You want to come at me about specifics , I’ll go there . I proved my point
I see an ignored ankle biter of mine liked your post. He loves LE, especially his neighbor LE’s lol.
Good night

Did you train my neighbor? Sounds like you both seem you’re better then everyone. Have family who is LE so don’t confuse the two. Sorry don’t care for your holier than thou attitude though.
Night cupcake.
And why. Again. Bring him into a conversation. He’s asked you not to.

forgot I’m on ignore. [emoji33][emoji849]


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buck35

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Jeezus dude take a fuckin chill pill.
Oh and I used to get paid to blow shit up if that's a prerequisite to have a convo.
 

JUSTWANNARACE

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You are new here as for posting
The first page turned into all hospitals making money and mass amounts of mislabeling Covid deaths
Not the case
My point
29 years on , 9 to go
As afar as attention , when you can school me on collapsing circuits and ECM, we’ll talk specifics
Until then, enjoy retirement.

Wow.. You are one arrogant bastard.. carry on with your bad self.. holy shit

I had the upmost respect for you and what you do and deal with.. but all is lost..
 

RiverDave

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We the public are being scammed. This is all bullshit

It’s really sad and shows how broken our system really is.. the other part it shows is how incredibly stupid 1/2 the populace of our country is for buying into everything hook line and sinker.

I am not sure how many watched Fauci tonight but I watched part of it and it was embarrassing to say the least..

Anyone with a half a brain could see through this guys bullshit.
 

RiverDave

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This entire thing has been exploited in dozens of ways, by countless interests, ranging from good to scammy, to down right malevolent.

It should be perfectly obvious to anyone paying attention at this point. Covid doesn't scare me, what the government and system are using it to exploit does.

yep..
 

RiverDave

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It’s not a lie, it’s passing on a myth that all hospitals are making all kinds of money off Covid
No way near the case .
Also been posted by several here the issue of deaths being mos labeled as Covid vs other causes for money is rare.
Hearsay vs real time info.

There was a point not that long ago @LowRiver2 where every single death in the USA was being labeled COVID..

It was a pretty big deal.. abd got exposed for what it is.

Now you are saying it is rare.. It’s weird that every single person in my sphere that has died has also died of covid.

I’m not buying the “rare” part. To be clear I’m not calling you a liar.. I’m just saying that it adds up about like a 2am vote dump for Biden.

To add to that there were several people I know personally that went for covid tests, had to leave before they got them and were diagnosed positive having never took the test.. More to the point doctors are now diagnosing people via telephone or teleconference covid positive..

Which could lead us into the actual accuracy of the tests themselves. They were in such a rush to develop the tests nobody cared if they were accurate in the beginning.

not one of those things is debatable or “internet” rumors.

Spudsbud told a first hand account. You basically said it was bullshit. I know three people that didn’t actually take a test and were diagnosed positive. I know others that took tests and came back positive and negative (personally).. and it isn’t “rare”. Hell it happened to ole Elon Musk as well..

Frank my limo driver is one person that was diagnosed without ever taking a test. I can put him on the phone with ya if you want.

As for nobody getting any money.. What was the point of the CARES Act again? It isn’t like it doesn’t exist. It does.

or is that rumors as well?

Hospifals are in fact getting more money for covid & they are getting more money for ventilators.. Most the nurses I know say you get vented you are fucked.
 
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RiverDave

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It is beyond scary to me how a virus could get politicized the way this one has.. When Trump mentioned HCL the media and the left went nuts and on a mission to discredit and as far as to ban the drugs in many states and cities..

Come to find out later it actually is a suitable treatment and helpful.. 🤨 Makes ya wonder how many poor bastards died in their attempts to smear Trump.
 

CarolynandBob

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I don't know anything about hospitals. I do remember the Kaiser bad rep from the 90's and would never use them based on that. Seams weird to me to have a medical plan that you can't use somewhere else. We have BCBS nationwide plan and covers us everywhere.

As far as testing. It is all bullshit. I tested positive on a Sunday. (woke up with a bad cold). Wife tested Neg. Decided to go back Monday and do the PCR test. They asked if we wanted the rapid test again too. Said Sure. That test and the PCR test came back Neg for both of us. So not sure if I have it or not, but still sick. Then lost sense of smell and most of taste. Could still taste really spicy stuff a little. Couldn't smell Vicks vapor rub. So how the fuck can anyone believe the covid numbers they put out when the data is so wrong?
 

Andy B.

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I don't know anything about hospitals. I do remember the Kaiser bad rep from the 90's and would never use them based on that. Seams weird to me to have a medical plan that you can't use somewhere else. We have BCBS nationwide plan and covers us everywhere.

As far as testing. It is all bullshit. I tested positive on a Sunday. (woke up with a bad cold). Wife tested Neg. Decided to go back Monday and do the PCR test. They asked if we wanted the rapid test again too. Said Sure. That test and the PCR test came back Neg for both of us. So not sure if I have it or not, but still sick. Then lost sense of smell and most of taste. Could still taste really spicy stuff a little. Couldn't smell Vicks vapor rub. So how the fuck can anyone believe the covid numbers they put out when the data is so wrong?

Because the mainstream media tells them so come on man!!
 

Andy B.

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It is beyond scary to me how a virus could get politicized the way this one has.. When Trump mentioned HCL the media and the left went nuts and on a mission to discredit and as far as to ban the drugs in many states and cities..

Come to find out later it actually is a suitable treatment and helpful.. 🤨 Makes ya wonder how many poor bastards died in their attempts to smear Trump.
I was preaching that a while ago my brothers family was treated with it over it in 48 hrs and his wife has asthma. Bobby was the mister snake oil guy I said hey don't believe me let your family and friends suffer I could give two shits.
 
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