On the Mexico and Canada Tariffs

[regor]

But the actions were to tariff all our trade alliances driving all of them away and into China? They even tariffed countries where we have a trade surplus.

How is that creating trade alliances. Wouldn’t punishing good trade partners, partners that buy more from us than we sell to them, diminishing all trade alliances?

For a thousand years China, Japan and Korea have been fighting, yet these policies brought them together instantly.

It was a message sent and an opening bid.

It's just like when a major manufacturer sends me a notice that I'll need to give them a discount in the next fiscal year due to rising costs. I can either throw a bone or tell them to piss off, but they know damn well I want the business and will negotiate to keep it.

 

[Uncle Dave]

If you truly just make it happen then what is the problem. I'm not dissing you here, seriously. Just adapt and go make it happen.

It will take governmental level investment and guarantees that outlast any one regime to fix this problem.

I did and adapt and will adapt, but I dont excuse lack of action on the government when they tax me for action that " will happen"

We haven't seen ANYTHING but the taxes.

 

[Uncle Dave]

This place will make a million excuses for this guy and be content waiting till the sun burns out before seeing promises fulfilled all the while taking it in the clacker with more and more taxes.

The collective you wouldn't put up with from a blue tie guy, why are you putting up with it from a guy with a red tie?

 

[Racey]

But the actions were to tariff all our trade alliances driving all of them away and into China? They even tariffed countries where we have a trade surplus.

How is that creating trade alliances. Wouldn’t punishing good trade partners, partners that buy more from us than we sell to them, diminishing all trade alliances?

For a thousand years China, Japan and Korea have been fighting, yet these policies brought them together instantly.

Lol more bullshit garbage from you just like "Trump called neo nazi's and white supremacists very fine people"

 

[Racey]

This place will make a million excuses for this guy and be content waiting till the sun burns out before seeing promises fulfilled all the while taking it in the clacker with more and more taxes.

The collective you wouldn't put up with from a blue tie guy, why are you putting up with it from a guy with a red tie?

You don't pay the taxes if you aren't buying those products in the first place.... It's a false premise.

All the stuff some people are bitching about has had no effect on me.... sooo why would i join their pitchfork party, who along with their ranks, is every person that cried wolf for the last decade in regards to anything and everything Trump has done (all of which turned out to be bullshit anyway).


Here's the deal, the bullshit that has happened over these last 10 years has made a lot of us galvanize the attitude of (and this is NOT directed at YOU, i'm speaking in general terms) "You guys are liars, we don't give a FUCK what you say anymore, we don't believe panic cries, the allegations, the (insert whatever else), we are over it, we are done"...... That was not our doing that led to this, it was the sheer amount of bullshit propaganda that has been blown wide open for all to see.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

I’m not just looking at data, I am looking at real day to day experience.



Simply not my experience. I’m not trusting the data, I am living the data and the reality.

I am also looking at real day to day experience, but mine seems opposite from you.

This highlights the complexity of the topic and how generalization of single experience as gospel presents risk. One of the favorable values of RDP is that the community is an eclectic collection of high net worth individuals commingling with all walks of life including working stiffs like me. Mostly all doing it anonymous, which is how I hope to keep my current participation. I won't provide receipts, so readers will have to choose if they want to trust my worthless ramblings as factual.

I seriously tried to be a Libertarian, There is no way to organize libertarian minded people, so you can't really have your cake and eat it too. Government is going to play a role no matter how much you like it or not and when you include international trade regulations, even more. Government has been picking winners and losers since man harnessed fire.

I think we will see in a few weeks if shelves are bare and we need a wheelbarrow for a loaf of bread, you be right. I'll be fine either way with my bullets and beans.

 

[regor]

This place will make a million excuses for this guy and be content waiting till the sun burns out before seeing promises fulfilled all the while taking it in the clacker with more and more taxes.

The collective you wouldn't put up with from a blue tie guy, why are you putting up with it from a guy with a red tie?

He's doing EXACTLY what I want.....................

Is he perfect? No and I don't care!

 

[Uncle Dave]

You don't pay the taxes if you aren't buying those products in the first place.... It's a false premise.

All the stuff some people are bitching about has had no effect on me.... sooo why would i join their pitchfork party, who along with their ranks, is every person that cried wolf for the last decade in regards to anything and everything Trump has done (all of which turned out to be bullshit anyway).


Here's the deal, the bullshit that has happened over these last 10 years has made a lot of us galvanize the attitude of "You guys are liars, we don't give a FUCK what you say anymore, we don't believe panic cries, the allegations, the (insert whatever else), we are over it, we are done"...... That was not our doing that led to this, it was the sheer amount of bullshit propaganda that has been blown wide open for all to see.

This is a crock.

If you buy anything that uses electricity or a battery you are subject to them.

 

[530RL]

Shit... Are we back to the world ending again?

Only if Harris would have been elected.......at least according to in here.........

 

[Uncle Dave]

He's doing EXACTLY what I want.....................

View attachment 1502099

Is he perfect? No and I don't care!

Fun meme.

I just want him to do what he said.

 

[Racey]

This is a crock.

If you buy anything that uses electricity of a battery you are subject to them.

Well i guess ill just have cry myself to sleep over the extra 6 bucks it costs me each year. Boo hoo!!!!


Everything has become a fucking purity test.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

This is a crock.

If you buy anything that uses electricity or a battery you are subject to them.

Not if you buy it used on FB marketplace.

 

[was thatguy]

How much time do you give a guy to keep his word?

Seems like if his tie is red you don't care and will accept any lame excuse for non performance.

I hold all these guys feet to same fire regardless of tie color.


My disdain is non partisan.

I’m not under the impression that all of this is to return manufacturing of small parts to the USA.
I’m under the impression that it’s to balance the trade gaps. No matter what Trump says, returning all manufacturing to America is a seemingly impossibility.
I’ve said it multiple times.
It’s funny, I’m the supposed partisan Trump lover, but your the one that seems to be taking him at his word?
You are waiting and waiting expecting something that you should know is not going to happen, at least not 100%.

Did you believe everything that Biden said as well? I mean, if anything he said was ever decipherable…?

 

[530RL]

I am also looking at real day to day experience, but mine seems opposite from you.

This highlights the complexity of the topic and how generalization of single experience as gospel presents risk. One of the favorable values of RDP is that the community is an eclectic collection of high net worth individuals commingling with all walks of life including working stiffs like me. Mostly all doing it anonymous, which is how I hope to keep my current participation. I won't provide receipts, so readers will have to choose if they want to trust my worthless ramblings as factual.

I seriously tried to be a Libertarian, There is no way to organize libertarian minded people, so you can't really have your cake and eat it too. Government is going to play a role no matter how much you like it or not and when you include international trade regulations, even more. Government has been picking winners and losers since man harnessed fire.

I think we will see in a few weeks if shelves are bare and we need a wheelbarrow for a loaf of bread, you be right. I'll be fine either way with my bullets and beans.

None of this will be the end of the world. America got along just fine under Biden, would have gotten along just fine under Harris, and will be just fine under Trump.

Sure there will be different winners and losers depending upon who is on point, and sure there will be significant differences on a personal level from person to person, but on aggregate the end results will be within a couple percentage points of each other.

Birth, School, Work, Death.

No getting around it.

 

[was thatguy]

You don't pay the taxes if you aren't buying those products in the first place.... It's a false premise.

All the stuff some people are bitching about has had no effect on me.... sooo why would i join their pitchfork party, who along with their ranks, is every person that cried wolf for the last decade in regards to anything and everything Trump has done (all of which turned out to be bullshit anyway).


Here's the deal, the bullshit that has happened over these last 10 years has made a lot of us galvanize the attitude of (and this is NOT directed at YOU, i'm speaking in general terms) "You guys are liars, we don't give a FUCK what you say anymore, we don't believe panic cries, the allegations, the (insert whatever else), we are over it, we are done"...... That was not our doing that led to this, it was the sheer amount of bullshit propaganda that has been blown wide open for all to see.

I tried that approach, he didn’t get it.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Well i guess ill just have cry myself to sleep over the extra 6 bucks it costs me each year. Boo hoo!!!!


Everything has become a fucking purity test.

Done the math have you? Its cost you a lot more than 6 bucks.

 

[Skinny Tire AH]

The money that was attained from tariffs in his first term, were then primarily paid out as subsidies to farmers and others who were crushed by those same tariffs.

It remains true, there is no free lunch. The government is just picking winners and losers, as opposed to letting competition do so.

https://www.piie.com/blogs/trade-and-investment-policy-watch/2018/first-tariffs-then-subsidies-soybeans-illustrate

No, I want the government out of private enterprise and for them to stop picking winners and losers, let alone front running investment markets with non-public material information about this administration's constant course corrections.

However, if they are going to do so as you and others in here support, at least have a solid logical plan to go along with the centralized economic planning that many in here wish to see.


Sounds like you are admitting that if US companies did not go and source or build plants in lower cost geographies, those companies would have "eventually" lost market share and margin.

You are certainly entitled to label them as greedy, or to your point didn't share with their distributors as you would have liked to see. But what I don't think anyone can argue rationally is that if they just sat still and remained manufacturing here as they always had done in the past, they would have still have the same margins and market share.

They had to move that production sooner or later, or they would have simply failed. They had no choice.

I honestly answered many of your questions this morning. So, your turn. Had trade barriers been established, say...15 years ago, would you agree we'd be having a different discussion, or perhaps, not even having it at all?

America, its companies and workers have long been handicapped by artificial dumping and slave wages offshore. It's time, it's actually long past time.

Innovation will drive the American excellence we all know is here. The same innovation will keep those jobs here. That same innovation will create machines that make coat hangers without a single hand touching them.

One of my long term customers, "Superlite" or HardCastle now, has block plants Manufactured by Columbia Mfg, that produce 8 x 8 x 16's and other architectural sizes. Not a SINGLE human touches them until a wrapped and finished pallet needs to be stacked with a forklift.

 

[rcmike]

partners that buy more from us than we sell to them,

Sign me up for some of these partners.. They are just shoveling extra money or how does that work?

 

[Racey]

I’m not under the impression that all of this is to return manufacturing of small parts to the USA.
I’m under the impression that it’s to balance the trade gaps. No matter what Trump says, that’s a seemingly g impossibility.
I’ve said it multiple times.
It’s funny, I’m the supposed partisan Trump lover, but your the one that seems to be taking him at his word?
You are waiting and waiting expecting something that you should know is not going to happen, at least not 100%.

Did you believe everything that Biden said as well? I mean, if anything he said was ever decipherable…?

He's not pure enough!!!!!! I demand exact results yesterday!!!!! This isn't meant to be a philosophy it's meant to be a commandment!!!!

 

[Racey]

Done the math have you? Its cost you a lot more than 6 bucks.

Yes because you know exactly what i buy, how much, and when in the last 100 days


Just another example of why none of us take these "The sky is falling" arguments seriously.

None of the products i have bought in the last 100 days have miraculously jumped in price.... sorry to tell ya.

 

[was thatguy]

This is a crock.

If you buy anything that uses electricity or a battery you are subject to them.

Not true.
I just did a search for American made battery powered products and there is pages of products from lanterns to toys and all sorts of things made and assembled in America.
Even certain AAA and AA batteries themselves are made here.

I didnt search random 110v plug in products, but I’m sure there’s a lot of them as well.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Yes because you know exactly what i buy, how much, and when in the last 100 days


Just another example of why none of us take these "The sky is falling" arguments seriously.

None of the products i have bought in the last 100 days have miraculously jumped in price.... sorry to tell ya.

Dont put words in my mouth. I never said the sky is falling.

The past estimate was 1.5K per household, the current number doubles that or more.

Doesn't matter what you personally buy.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Not true.
I just did a search for American made battery powered products and there is pages of products from lanterns to toys and all sorts of things made and assembled in America.
Even certain AAA and AA batteries themselves are made here.

I didnt search random 110v plug in products, but I’m sure there’s a lot of them as well.

Yes it it.

Made in American is only part of the equation.

Using parts from where is the other.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

Birth, School, Work, Death.

No getting around it.

You forgot taxes.

 

[was thatguy]

Yes because you know exactly what i buy, how much, and when in the last 100 days


Just another example of why none of us take these "The sky is falling" arguments seriously.

None of the products i have bought in the last 100 days have miraculously jumped in price.... sorry to tell ya.

Like my coffee pot analogy yesterday.
Mr Coffee switch only 10 cup coffee pots are about $24 at Walmart.
The last one I bought was about $18
The least I’ve ever paid was about $14

I buy them every couple years for the work shack at the drilling rig.
At home I have an expensive Breville.
The Mr Coffee brewer could literally double to $50 in price and I’d still buy one every couple year.
These guys are pissed because they are dealing in high volume, high finance trade levels.

I gotta say it, it seems to me Trump is right over the target?

Yes it it.

Made in American is only part of the equation.

Using parts from where is the other.

I said made and assembled.
I checked a few things, your statement is not accurate. Not EVERY electric device or appliance sold in America is imported.

 

[530RL]

I honestly answered many of your questions this morning. So, your turn. Had trade barriers been established, say...15 years ago, would you agree we'd be having a different discussion, or perhaps, not even having it at all?

America, its companies and workers have long been handicapped by artificial dumping and slave wages offshore. It's time, it's actually long past time.

Innovation will drive the American excellence we all know is here. The same innovation will keep those jobs here. That same innovation will create machines that make coat hangers without a single hand touching them.

One of my long term customers, "Superlite" or HardCastle now, has block plants Manufactured by Columbia Mfg, that produce 8 x 8 x 16's and other architectural sizes. Not a SINGLE human touches them until a wrapped and finished pallet needs to be stacked with a forklift.

In order for this to be addressed years ago, every single MAGA person in here would have had to have been a Democrat, the party that wanted trade barriers and protection for workers and their historical jobs by the government.

Capitalism as well as conservatism doesn't lend itself to this type of government intervention and central planning of the economy.

So even if the democrats had won every election for the last coupe decades and implemented such protections and central planning, we would have a host of other problems.

It isn't perfect, but if we look at the results, we are a hell of a lot better off than those who have put in protections and the corresponding policies. I like America, much better than the EU which did exactly as your question poses. What a fucked up business system.

At the end of the day life is a big compromise, objectively our system has delivered better results than the others. At least that's the way the numbers fall.

With respect to innovation, I agree. Which is why all this disruption is a complete waste. Free market capitalism and innovation is as you point out the solution. Not the government attempting to centrally plan and allocate resources in the economy as these policies are attempting to do. These tariff proponents remind me of those who fought the industrial revolution saying we must keep 95% of the workforce on the farm. They were wrong then as history has shown. History will once again show due to innovation as you point out, we don't need to save the jobs of the past, but focus on the jobs of the future.

 

[regor]

Fun meme.

I just want him to do what he said.

That won't happen and I know you know that.

I get it, we're all in a tough position thanks to the scum that has inhabited that cesspool called DC over the decades. In order to unwind their corrupt ways, it will take many Presidential cycles and unfortunately, we know the spine of the spoiled Americans will not allow for that to occur. Therefore, it's time to blow it up and get it over with while we destroy the elite's wealth that has been stolen from the middle class.

They can go FUCK themselves as we put a target on their backs.

 

[JDKRXW]

I know you're all up in arms . I know the other guy sells brake parts . I'm just trying to razz you guys and get a laugh . Jeez , is that plain enough ? You don't know whats gonna happen and neither do I so sit back and see what happens . Hold your cards until the last one is dealt . then you will know .

Yet others in this thread say that if your business is under any pressure right now; it's your own fault because you didn't have a plan.
It seems to me theres a big line here, between those who have skin in the game .... and those who don't.

 

[lbhsbz]

, partners that buy more from us than we sell to them,

you might clarify this concept....

 

[lbhsbz]

This is a crock.

If you buy anything that uses electricity or a battery you are subject to them.

Not really...yet. As a consumer, I have not seen price increases or any side effects....yet. The big players all loaded up pre-tariff to be able to maintain for as long as they can. As soon as that stock is depleted, they will then make the decision to bring stuff in under the higher pricing or just not....that's when we'll feel it. We're only a month or so into this right now.

Those trying to plan ahead so we're not fucked (like you and me) are running in circles trying to figure out what's gonna come next. The ignorant will remain ignorant and happy until the consumer market reacts.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Not really...yet. As a consumer, I have not seen price increases or any side effects....yet. The big players all loaded up pre-tariff to be able to maintain for as long as they can. As soon as that stock is depleted, they will then make the decision to bring stuff in under the higher pricing or just not....that's when we'll feel it. We're only a month or so into this right now.

Those trying to plan ahead so we're not fucked (like you and me) are running in circles trying to figure out what's gonna come next. The ignorant will remain ignorant and happy until the consumer market reacts.

IF you bought something electric, or electronic since 2019 you are paying.
Tariffs came on in 2018 - very few have more than a year of parts, and covid upset ALL that.

 

[lbhsbz]

I know you're all up in arms . I know the other guy sells brake parts . I'm just trying to razz you guys and get a laugh . Jeez , is that plain enough ? You don't know whats gonna happen and neither do I so sit back and see what happens . Hold your cards until the last one is dealt . then you will know .

Sitting back and seeing what happens is not an option. Many supporters of this mess have advised for those affected to pivot or make changes that will take advantage or allow them to continue to survive or say fuck it and lock the doors. closing the doors is easy, but you can't do the first 2 while sitting back and waiting to see what happens. There is one thing you'll know when the last card was dealt....it's that you should have gotten up from the table long ago and did something else to position yourself in a better spot than those waiting for the last card to be dealt.

The question is, what to do. Rules are changing daily and that makes it tough to plan ahead.

 

[lbhsbz]

IF you bought something electric, or electronic since 2019 you are paying.
Tariffs came on in 2018 - very few have more than a year of parts, and covid upset ALL that.

Agree, but I believe he was referencing the latest new administration.....so that's what I'm referencing.

 

[lbhsbz]

Not if you buy it used on FB marketplace.

Yeah...then you support the thieves.

 

[Smitty7]

Yet others in this thread say that if your business is under any pressure right now; it's your own fault because you didn't have a plan.
It seems to me theres a big line here, between those who have skin in the game .... and those who don't.

Sure does . You can speculate till your dick drops off but you don't know what the outcome is going to be . I expect him to do about as much as the other fuckers did , nothing . If he does do anything then that's a win over the last bunch of clowns . Uncle Dave bitchs about taxes but don't give a shit that millions went to illegals . Doesn't that affect your bottom line ?

 

[530RL]

That won't happen and I know you know that.

I get it, we're all in a tough position thanks to the scum that has inhabited that cesspool called DC over the decades. In order to unwind their corrupt ways, it will take many Presidential cycles and unfortunately, we know the spine of the spoiled Americans will not allow for that to occur. Therefore, it's time to blow it up and get it over with while we destroy the elite's wealth that has been stolen from the middle class.

They can go FUCK themselves as we put a target on their backs.

If your goal is to destroy the elites wealth, these are horrible policies to do so.

They are the most regressive taxes possible affecting the working middle class and working poor the most.

The policies will make the elites relatively wealthier, they will not destroy the elites wealth.

 

[Smitty7]

Of your goal is to destroy the elites wealth, these are horrible policies to do so.

They are the most regressive taxes possible affecting the working middle class and working poor the most.

The policies will make the elites relatively wealthier, they will not destroy the elites wealth.

Well I guess you're going to get richer and I'm gonna get poorer so what the fuck are you bitching about ?

 

[regor]

Of your goal is to destroy the elites wealth, these are horrible policies to do so.

They are the most regressive taxes possible affecting the working middle class and working poor the most.

The policies will make the elites relatively wealthier, they will not destroy the elites wealth.

Yore not seeing the forest for the trees again.

 

[530RL]

Sure does . You can speculate till your dick drops off but you don't know what the outcome is going to be . I expect him to do about as much as the other fuckers did , nothing . If he does do anything then that's a win over the last bunch of clowns . Uncle Dave bitchs about taxes but don't give a shit that millions went to illegals . Doesn't that affect your bottom line ?

Speculation is not necessary.

With the exception of that infamous economist Ron Vara, economists agree that higher taxes coupled with greater regulation, deliver lower total economic outcome, less capital investment and lower net incomes to the businesses and workers.

It is empirically provable.

Well I guess you're going to get richer and I'm gonna get poorer so what the fuck are you bitching about ?

Because I want everyone to have the same opportunity that I have had.

 

[was thatguy]

Not really...yet. As a consumer, I have not seen price increases or any side effects....yet. The big players all loaded up pre-tariff to be able to maintain for as long as they can. As soon as that stock is depleted, they will then make the decision to bring stuff in under the higher pricing or just not....that's when we'll feel it. We're only a month or so into this right now.

Those trying to plan ahead so we're not fucked (like you and me) are running in circles trying to figure out what's gonna come next. The ignorant will remain ignorant and happy until the consumer market reacts.

I am the consumer market…or am I the ignorant and happy?

I don’t buy brake pads every day. I buy them every 2-3 years.
I don’t buy flashlights, coffee pots, computers, phones, or any other electric device every day.
I buy them every so often.

I keep hearing that I’m the one going to feel the pinch… but I also read that I have no skin in the game?
This is rapidly becoming a circular argument for the detractors.
UD is still pissed from back in 2017, your sweet Chinese deal has changed, the Oracle…well, he’s just being the same old Trump hater.

Raise your prices, it’ll be fine.
No one’s life will end over the price of brake pads…or coffee pots…or any other consumer consumables.

A coworker asked me this morning what he should do about replacing his failed dishwasher at home. He doesn’t care but his girlfriend, who watches way too much news, is freaking out about possible Tarrifs if they wait and shop for what they want.
I asked him what price range, he said about $500 as far as he knows.
I pointed out that during the time we talked about it he made about $50 in salary.
“So that’s 10% of the dishwasher, if we talk about another half hour or so that’ll be 20% of the dishwasher…”
Shop and buy the one you want and don’t worry about the tariffs.
The conversation turned to if vendors and stores will raise prices now on current inventory.
I said if they’re smart they’ll start now.

 

[was thatguy]

Well I guess you're going to get richer and I'm gonna get poorer so what the fuck are you bitching about ?

Trump

Because I want everyone to have the same opportunity that I have had.

Oh spare me.

 

[Uncle Dave]

I am the consumer market…or am I the ignorant and happy?

I don’t buy brake pads every day. I buy them every 2-3 years.
I don’t buy flashlights, coffee pots, computers, phones, or any other electric device every day.
I buy them every so often.

I keep hearing that I’m the one going to feel the pinch… but I also read that I have no skin in the game?
This is rapidly becoming a circular argument for the detractors.
UD is still pissed from back in 2017, your sweet Chinese deal has changed, the Oracle…well, he’s just being the same old Trump hater.

Raise your prices, it’ll be fine.
No one’s life will end over the price of brake pads…or coffee pots…or any other consumer consumables.

A coworker asked me this morning what he should do about replacing his failed dishwasher at home. He doesn’t care but his girlfriend, who watches way too much news, is freaking out about possible Tarrifs if they wait and shop for what they want.
I asked him what price range, he said about $500 as far as he knows.
I pointed out that during the time we talked about it he made about $50 in salary.
“So that’s 10% of the dishwasher, if we talk about another half hour or so that’ll be 20% of the dishwasher…”
Shop and buy the one you want and don’t worry about the tariffs.
The conversation turned to if vendors and stores will raise prices now on current inventory.
I said if they’re smart they’ll start now.

Given most consumers are bitching about inflation which tariffs contribute to - Id say they aren't happy, but I dont like to speak for others.

Im not sure what you are talking about - if you buy anything with battery or plug your are paying a tariff, because we dont build much here anymore in the way of finished products, or parts to build them.

Im pissed because the promise is as of yet unfulfilled but the taxes keep increasing.

Im happy to pay if it fixes the problem, Im not happy to pay when the problem isn't being fixed.

You can keep on giving flyers to guys with Red ties but I don't like anyone that doesnt keep his promises.

I have no idea what you are talking about in terms of a " sweet Chinese deal" ? You may have me mixed up with someone else on that.

 

[was thatguy]

Given most consumers are bitching about inflation which tariffs contribute to - Id say they aren't happy, but I dont like to speak for others.

Im not sure what you are talking about - if you buy anything with battery or plug your are paying a tariff, because we dont build much here anymore in the way of finished products, or parts to build them.

Im pissed because the promise is as of yet unfulfilled but the taxes keep increasing.

Im happy to pay if it fixes the problem, Im not happy to pay when the problem isn't being fixed.

You can keep on giving flyers to guys with Red ties but I don't like anyone that doesnt keep his promises.

I have no idea what you are talking about in terms of a " sweet Chinese deal" ? You may have me mixed up with someone else on that.

That was for brake pad guy.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Agree, but I believe he was referencing the latest new administration.....so that's what I'm referencing.

Got it, there was the fucking we got, then the fucking we're getting.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

Yeah...then you support the thieves.

More validation that moving away from California a decade ago was a good choice for us. I've become friends with people I met using FB marketplace. Furnished half my house, bought all three of my cars and found services that I've invited into my home. Not any of them thieves as far as I can tell.

There is another happy accident that could occur if the supply chain dries up. People will consume less, throw less in the garbage, recycle and repair and generally become more conservative consumers.

You are all overlooking that optimization of consumption is the goal, not optimization of production. Does it really make any sense that you can buy a coffee maker for $23? Does it make any sense that you expect to throw it away in 18 months and buy another? My grandparents had the same coffee maker for 50 years. Few on here would dream of paying $500 for a coffee maker, but in the end you would be money ahead.

Peculated coffee hits harder.

With respect to innovation, I agree. Which is why all this disruption is a complete waste. Free market capitalism and innovation is as you point out the solution. Not the government attempting to centrally plan and allocate resources in the economy as these policies are attempting to do. These tariff proponents remind me of those who fought the industrial revolution saying we must keep 95% of the workforce on the farm. They were wrong then as history has shown. History will once again show due to innovation as you point out, we don't need to save the jobs of the past, but focus on the jobs of the future.

History has also shown that demographics like the Amish live happy and productive lives without technology. Are we really better off? Are today's youth happier and healthier because of technology? Perhaps some are, we live in really wild times. We have super computers in our pockets that provide an invaluable source of knowledge, yet we as a society gravitate toward collective envy, sloth, pride, greed, lust, gluttony and wrath.

Im pissed because the promise is as of yet unfulfilled but the taxes keep increasing.

Im happy to pay if it fixes the problem, Im not happy to pay when the problem isn't being fixed.

Welcome to the club, none of us are getting the promised services of our taxes. Be it roads, schools, LEO, Fire, or the parks. I think we are all just in different stages of grief regarding an ROI on tax value. At least this one is a consumption tax and we can choose not to pay it.

 

[Uncle Dave]

That was for brake pad guy.

Capische.

 

[530RL]

History has also shown that demographics like the Amish live happy and productive lives without technology. Are we really better off? Are today's youth happier and healthier because of technology? Perhaps some are, we live in really wild times. We have super computers in our pockets that provide an invaluable source of knowledge, yet we as a society gravitate toward collective envy, sloth, pride, greed, lust, gluttony and wrath.

My view is that should be a decision up to the individual. Not to the government, that individuals neighbors or anyone else.

That whole freedom shit kind of sticks with me.

 

[lbhsbz]

More validation that moving away from California a decade ago was a good choice for us. I've become friends with people I met using FB marketplace. Furnished half my house, bought all three of my cars and found services that I've invited into my home. Not any of them thieves as far as I can tell.

There is another happy accident that could occur if the supply chain dries up. People will consume less, throw less in the garbage, recycle and repair and generally become more conservative consumers.

You are all overlooking that optimization of consumption is the goal, not optimization of production. Does it really make any sense that you can buy a coffee maker for $23? Does it make any sense that you expect to throw it away in 18 months and buy another? My grandparents had the same coffee maker for 50 years. Few on here would dream of paying $500 for a coffee maker, but in the end you would be money ahead.

Peculated coffee hits harder.



History has also shown that demographics like the Amish live happy and productive lives without technology. Are we really better off? Are today's youth happier and healthier because of technology? Perhaps some are, we live in really wild times. We have super computers in our pockets that provide an invaluable source of knowledge, yet we as a society gravitate toward collective envy, sloth, pride, greed, lust, gluttony and wrath.



Welcome to the club, none of us are getting the promised services of our taxes. Be it roads, schools, LEO, Fire, or the parks. I think we are all just in different stages of grief regarding an ROI on tax value. At least this one is a consumption tax and we can choose not to pay it.

While there are lots of things wrong with CA, that's not the topic of this thread. Some of us are tied to this place by factors outside of our control, at least for the time being.

The Amish? Really? Fine, how would RDP do if the article on the front page was a boat towed by 5 horses instead of a CC w/ 5 500Rs on the back. You wanna live like that...go for it, but first, turn you computer off and throw away your phone.

How exactly will you choose not to pay it when there are products that are simply not made here that people need? You couldn't go 2 months without buying a made-in-China product. I'm using China simply because that's the big boy in the room with tariffs today...pick any other country you want. Throw away all your current stuff and go replace it without buying anything not made in the USA. You simply can't do it.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Welcome to the club, none of us are getting the promised services of our taxes. Be it roads, schools, LEO, Fire, or the parks. I think we are all just in different stages of grief regarding an ROI on tax value. At least this one is a consumption tax and we can choose not to pay it.

I agree, none of us are getting the promised service.

Most of the guys here are totally happy with that as long as they are taking it from their pet guy.

You say you can choose not to pay it. I say you are simply not aware of what % were dependent on outside parts.
You typed that on a computer with components made from a majority of Asian parts (not necessarily china, but from Taiwan or somewhere in asia) ,passing it through through an internet built with Asian components .
I do not believe you can choose to avoid this at all. You can ATTEMPT to minimize it, but avoiding it isnt possible.

I think all thats terrible and will happily pay more if I know a solution is coming.

I dont trust the words anymore. I want to see action.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

My view is that should be a decision up to the individual. Not to the government, that individuals neighbors or anyone else.

That whole freedom shit kind of sticks with me.

Not arguing that. However, the government played a central role in the industrial revolution and contributed greatly to the robber barons grip on wealth.

I'm arguing that History does not show that people fighting the industrial revolution to stay on farms where wrong, they just lost the fight. History has a tendency to be told by the victorious.

Yes there are many benefits from the industrial revolution and the last 25 years of China producing the worlds goods. Just as whatever becomes of this latest chapter will ultimately prove positive, or not; who knows. We can agree that the President and their policies has little impact on our daily lives, we just think it does.

The Amish? Really? Fine, how would RDP do if the article on the front page was a boat towed by 5 horses instead of a CC w/ 5 500Rs on the back. You wanna live like that...go for it, but first, turn you computer off and throw away your phone.

How exactly will you choose not to pay it when there are products that are simply not made here that people need? You couldn't go 2 months without buying a made-in-China product. I'm using China simply because that's the big boy in the room with tariffs today...pick any other country you want. Throw away all your current stuff and go replace it without buying anything not made in the USA. You simply can't do it.

I'm just glad I don't live in a place where I worry all my neighbors are thieves. FWIW we got savages for neighbors.

I am 100% confident we can go two months without purchasing anything, we've prepared for a decade for the zombie attack. This tariff supply chain disruption is nothing compared to what happened to the people in Asheville Tennessee, or those affected by the wildfires, tornadoes or flooding. We are so incredibly lucky that Tariffs are the worst thing happening to us. I'm grateful I have running water every day.

I would never dream of throwing away everything and buying new, that is completely counter productive and part of what is wrong with Americans. I understand your challenge, it just is not a way to prove a point.

I'm also pretty sure the Amish are way happier than the people that post on RDP. I'll never have a boat with 5 500Rs, but I sure would like to have a team of mules. Lots of angry old men here at RDP. I've seen Jedediah's family, he always has a smile on his face and goes to bed early.

Oh BTW if you need a box made in America, here is a contact.

1. Montana Container Corporation​

• Location: Bozeman, MT
• Services: Custom corrugated cardboard box manufacturing with over 40 years of experience.
• Contact: Gregory Shouse
• Phone: (406) 586-3393
• Website: montanacontainercorp.com

Cardboard comes from trees right? We got plenty.