new boat rotten ski locker

[BeeBazaar]

Haven't even had the nordic rush on the water yet and I run into problems. Its a bummer no doubt but the boat is 98. even taking good care of it i should have knew it would have issues.

So the ski locker floor is rotted out. I panicked initially but looking into it more they fiberglassed in a piece of plywood about 6' long x 8" wide. just to make a flat spot on the bottom of the ski locker. You can see in the pic the edge where the board sat under the glass over the Vee bottom. I was able to pull about 95% of it out by hand. it was delaminated from the wood. This left me some non rotted wood that is up high and some fiberglass ledges. This whole problem was all due to the carpet in the ski locker. I'm not the 1st this has happened to and I know I won't be the last. I believe the wood was laid down then the edges were glassed to the hull there was a channel / gutter underneath for the front of the boat to drain under the ski locker. I'd like to 1st, epoxy the wood I cant remove. then put Coosa board on the fiberglass ledges left behind and glass that into the hull. Id lose an inch or so of depth, but the locker is thigh deep anyway. I'll manage. I've never done fiberglass before, but it is a smallish job I think and i've read it's not overly hard. especially for this aspect (vs a seen exterior part of the boat) I'd like to paint it and then maybe put Dri-Dek inside on the floor. Does any of this raise a red flag to anyone?

My 2nd part of this, is this wall. (i drilled 3 small holes in the pic to see, light and a vacuum for debris or whatever)I want to cut it and be able to clean / see behind it better I'd prefer to leave a hole in it for future visual inspection. I will always worry at this point. I don't know how much strength is lost, if any to have an 8" x 8" or so square port here? My plan would be to picture frame the area along the boat top and bottom and then some uprights. I would also use Coosa board for this. rough sketch below. i would try to do both sides, but I'm not sure how much room and how far i could get with the inside of that wall.

anything sound like a terrible plan?

 

[coolchange]

You seem to have a hand on it. Just makes sure of the product compatibility using epoxy. CSM if you’re using that. (Chopped strand mat ) Epoxy is slower and more forgiving than vinyl or polyester but more expensive. Lots of YouTube vids on the subject. Post results.

 

[Backlash]

Let the fun begin!

This is a simple repair and something you shouldn't worry about. The floor of the ice locker isn't a structural part and like you stated, is simply glassed in to create a flat spot in the hull's bottom. The boat wasn't built with epoxy, so there's no reason to spend the money on epoxy resin. Vinylester resin would be more than adequate for this repair and the glass work you need to do. I would use 1708 cloth as it gives you plenty of glass and will also create strength along the edges of the shelf in the locker. It's not expensive, but better than any other weight cloth you could probably find.

Don't use any of the crap from big box stores like Home Depot or Lowe's. Go to a shop that sells fiberglass products for the best results.

You'll want to grind the current surface flat with an angle grinder and 40-80 grit disc. Rough up the surfaces where you'll be laying the glass down. Dry fit all your cloth and make sure it fits how you want it to. (Overlap your flat shelf by a couple inches on all four sides.) Mix your resin and give yourself some time to wet out the cloth AND roll out any air bubbles. Don't mix it hot meaning don't add a lot of MEKP. Wet out your cloth outside the boat on a big piece of cardboard and make sure you work the resin down into the cloth. Remove excess resin if you can. Carefully lift your big cardboard platter and wet fiberglass cloth up into the boat along with your tools. Set the wet cloth in place and use a brush and/or fiberglass roller to work out all the air bubbles. Work from the middle out to the edges. Repeat as necessary, but try not to lay up more than 3 layers of cloth at one time. Let it cure then dry completely. You can trim as necessary when the cloth is still "Green," but if this is your first round of fiberglass work, just let it all cure and grind out any rough edges later. You shouldn't need more than two full layers of cloth over this shelf.

Finish off with a quick grind and smooth out the edges. You can buy a small can of white gelcoat and mix it and brush it into this ice locker when you finish to give it a completed look.

Easy fix! Let me know if I can help you with anything else.

 

[BeeBazaar]

Thanks! I will def post result pictures. How many total layer's would be best? I was going to ask about a paint or what not. I will post a picture but under the engine hatch its black and it looks like they slung white paint on it (by design - totally 90's) I was going to try and mimi that and put down red dri-dek vs Carpet. I found a 3' x 12' roll that would probably be perfect. I have a piece of Coosa bluewater 26 half inch board on the way.

Any concerns with the "wall" (that has 3 holes in pic) if I were to cut a 8" or 10" square hole and leave it open? And fiberglass around it with a "picture frame" of coosa board?

I've watched a few videos (and been watching fiberglass work on Bitchin rides for years lol) it doesn't look difficult, though the grinding sounds nerve wracking. Def not the gut wrenching moment of discovery I had....

will keep posted! thanks again!

 

[coolchange]

Be Aware, if you use epoxy, I wouldn’t, you can’t gelcoat it with regular gelcoat. Also, there is regular gelcoat, and brushing.

 

[Backlash]

Thanks! I will def post result pictures. How many total layer's would be best? I was going to ask about a paint or what not. I will post a picture but under the engine hatch its black and it looks like they slung white paint on it (by design - totally 90's) I was going to try and mimi that and put down red dri-dek vs Carpet. I found a 3' x 12' roll that would probably be perfect. I have a piece of Coosa bluewater 26 half inch board on the way.

Any concerns with the "wall" (that has 3 holes in pic) if I were to cut a 8" or 10" square hole and leave it open? And fiberglass around it with a "picture frame" of coosa board?

I've watched a few videos (and been watching fiberglass work on Bitchin rides for years lol) it doesn't look difficult, though the grinding sounds nerve wracking. Def not the gut wrenching moment of discovery I had....

will keep posted! thanks again!

Without being there and seeing what you're actually working with, take this with a grain of salt.

If it were me, I would grind out 4" further up the sides of the hull from where your flat floor will lay inside the locker. Lay the floor down to mark where it will sit. Then when you have that floor piece cut to fit, lay a line of mixed vinylester resin and 1/4" chopped strands along the lines you marked to sort of "Bed" that floor down. Think of laying it down onto a wet fiberglass putty if you will. Press it down and set some weight on it just to hold it in place while it cures. Then, with the same type of resin/1/4" strand putty, do the same around the top of that flat piece of floor. Think of it as if you're putting a bead of caulk around a large tile. You just want to create a smooth transition with this putty mixture if that makes sense.

As that top layer of putty is curing, I would lay down a long 4" wide strip of 1708 cloth, halfway on the hull and halfway on the new floor piece....on all four sides of the floor piece. This is called "Tabbing." Let everything (The 4" strips around the perimeter and the putty beneath the tabbing), cure until it's all dry and solid. Now go back and grind down any rough or high spots until you have a relatively smooth surface over the inside of the hull and the floor of the locker.

At this point, only the perimeter of the floor piece will have any glass on it. The tabbing that you laid down.

If it makes you feel better, you could go back and add another piece of cloth to the center of the floor piece to fill in where the tabbing doesn't cover. This isn't necessary, but might make the bottom floor of the chest more level and smooth. If you're not worried, you could move on to the next step.

This is where you will cut a larger piece of the 1708 that will cover all the work you just did. Make it 2" larger than the last layer if that makes sense. You want to not only cover all your work, but also run the glass further up the hull sides if you can. Roll out any and all bubbles. Now let this all cure. Clean up and grind down any high spots.

Now you'll add another larger layer over everything you just did. Just make this last piece 2" larger in all four directions if that makes sense. Once all this cures and you've ground down any rough spots, you should be done with the glass work. Clean it all up and apply whatever finish you want. Gelcoat can be brushed on and smoothed out if you like.

Back to the bulkhead question. The bulkhead where you've drilled holes looks to be a semi-structural part. You can cut away some of the meat in the middle, but leave enough for the hull to have support there. I wouldn't leave any wood "Raw." If you can get some glass on those areas, I would do it. If that wood bulkhead with the holes is the wall of your ice locker, I would address that area first before laying the floor down and glassing everything in like I explained above. Like I said, it's hard to say EXACTLY what to do without being there and seeing it.

Remember, these are just suggestions from afar after seeing a couple pictures. Hahahaa!

Don't be afraid of doing glass work. Yes it's messy and sticky and you're going to mess up and ruin some of the product. You're learning a new skill and that takes time. Worse case scenario, you mess up and have to cut out whatever you did wrong. It's not a big deal to be honest. Do it over and make it better the next go around.

 

[mjc]

Don't forget to resin the holes you made.

 

[BeeBazaar]

@coolchange when you say epoxy, is this as opposed to the vinylester? Ill use vinyl if its better and easier to topcoat for sure

@Backlash the 2" bigger each time is to feather it and blend so it doesn't look like a big hump? honestly the grinding scares the shit out of me. I assume this is to scuff the surface for better adhesion. I may just get a 36 grit sander on it first to see how that does lol

I plan to try and cover all wood with in the area i can see / reach with glass. first Im going to put some wood-rot epoxy (just for an extra precaution) on all the wood i can see exposed and reach then cover with the fiberglass. I may cut out some of the bulk head and plug it back up. i saved everything I've removed so far for that reason just in case

I have noticed that the ski locker doesn't dry out very fast. I just hung some bags with a gallon silica gel beads in the there to help. I make super desiccants also if push comes to shove. i want to get the boat out but I know that will just start the waiting process over again.... wife wants to go to Erie over labor day. i may need to maybe put some fans in there with the silica too. I have a wood moisture meter for my saw mill i use that I can read the moisture content of the plywood that's in there but id guess that's been a humid environment for a long time....

on a bright spot, the Coosa will be here tomorrow. but rain for the next 5 days...... always something thanks again!

 

[Backlash]

@coolchange when you say epoxy, is this as opposed to the vinylester? Ill use vinyl if its better and easier to topcoat for sure

@Backlash the 2" bigger each time is to feather it and blend so it doesn't look like a big hump? honestly the grinding scares the shit out of me. I assume this is to scuff the surface for better adhesion. I may just get a 36 grit sander on it first to see how that does lol

I plan to try and cover all wood with in the area i can see / reach with glass. first Im going to put some wood-rot epoxy (just for an extra precaution) on all the wood i can see exposed and reach then cover with the fiberglass. I may cut out some of the bulk head and plug it back up. i saved everything I've removed so far for that reason just in case

I have noticed that the ski locker doesn't dry out very fast. I just hung some bags with a gallon silica gel beads in the there to help. I make super desiccants also if push comes to shove. i want to get the boat out but I know that will just start the waiting process over again.... wife wants to go to Erie over labor day. i may need to maybe put some fans in there with the silica too. I have a wood moisture meter for my saw mill i use that I can read the moisture content of the plywood that's in there but id guess that's been a humid environment for a long time....

on a bright spot, the Coosa will be here tomorrow. but rain for the next 5 days...... always something thanks again!

I think someone else mentioned it already, but I would avoid using epoxy on anything in the boat if you plan to "Do anything" with that area. You will have a problem with polyester and vinylester resin bonding to it. I'm 99% sure the boat wasn't built using epoxy so I wouldn't recommend using it. It's not necessary.

Yes, scuffing any areas you are working in helps do a number of things. It cleans any foreign material from those areas and levels things out for you. It also creates "Tooth" which gives the new resin and glass a surface to adhere to.

Spreading out the areas where the new glass adheres to the hull distributes the loads and also increases the area where the surfaces bond. You don't want to rely on only the first layer to create the bonds.

36 grit should be more than sufficient.

 

[coolchange]

Some people want to use epoxy because they think it’s better. In some cases it is. You’re not doing anything structural. Vinyl ester resin will bond better than polyester on polyester. And a heck of a lot cheaper. Also remember that you have laminating resin and finishing. Do your work in laminating, then your last coat add wax. if you’re going to gelcoat everything then you won’t need to finish resin. The gelcoat will do that. But then you have to make sure the gelcoat has wax or spray with PVA.
Sounds complicated, but it’s not. Just follow the rules. When you get done, you’ll say hey that was kind of fun. What else can I do?
If you look at the boat in my avatar, I tooled the molds And laid up the black cowls.

 

[BeeBazaar]

Im out of town for work and noticed there is a west marine on the way home. Whats the general it's consensus on them?

One thing on this coosa board is when i cut and lay it in the boat, there will be a gap between the square edge and the angle of the hull. This was noticable on the old piece of wood i took out. If i dont fill it in it will basically create a bubble along the length. Id much prefer it be solid. I have used west marine for wood working with epoxy and silica. But im getting mixed info on epoxy and vinylester use together? Can vinylester be used like epoxy ans fill in a gap or take a thickener like silica?

I may stop at west and discuss if it would be worth while and maybe pick up some supplies.

And @coolchange those cowles look great!

 

[coolchange]

Don’t mix resins. All epoxy or all vinyl.
I use fibreglast for online resin or Revchem for local pick up. Compare prices. Fiberglass has good short videos online.
Yes make filler putty out of silica or csm or similar.

 

[Backlash]

You don't need to use epoxy on this project. It's unnecessary and will only cost you more money than you need to spend. Vinylester is MORE than suitable for this project.

When you cut the Coosa and lay it in, there will be a hard corner you have to fill. If the Coosa is vertical like a bulkhead, and essentially 90° to the hull, you'll need to mix up a batch of putty. You want to create a radius so that the cloth has a smooth transition from the hull side to the new piece of Coosa. You'll want to create this radius on any corner or edge so that the cloth can make the smooth transition when you glass it in.

If your laying this Cossa down as in the bottom piece of your locker, you'll notice the gap created along the edges. Bevel the underside of the Coosa panel to minimize the gap, then add in the putty along the edges of the panel to create a smooth transition for your cloth like I mentioned above.

Check my old, long and drawn out rebuild of my Schiada/Howard 19. The thread is in the Schiada section of RDP and the title is "Schiaward." I posted a lot of pictures of this exact process so you can see what I'm explaining above. I used plywood and Douglas For, not Coosa. Same processes for both materials though.

 

[BeeBazaar]

when you guys says putty, this is the vinylester I assume then? as in the same stuff I will use with the fiberglass pieces?

If you were to guess, in 1998, what resin did Nordic probably use? hopefully Viylester?

Ill check out the thread!

 

[BeeBazaar]

@Backlash in post 272 of the Schiaward thread (last page) that is only resin putty and silica? you fill in the corners and then fiberglass over it?

 

[Backlash]

when you guys says putty, this is the vinylester I assume then? as in the same stuff I will use with the fiberglass pieces?

If you were to guess, in 1998, what resin did Nordic probably use? hopefully Viylester?

Ill check out the thread!

Yes I'm almost positive they were using that and not epoxy.

 

[Backlash]

@Backlash in post 272 of the Schiaward thread (last page) that is only resin putty and silica? you fill in the corners and then fiberglass over it?

I typically use silica and vinylester resin and mix it to a thickness of peanut butter. Wear a mask when you mess around with silica and don't breath that crap in. It's unhealthy and you don't want it in your lungs. Any quality mask should suffice.

I pour my resin into a medium size painters cup, maybe 4 ounces or so. I mix the silica in to get the thickness I need. Once I have it where I like it, then I add the MEKP. Mix that in really well and make sure you like the consistency. I stole an old stainless spoon from the kitchen and use that to create the radius I like. Scoop it out and spread it along the joint you're trying to fill in. Make it smooth to minimize any rough edges.

Once you get comfortable using it, you'll be able to lay the putty into the corner, form it how you like it, and let it cure. You won't have a lot of sanding to do to get the shape you like. It's a bitch to sand so try and get the shape you want. Easy peezy!