Jury Duty Experience in Free America

[angiebaby]

I've done my civic duty several times, and always felt that if I'm ever on trial, I hope there are intelligent people on the jury, not a bunch of nitwits and losers. So I go because I hope that if I'm in that situation, there is someone like me on the jury, though I've certainly had my nitwit moments Though the system is not perfect, it's a wonderful thing that we are tried by the citizenry, not by elites in the government.

I was recently called to jury duty, and since I've recently been DOGE'd, the timing was convenient. Having concluded the trial yesterday afternoon, I couldn't help but compare it to my experience in Not Free America due to the stark contrast.

Not Free America

• Jury summons has a map with several parking lots for you to choose from within 6 city blocks of the courthouse.
• Drive an hour and fight for parking in lot 4 blocks from courthouse. It's pay parking, so be sure to have your parking validated or risk paying $20/day. Walk the 4 blocks to courthouse. Feel lucky that you were able to find a decent spot to park.
• Wait in line outside courthouse to walk through metal detector like a criminal. Don't forget to empty your pockets and put everything on a conveyor belt to have your purse and phones checked like TSA.
• Given juror badge upon check-in
• Enter a very large jury room (auditorium), with a loudspeaker giving orders from a person you never see.
• Wait.
• Get some shitty coffee from the machine.
• Wait.
• When you finally get called, go into the courtroom.
• Get grilled by attorneys about where you live, what your spouse and children do for work, what your cat had for dinner, who your first grade teacher was, where your mother went on vacation, etc.
• 20 minute break
• more grilling, many are thanked and excused
• 2 hour lunch break
• more grilling, many are thanked and excused
• 20 minute break
• finally, a jury is selected (sometimes this takes 2 days).
• It's 4:00, time to leave for the day.

Day 2

• Parking is better, you only park three blocks away.
• 9 am, arrive and check in. Escorted to courtroom
• All day with instructions and opening arguments.
• 3 twenty-minute breaks and an hour and a half lunch.
• End at 4 pm

Day 3-5

• 3 twenty-minute breaks and 90 minute lunches. Someone always comes back late, so the lunches are actually about 100-105 minutes. No court on Friday. Finally, deliberations begin Mon or Tues of following week.

Deliberations

• This could go on forever because there always seems to be 2-3 liberal bleeding hearts that do not want to convict in what looks to you to be an open-and-shut case. The defense attorney painted the perp as a victim and these dumb (usually women, so insert your own term here) people always feel sorry for this criminal. OR, you get the city employees and DMV workers who don't want to go back to work and like the hour of breaks and two-hour lunches, so they drag it out as long as possible.
• Finally, you reach a verdict (or not) and are free from the threat of Jury Duty for another year.

Free America

• The jury summons includes a questionnaire to speed up the selection process. It asks about your occupation, whether you've served on a jury before, whether it was a good/bad experience, and whether there is any case in which you feel you could not be fair and impartial.
• Address to courthouse is on the summons, and there is a phone number to call to check the weekend before.
• Drive ten minutes to courthouse. Parking is free, but the streets immediately around the courthouse block are all full. Park on the next block over. Walk one block to the courthouse.
• No metal detector. Follow signs to third floor. Deputies guide you to jury room. No coffee or vending machines. 50 chairs lined up in rows.
• Sheriff comes in to greet you and thank you for coming in.
• Given a juror number 8x10 laminated card.
• Wait.
• Given instructions regarding courtroom etiquette and then taken to the courtroom (everyone).
• Metal detector to enter courtroom. No conveyor belt or checking of purses, just carry it in. Deputy in front of the detector. Red lights going off for nearly every person. We all just walk through with nothing said to us regarding the red lights. (BTW, I have concealed carried many times in the courthouse, there is no sign against it and no person or machine checking at entry, but I know better than to carry a firearm into a courtroom).
• Judge asks if anyone knows the defendant/victims/officers/witnesses, or if there is any other reason we cannot serve. Those with issues wait in line to speak individually with judge and attorneys in chambers. There are about 8 people waiting, so we take a 15 minute break.
• About 6-8 people are excused, so they are replaced and asked the same questions. One person has issues, but there were two alternates, so all parties agree to excuse that one person and only have one alternate to save time. The jury is chosen, and everyone else leaves (11 a.m.). There are no badges.
• Instruction binders are handed out, and the judge quickly reads just the highlights.
• One-hour lunch.
• Return from lunch and hear opening arguments. No one is late. Two witnesses.
• 10-minute break.
• 4 more witnesses
• End day at 4:45 pm with instructions to return at 8:50

Day 2

• Parking is better; you park on the street directly in front of the courthouse.
• Deputy greets you at the top of the stairs and says, "Good morning."
• Baliff thanks you for returning and takes you to the courtroom.
• Trial resumes promptly at 9 am.
• More witnesses. Arguments are finalized. Break for 1 hour lunch at 11:30.
• Closing arguments immediately after lunch. DA speaks for 20 min. Defense Attorney speaks for 15, DA closes with less than 5 minute rebuttal. More instructions from the judge. We are deliberating by 1:30.

Deliberations

• I'm nervous because I have an interview on Friday, and some of these folks look to be liberal bleeding-hearts to me. No one wants to be foreman. Only two of us have ever had jury service before. Thankfully, the other person who has experience agrees to be foreman after a lot of awkward silence. We discuss the case for about two minutes, read the clarification of the first charge and the elements required for a guilty verdict. It seems everyone agrees guilty. Forewoman asks if anyone thinks he's not guilty. To my amazement no one speaks. Wow. That was fast!
• All four charges. Guilty. No argument. Some felt bad for the guy's situation. Obviously mentally unstable. But no one felt that he shouldn't be held accountable for attempted homicide and arson. We tried to drag it out so that it looked like we discussed it a bit.
• I was home by 3:00 on the second day of jury duty.
• You are in the pool for six months, so you could conceivably be called again, but the judge says that if you get called, you should get in touch with him, and he will talk to the judge who called you to have you excused (we have two judges in our county; this guy was a sub from Missoula for one of them, which is a whole story unto itself).

That concludes my jury experience, which I think is about as enjoyable as it could get. It was refreshing that the judge was very cognizant of our time, and everyone vocalized how grateful they were that members of the public showed up to act as jurors on the case. I felt valued, which was not the case in Not Free America.

What have your experiences been like?

I will discuss the interesting details of the crazy case next.

 

[FlyByWire]

Jesus.

I’m thankful I get excused.

 

[angiebaby]

Jesus.

I’m thankful I get excused.

Yeah. They never appreciate your level of expertise on things.

 

[185EZ]

Years ago got called to jury duty in Kingman.
The thing I hated was you had to wait till the morning of the day to find out if you have to go in.
Not easy when you have to tell your employer that you won't be in for work on a 5 minute notice.

I do get called and get the drilling. Some kid got caught stealing from vacation homes in northern AZ.
They asked if I ever had anything stolen and how I felt about it.
Yes I did and it was just a couple weeks ago and I wish I would have caught him and arrested.
DISMISSED!

 

[Boat 405]

There is a reason why people get out of jury duty.

 

[TPC]

I'm excused,, don't miss it.

 

[FlyByWire]

Yeah. They never appreciate your level of expertise on things.

Living in AZ, I’m not exempt outright from AZ jury duty.

I had to show up last year in Kingman and it was a DUI trial.. I was actually excited. Then I had to answer the question posed by the judge about any experience in DUI at all…

Okay.. well I have several hundred DUI arrests personally, and I’ve witnessed or assisted in probably a couple thousand at this point in my career.

Would it be safe to assume you have a bias toward the issue of DUI?

Yes your honor..

Ok have a nice day.

 

[angiebaby]

It was so refreshing to be with like-minded people who recognized that a bad person was just that. If you light your truck on fire and then drive it into your neighbor's house, you're going to prison. We don't care if you're high, drunk, old, or in a wheel-chair. You're going to prison.

The whole experience was so different than previous jury duty experiences. Close to home, easy to park, treated with dignity and respect, and my time was valued by the judge and attorneys. It was about as efficient as it could be in my opinion.

 

[t&y]

Jesus.

I’m thankful I get excused.

Yeah. They never appreciate your level of expertise on things.

The idiots out here tried once. I even called them and spoke to them over the phone advising them of my occupation. Nope, you must appear, or we will issue a bench warrant... I'm thinking come on dumb fucks... a bench warrant for jury selection.

Well, fuck it... I went on duty in full uniform. Walked into the jury room, got my shitty coffee, and sat down with everyone else. The people in there could care less. The staff, well they kinda started talking and looking around and then asked me to come up to the counter. They thought I was lost and supposed to be there for a case. I explained the situation and told them I was there to proudly serve on a jury and got excused immediately.

I gleamed from the conversation that those who issued the notices to appear are complete idiots and pretty much read from a script. The staff in the room were very nice and we got a good laugh out of it.

 

[TeamGreene]

Just got a jury summons for SBCounty but I'm going to be on a project in Texas. Spending the last two days trying to convince them of this has been fun.

 

[Heylam]

I’ve thrown away every one I’ve ever gotten. Never had a problem.

 

[HNL2LHC]

Living in AZ, I’m not exempt outright from AZ jury duty.

I had to show up last year in Kingman and it was a DUI trial.. I was actually excited. Then I had to answer the question posed by the judge about any experience in DUI at all…

Okay.. well I have several hundred DUI arrests personally, and I’ve witnessed or assisted in probably a couple thousand at this point in my career.

Would it be safe to assume you have a bias toward the issue of DUI?

Yes your honor..

Ok have a nice day.

The times that I have been brought in and in the box for one reason or another I have never been selected to join the group in a trial. It was in Hawaii the couple of times. Maybe I am too white and opinionated. Personally I think it is more like I am oppressed

 

[Crazyhippy]

I sat on a Federal jury once years back. It was among the most mundane experiences of my life. Every question is asked at least 5 times, all worded ever so slightly different. 11 days total. We convicted Chester the molester, got a thank you from the Judge and prosecuting atty. Oh and a check for almost $100!!!

Ever since then, i explain that my ex wife is a cop... and if they will hire that psycho, they will hire anyone!!! Released in short order after that.

 

[was thatguy]

 

[jetboatperformance]

Poignant subject as I just responded on line this morning (fukers gave me a one week notice) , I'm employed By my corporation and run 2 of the business and I will not serve I do not have the time to devote and even if I did interview I'm sure they wouldn't want me (or would disqualify) me because I wear my "Heart on my sleeve" additionally I have a disability BUT "IF NOMINATED I WILL NOT RUN AND IF ELECTED I WILL NOT SERVE"

 

[zhandfull]

For many years was self employed and was able to get out of jury duty. Now I work for a local agency and they always excuse me before ever getting to a courtroom.

 

[angiebaby]

So the case.

We have neighbors A, B, and C.

Neighbors A and B live next door, and neighbor C is across the street. All parcels are 3-5 acres.

Neighbor B & C grew up together, built homes around the same time and have lived in these homes for over 20 years. Both around 50-ish. Neighbor A has owned the parcel for 10 years, but his kids lived in it and he only moved in 4-5 years ago. He had a used car lot in the next town over but sold it around the time he moved into this place, so this property quickly became full of used cars as he was still flipping and repairing cars, which irritates the neighbors. They also share a well, which causes conflict. Word of advice: Never purchase property that has a shared well. There WILL be conflict when you share the source of something your family requires for basic survival.

In June of 2023, Neighbor A (about 70 years old) goes over to Neighbor C's shop, staggering, and asks about Neighbor B. Wants to know about his house and where the master bedroom is because Neighbor C is having an affair. Says he is going to fill his truck with fuel, gas cans, and propane tanks, light it on fire, and run it into Neighbor B's house. At some point, he is asked to leave, but needs help getting out of the chair because it's on casters and he has prosthetic legs and is shitfaced.

Neighbor C immediately tells Neighbor B what was discussed. Neighbor B calls 911. They tell him to protect himself by whatever means he feels he needs to if he feels threatened. Obviously, this is recorded.

July 2023, Neighbor A is shooting guns in the direction of other neighbors' homes. Police called, talk to him and he stops.

October 2023, neighbors notice that Neighbor A has what appears to be a rail from a railroad in the back of his truck, resting at an angle above the cab on the headache rack and angled down to the tailgate. Strange, but not totally unusual for Montana. Also of note, this truck has a transfer tank in the bed.

November 10, 2023. 9-ish am.

Neighbor B is in the kitchen making breakfast. It's his wife's 50th birthday. She is in the bedroom packing to go on a surprise trip. 19 year old daughter is getting in the shower. Future son-in-law is sitting on couch in living room waiting for breakfast. All 4 live in the home. Daughter bends over to turn on the water for the shower when the whole house shakes and a steel beam crashes through the wall inches above her head going through the next wall into the side bedroom. Wall is on fire. If she had been standing in the shower, she would have been impaled by the beam.

As it turns out, Neighbor A followed through on his promise. After a three-day meth bender, he put some multi-stage fireworks, 3 gas cans full of fuel along with a propane tank and full transfer tank. Lit the transfer tank fuel and the fireworks, does a burn out from his driveway, swerved to go between and opening in two sets of trees and hits the bathroom wall head on at about 45 mph. Video camera from the shop caught the whole thing. Concrete chunks from the foundation fly 30 feet across basement rec room, hit the wall and bounce off another 4 feet. 16" glue-lam beam under the entire length of the house is twisted and cracked. Wall is on fire.

Neighbor B and SIL run outside. Truck is on fire. Wife yells at husband to pull the driver out. The two men struggle to get the door open as the man inside says, "Just shoot me" and points to his forehead. His prosthetic legs are jammed, but they finally come loose and the man is removed from the truck, sans legs, with his hair and jacket on fire. Man on fire says, "That's for my wife." Husband tries to put out the fire as women call 911. Neighbor A starts crawling away like Anakin Skywalker. It's a miracle that he did not die in the crash. Neighbor B stated the driver was not wearing a seatbelt. Perhaps the impact pinning his legs kept him from flying through the windshield?

Both Sheriff and Tribal police show up about 5-8 min later. Neighbor A, still crawling, says, "Please shoot me, he destroyed my family." FIre dept puts out fire. Man goes to hospital. Says to doctor, "He fucked up my family."

Turns out, this 70-ish year old man got it in his head that the 50 year old guy with a beautiful wife and family is having an affair with his 70+ year old wife.

This man is in a wheelchair trying to gain sympathy from the jury. The night before we deliberate, in the middle of the trial, this dumbass tells his wife on the jail visitor phone, "We have to make this look like an accident." He then proceeds to take the stand, and tells us it was an accident. That his prosthetic leg slipped, and got jammed between the brake and gas and he couldn't stop. He didn't intend to hit the house, but panicked as he lost control. Yet somehow he was able to swerve three times to avoid all of his vehicles, his RV, and trees, but couldn't seem to avoid a house. Also, apparently he took meth to help with his pain. We had a good laugh about that in the deliberation room.

Naw, sorry, dude. You aimed straight for the house in your drug-infused rage. This was 100% premeditated.

On a happy note . . . the kids got married the weekend before Mother's Day. The mom runs a used baby clothing store in town and donates all proceeds to the Safe Harbor women's shelter. It's terrible that they had to endure this nightmare.

 

[nameisbond]

Canada doesn't have a lot of jury trials because: "Under Canadian law, a person has the constitutional right to a jury trial for all crimes punishable by five years of imprisonment or more. The Criminal Code also provides for the right to a jury trial for most indictable offences, including those punishable by less than five years' imprisonment, though the right is only constitutionally enshrined for those offences punishable by five years' imprisonment or more. Generally, it is the accused person who is entitled to elect whether their trial will proceed by judge alone or by judge and jury; however, for the most severe criminal offences—murder, treason, intimidating Parliament, inciting to mutiny, sedition, and piracy—trial by jury is mandatory unless the prosecution consents to trial by judge alone."

Most lawyers talk their clients into a trial by judge alone. I've never got a notice.

 

[angiebaby]

Canada doesn't have a lot of jury trials because: "Under Canadian law, a person has the constitutional right to a jury trial for all crimes punishable by five years of imprisonment or more. The Criminal Code also provides for the right to a jury trial for most indictable offences, including those punishable by less than five years' imprisonment, though the right is only constitutionally enshrined for those offences punishable by five years' imprisonment or more. Generally, it is the accused person who is entitled to elect whether their trial will proceed by judge alone or by judge and jury; however, for the most severe criminal offences—murder, treason, intimidating Parliament, inciting to mutiny, sedition, and piracy—trial by jury is mandatory unless the prosecution consents to trial by judge alone."

Most lawyers talk their clients into a trial by judge alone. I've never got a notice.

That definitely saves the state money and is efficient.

This particular menace got 110 years. I did some research and found out that the police had been called to his house over 20 times in 4 years for issues with his neighbors. I can't imagine their relief to know that he is gone for good.

 

[havasuhusker]

I went through this recently. Answered the questionnaire online. Then received a summons t appear. Went in and waited in a big room and then was called to pick up a placard with a number. After everyone was given a numbered placard, we were advised to get get drinks and snacks out the vending machines. They only took cash, so those with cards and no cash were screwed. Luckily for them, a couple of us nice people bought them snacks. Then we made a long journey to another building where we waited in a jury deliberation room. Not enough seats so some of us had to stand. Then we went into the courtroom and sat in the gallery. We listened to the judges instructions and were sent out of the room. They started at one and would go until they had the required number of jurors. I was one of the last numbers (30 something) so I had to wait a bit before they got their jury selected. Then those of us who didn't get picked were sent home. It seemed like a lot of hurry up and wait.

 

[RVRKID]

So the case.

We have neighbors A, B, and C.

Neighbors A and B live next door, and neighbor C is across the street. All parcels are 3-5 acres.

Neighbor B & C grew up together, built homes around the same time and have lived in these homes for over 20 years. Both around 50-ish. Neighbor A has owned the parcel for 10 years, but his kids lived in it and he only moved in 4-5 years ago. He had a used car lot in the next town over but sold it around the time he moved into this place, so this property quickly became full of used cars as he was still flipping and repairing cars, which irritates the neighbors. They also share a well, which causes conflict. Word of advice: Never purchase property that has a shared well. There WILL be conflict when you share the source of something your family requires for basic survival.


View attachment 1506208

In June of 2023, Neighbor A (about 70 years old) goes over to Neighbor C's shop, staggering, and asks about Neighbor B. Wants to know about his house and where the master bedroom is because Neighbor C is having an affair. Says he is going to fill his truck with fuel, gas cans, and propane tanks, light it on fire, and run it into Neighbor B's house. At some point, he is asked to leave, but needs help getting out of the chair because it's on casters and he has prosthetic legs and is shitfaced.

Neighbor C immediately tells Neighbor B what was discussed. Neighbor B calls 911. They tell him to protect himself by whatever means he feels he needs to if he feels threatened. Obviously, this is recorded.

July 2023, Neighbor C is shooting guns in the direction of other neighbors' homes. Police called, talk to him and he stops.

October 2023, neighbors notice that Neighbor C has what appears to be a rail from a railroad in the back of his truck, resting at an angle above the cab on the headache rack and angled down to the tailgate. Strange, but not totally unusual for Montana. Also of note, this truck has a transfer tank in the bed.

November 10, 2023. 9-ish am.

Neighbor B is in the kitchen making breakfast. It's his wife's 50th birthday. She is in the bedroom packing to go on a surprise trip. 19 year old daughter is getting in the shower. Future son-in-law is sitting on couch in living room waiting for breakfast. All 4 live in the home. Daughter bends over to turn on the water for the shower when the whole house shakes and a steel beam crashes through the wall inches above her head going through the next wall into the side bedroom. Wall is on fire. If she had been standing in the shower, she would have been impaled by the beam.

As it turns out, the neighbor followed through on his promise. After a three-day meth bender, he put some multi-stage fireworks, 3 gas cans full of fuel along with a propane tank and full transfer tank. Lit the transfer tank fuel and the fireworks, does a burn out from his driveway, swerved to go between and opening in two sets of trees and hits the bathroom wall head on at about 45 mph. Video camera from the shop caught the whole thing. Concrete chunks from the foundation fly 30 feet across basement rec room, hit the wall and bounce off another 4 feet. 16" glue-lam beam under the entire length of the house is twisted and cracked. Wall is on fire.

Neighbor B and SIL run outside. Truck is on fire. Wife yells at husband to pull the driver out. The two men struggle to get the door open as the man inside says, "Just shoot me" and points to his forehead. His prosthetic legs are jammed, but they finally come loose and the man is removed from the truck, sans legs, with his hair and jacket on fire. Man on fire says, "That's for my wife." Husband tries to put out the fire as women call 911. Neighbor A starts crawling away like Anakin Skywalker. It's a miracle that he did not die in the crash. Neighbor B stated the driver was not wearing a seatbelt. Perhaps the impact pinning his legs kept him from flying through the windshield?

View attachment 1506215

Both Sheriff and Tribal police show up about 5-8 min later. Neighbor A, still crawling, says, "Please shoot me, he destroyed my family." FIre dept puts out fire. Man goes to hospital. Says to doctor, "He fucked up my family."

Turns out, this 70-ish year old man got it in his head that the 50 year old guy with a beautiful wife and family is having an affair with his 70+ year old wife.

This man is in a wheelchair trying to gain sympathy from the jury. The night before we deliberate, in the middle of the trial, this dumbass tells his wife on the jail visitor phone, "We have to make this look like an accident." He then proceeds to take the stand, and tells us it was an accident. That his prosthetic leg slipped, and got jammed between the brake and gas and he couldn't stop. He didn't intend to hit the house, but panicked as he lost control. Yet somehow he was able to swerve three times to avoid all of his vehicles, his RV, and trees, but couldn't seem to avoid a house. Also, apparently he took meth to help with his pain. We had a good laugh about that in the deliberation room.

Naw, sorry, dude. You aimed straight for the house in your drug-infused rage. This was 100% premeditated.

On a happy note . . . the kids got married the weekend before Mother's Day. The mom runs a used baby clothing store in town and donates all proceeds to the Safe Harbor women's shelter. It's terrible that they had to endure this nightmare.

That is a crazy story but did neighbor C have the rail and was shooting at the houses or neighbor A?

 

[JM21]

I’ve thrown away every one I’ve ever gotten. Never had a problem.

Same, never once have I replied, and I have gotten the notice many times in my adult life.

 

[HST4ME]

They won't ask me back.

 

[NicPaus]

I replied a long time ago. They sent me a few cities away and offered $10 in fuel compensation. My Dually got 5-6 mpg. After that I just threw them away. They sent them for a few years. Have not got 1 in 20 years. Knock on wood.

 

[angiebaby]

That is a crazy story but did neighbor C have the rail and was shooting at the houses or neighbor A?

Neighbor A.

Edited the post. Thanks for catching it.

I think I should have added a poll choice that reads, "I've done it before and I recognize it is a cornerstone of democracy and freedom, so while it's an inconvenience, I'm happy to participate."

 

[530RL]

Six juries over 4 decades.

Three guilty, two not guilty, one hung jury with a single holdout for guilty.

Fellow jurors have for the most part totally taken it serious.

Always a pleasant experience other than it always takes about three times as long as it should.

 

[Maw]

I've reported four times over 50 years, never been selected. I don't think they really want engineer/business owners that are used to questioning the "sales pitch".

 

[Blue Oval]

My twins were born at 3lbs. 33 days in NIC unit. I was called for Federal Jury Duty. Could not get out of it. The twins had to be feed every 4 hours. They had just been released . Got up at 5am to get to Grand Rapids. Never got a lunch break until 1 pm. Felt like I was under arrest. Got picked for 2nd trial. Told the judge I was leaving. No one listened to my protest all day. He ended up releasing me. I drove home 85 mph. I was pissed. I did nothing wrong and was treated like a criminal. Not cool.

 

[pronstar]

I've been called once. The week before Memorial weekend.

Monday thru Wednesday I called in, no need to show up.

I call Thursday, and told to show up Friday.

I show up Friday, and within 10 mins they tell us courts are closing early due to the holiday, and we are free to go.

 

[ChiliPepperGarage]

You know everybody bitches about criminals getting acquitted or ridiculous jury awards for BS cases and it is because decent people get out of jury duty.

Sure, it is an inconvenience and you might lose some money for doing so but I think it is a small price to pay for the opportunity to serve your community and country. Our system is not perfect but it is still one of the best in the world. You should be honored to serve.

Think about it this way, what if you are falsely accused or the defendant of some BS law suit? Do you want a bunch of morons deciding your fait?

 

[Heylam]

I heard a judge years ago say that he thought that juries should be made up of law students and that it should be mandatory for them to get their degree. I thought it was a brilliant idea.

 

[samsah33]

I'm on the list and get called in pretty much annually. I make it into court about half of the time, but have almost always gotten excused when the lawyers start asking me Q's (I guess they must not appreciate my honesty...). I was once excused for financial hardship on a 6-month (court's estimate) capital murder trial; kinda glad I didn't have to decide that one...

The other thing I think about sitting around in the big juror selection room looking at the pool is that I hope I never have to get judged by these people, they're definitely not my peers...

 

[HTTP404]

Jesus.

I’m thankful I get excused.

Me too. I tell them I know @FlyByWire

 

[FlyByWire]

Me too. I tell them I know @FlyByWire

That on top of 6 bucks is probably worth a cup of coffee.

 

[musicFunsun]

I didn’t mind jury duty in Rancho Cucamonga, now that we live in Loma Linda……..I don’t want to go to San Bernardino The one time I was on a jury was interesting & we voted guilty but he pleaded out so I never knew what the outcome.

 

[DLC]

I've done my civic duty several times, and always felt that if I'm ever on trial, I hope there are intelligent people on the jury, not a bunch of nitwits and losers. So I go because I hope that if I'm in that situation, there is someone like me on the jury, though I've certainly had my nitwit moments Though the system is not perfect, it's a wonderful thing that we are tried by the citizenry, not by elites in the government.

I was recently called to jury duty, and since I've recently been DOGE'd, the timing was convenient. Having concluded the trial yesterday afternoon, I couldn't help but compare it to my experience in Not Free America due to the stark contrast.

Not Free America

• Jury summons has a map with several parking lots for you to choose from within 6 city blocks of the courthouse.
• Drive an hour and fight for parking in lot 4 blocks from courthouse. It's pay parking, so be sure to have your parking validated or risk paying $20/day. Walk the 4 blocks to courthouse. Feel lucky that you were able to find a decent spot to park.
• Wait in line outside courthouse to walk through metal detector like a criminal. Don't forget to empty your pockets and put everything on a conveyor belt to have your purse and phones checked like TSA.
• Given juror badge upon check-in
• Enter a very large jury room (auditorium), with a loudspeaker giving orders from a person you never see.
• Wait.
• Get some shitty coffee from the machine.
• Wait.
• When you finally get called, go into the courtroom.
• Get grilled by attorneys about where you live, what your spouse and children do for work, what your cat had for dinner, who your first grade teacher was, where your mother went on vacation, etc.
• 20 minute break
• more grilling, many are thanked and excused
• 2 hour lunch break
• more grilling, many are thanked and excused
• 20 minute break
• finally, a jury is selected (sometimes this takes 2 days).
• It's 4:00, time to leave for the day.

Day 2

• Parking is better, you only park three blocks away.
• 9 am, arrive and check in. Escorted to courtroom
• All day with instructions and opening arguments.
• 3 twenty-minute breaks and an hour and a half lunch.
• End at 4 pm

Day 3-5

• 3 twenty-minute breaks and 90 minute lunches. Someone always comes back late, so the lunches are actually about 100-105 minutes. No court on Friday. Finally, deliberations begin Mon or Tues of following week.

Deliberations

• This could go on forever because there always seems to be 2-3 liberal bleeding hearts that do not want to convict in what looks to you to be an open-and-shut case. The defense attorney painted the perp as a victim and these dumb (usually women, so insert your own term here) people always feel sorry for this criminal. OR, you get the city employees and DMV workers who don't want to go back to work and like the hour of breaks and two-hour lunches, so they drag it out as long as possible.
• Finally, you reach a verdict (or not) and are free from the threat of Jury Duty for another year.

Free America

• The jury summons includes a questionnaire to speed up the selection process. It asks about your occupation, whether you've served on a jury before, whether it was a good/bad experience, and whether there is any case in which you feel you could not be fair and impartial.
• Address to courthouse is on the summons, and there is a phone number to call to check the weekend before.
• Drive ten minutes to courthouse. Parking is free, but the streets immediately around the courthouse block are all full. Park on the next block over. Walk one block to the courthouse.
• No metal detector. Follow signs to third floor. Deputies guide you to jury room. No coffee or vending machines. 50 chairs lined up in rows.
• Sheriff comes in to greet you and thank you for coming in.
• Given a juror number 8x10 laminated card.
• Wait.
• Given instructions regarding courtroom etiquette and then taken to the courtroom (everyone).
• Metal detector to enter courtroom. No conveyor belt or checking of purses, just carry it in. Deputy in front of the detector. Red lights going off for nearly every person. We all just walk through with nothing said to us regarding the red lights. (BTW, I have concealed carried many times in the courthouse, there is no sign against it and no person or machine checking at entry, but I know better than to carry a firearm into a courtroom).
• Judge asks if anyone knows the defendant/victims/officers/witnesses, or if there is any other reason we cannot serve. Those with issues wait in line to speak individually with judge and attorneys in chambers. There are about 8 people waiting, so we take a 15 minute break.
• About 6-8 people are excused, so they are replaced and asked the same questions. One person has issues, but there were two alternates, so all parties agree to excuse that one person and only have one alternate to save time. The jury is chosen, and everyone else leaves (11 a.m.). There are no badges.
• Instruction binders are handed out, and the judge quickly reads just the highlights.
• One-hour lunch.
• Return from lunch and hear opening arguments. No one is late. Two witnesses.
• 10-minute break.
• 4 more witnesses
• End day at 4:45 pm with instructions to return at 8:50

Day 2

• Parking is better; you park on the street directly in front of the courthouse.
• Deputy greets you at the top of the stairs and says, "Good morning."
• Baliff thanks you for returning and takes you to the courtroom.
• Trial resumes promptly at 9 am.
• More witnesses. Arguments are finalized. Break for 1 hour lunch at 11:30.
• Closing arguments immediately after lunch. DA speaks for 20 min. Defense Attorney speaks for 15, DA closes with less than 5 minute rebuttal. More instructions from the judge. We are deliberating by 1:30.

Deliberations

• I'm nervous because I have an interview on Friday, and some of these folks look to be liberal bleeding-hearts to me. No one wants to be foreman. Only two of us have ever had jury service before. Thankfully, the other person who has experience agrees to be foreman after a lot of awkward silence. We discuss the case for about two minutes, read the clarification of the first charge and the elements required for a guilty verdict. It seems everyone agrees guilty. Forewoman asks if anyone thinks he's not guilty. To my amazement no one speaks. Wow. That was fast!
• All four charges. Guilty. No argument. Some felt bad for the guy's situation. Obviously mentally unstable. But no one felt that he shouldn't be held accountable for attempted homicide and arson. We tried to drag it out so that it looked like we discussed it a bit.
• I was home by 3:00 on the second day of jury duty.
• You are in the pool for six months, so you could conceivably be called again, but the judge says that if you get called, you should get in touch with him, and he will talk to the judge who called you to have you excused (we have two judges in our county; this guy was a sub from Missoula for one of them, which is a whole story unto itself).

That concludes my jury experience, which I think is about as enjoyable as it could get. It was refreshing that the judge was very cognizant of our time, and everyone vocalized how grateful they were that members of the public showed up to act as jurors on the case. I felt valued, which was not the case in Not Free America.

What have your experiences been like?

I will discuss the interesting details of the crazy case next.

Thank you for all of that narration!

I just hope non of us are on the other side sitting in the other box

 

[Todd Mohr]

Great post Angie, I did jury duty about 35 years ago, boring case a can’t remember much about it. Biggest thing, it was dumping in the Sierras and I missed 2 days of POW, I’ll get over it eventually.

 

[n2otoofast4u]

I’ve thrown away every one I’ve ever gotten. Never had a problem.

Bingo! When they can prove I got it, then I’ll pay attention. Until then, it’s just another piece of junk mail that gets shredded. I see this system as qualified and effective as mail in voting!

 

[BUDMAN]

I’ve thrown away every one I’ve ever gotten. Never had a problem.

Same. Unless they send it by registered mail and have proof I received it, that shit gets thrown away.

 

[nameisbond]

That definitely saves the state money and is efficient.

This particular menace got 110 years. I did some research and found out that the police had been called to his house over 20 times in 4 years for issues with his neighbors. I can't imagine their relief to know that he is gone for good.

Also in Canada. The prosecution can appeal an acquittal and not guilty verdict. Another reason lessor crimes seldom receive jury trials. Lawyers know they are a waste of time.

 

[angiebaby]

My twins were born at 3lbs. 33 days in NIC unit. I was called for Federal Jury Duty. Could not get out of it. The twins had to be feed every 4 hours. They had just been released . Got up at 5am to get to Grand Rapids. Never got a lunch break until 1 pm. Felt like I was under arrest. Got picked for 2nd trial. Told the judge I was leaving. No one listened to my protest all day. He ended up releasing me. I drove home 85 mph. I was pissed. I did nothing wrong and was treated like a criminal. Not cool.

This was exactly my beef in Not Free America. I felt like a criminal. You're busted if you wear shorts, ball cap, don't you dare put your sunglasses on your head! Go through TSA. Now go through secondary. Let me rifle through your purse. Sit down, shut up, and wait until WE tell you to go somewhere. No one was nice or friendly. I felt like I was getting processed for jail.

This was a nice change.

I cannot believe they did not excuse you to take care of your newborn babies requiring critical care. The arrogance of these people. I had to start crying once because I had my second interview for a high school teaching position at a school where I really wanted to work. Second interview! They weren't going to let me go! I was held hostage for the sake of some POS to have a fair trial. I told the judge several times that I had served on juries before, I had no problem serving, I just couldn't serve at this time. He couldn't have cared less. So as the clerk was swearing us in, I just started crying. I was 35 years old with a family and a mortgage. I didn't have a job, had just graduated from college, and this was THE job that I wanted at the site that I wanted (3 miles from my house). So finally, they let me go and had to start the question process over with someone new. I'm still pissed about it.

I'm sure people give them lines all day long to get out of it because they don't want to be inconvenienced, but newborn babies fresh out of a NICU? Have you no humanity?

It was interesting up here because everyone seemed to have so much respect for each other. No one tried to come up with lame excuses; very few even had excuses, and those that did were released without question. I have that interview tomorrow, and I'm certain that if this trial had been a one to two-week trial instead of a couple of days, I would have been excused without even an eyebrow raise.

 

[pixrthis]

They have no proof you have received a jury duty notice. Need I say more?

 

[Hardly Satisfied]

This is why I don’t go

 

[Uncle Dave]

When I lived in LA I received 3 notices to appear /call in the day before letters.

Every one of them was Thanksgiving week and I was released from every one.

Had one here in Nor Cal just 3 weeks ago , was released the day before.

 

[lbhsbz]

I've received plenty in the mail accidentally lose about 1/2 of them. I called in on some and never had to actually show up until about 9 years ago. Assault case, Long Beach court house. A day for jury selection, then 2 days for the trial.

Never really having been in court, it was an interesting experience in how the system works. There are a lot of really stupid questions asked and a lot of time wasted.

 

[angiebaby]

I forgot to mention that I thought it was pretty cool that the baliff was John, from the Elks Lodge. I wouldn't say we are friends, but he recognized me and smiled. Potential jurors included my hairdresser and the nurse from my doctor's office. I had been in the owner of the damaged home's baby store the Saturday before. I'm not sure if she recognized me or not, but I knew who she was. It made for a nice sense of community. I love living in a small town.

 

[whiteworks]

Last time I went to jury duty “not free America” everyone was lined up outside for about 30 minutes before they let us inside the building. During that time some shit bag preacher is standing there with a bullhorn telling everyone about Jesus and how wee going to hell. There was a security guard there and I asked the dude wtf wasn’t this all about and he said preacher dude guess and gets a permit everyday to do this and not a damn thing they can do to stop him. I had to go to the dmv a few weeks later and same dickhead preacher guy is there doing the same shit to a captive audience waiting in line. What a fucking asshole douschebag thing to do.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

I love living in a small town.

I can't remember the details exactly, but for some reason I walked in my juror registration into the courthouse last year. I talked to a clerk without an appointment, no one standing in line, just walked up to the desk and received help. I told them I loved serving jury duty but I was headed south for the winter to AZ. The clerk asked me the dates, hand wrote a note and stapled it to my paperwork smiled and said no problem, enjoy Az, we'll call you up over the summer if we need you.

I enjoy serving Jury duty, I've only done it once. RivCo, French Valley court house. Three strikes case, aggravated assault, attempted murder. Guilty. The guys were bad hombres. After the case ended the DA stuck around and thanked us. He walked us over to the window where we saw the mother of a defendant getting arrested for her participation. He then told us all the evidence the judge would not let him present. Turns out it was a pretty bad group of people who were into MMA fighting. They would use women to trick young men into attending house parties and then the criminals would beat them up for sport. They had also been doing the same thing in Arizona.

The victim was nearly beat to death by the thugs.

 

[coolchange]

Been called never had to go. Been a witness for the defense in civil causes twice. The asking the same question 5 different ways is spot on. It even got fun almost trolling the questioning attorney knowing what the next question would be based on my answers.

 

[DarkHorseRacing]

I'm a public employee. We get paid for jury duty. Therefore they love taking us on juries and don't seem to mind the hole you leave at your work while serving. Sometimes being on a jury is better than being at work.