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Sand Bar Accident?

OldSchoolBoats

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Are you suggesting that is what caused the incident?


One has nothing to do with the other.. as for traffic Parker is busier

RD
No I am not saying that is what caused the accident, just saying that the area between the 2 corners is sketch. There isn't a lot of room to maneuver and big boats love to fly through there.
 

JJ McClure

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I raced Hobie Cat sailboats. We called it pitchpoling. I assume the boat speed is just above planning speed, then a back off of power in a shaper turn, which starts the bow and one sponson to pitch under the water.

I’ve always trimmed high, and ran it straight through, but it’s been over a decade. Water depth back then was easy 24-30”, and I never touched in my 21’ eliminator.
Are you saying you’ve planed in a Hobie Cat? Don’t think that’s a thing. I’ve planed a Hobie 33, but not a cat. I’ve also been on a Kerr 55 planing downwind… trimming will not achieve the desired result. Try yore helm.
 

Rajobigguy

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Weird. maybe it's the hull design or the fact that My boat isn't a big HP boat but I've never experienced anything particularly strange at that turn. I usually cruise through there at about 40 mph and the worst thing that's ever happened was when another boat crowded me over to the shallow side and the mud monster grabbed ahold of me.
 

Outdrive1

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Bulger brought that boat and asked me to take him out in it. We were headed up river and Tom says to me, that’s fast enough. I looked over at Tom and said that’s as fast as it goes. 🤣
 

n2otoofast4u

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Glad to hear everyone is going to be ok. I’d be very interested in knowing if everyone was wearing jackets. Boat shouldn’t be terribly hard to fix provided nothing structural weird happened.

Slower isn’t always better, especially in a cat in my opinion. Who knows the circumstances, maybe we never will.

I can tell you that corner in a twin OB 25 Daytona will 100% get your attention if you aren’t on your game!

Shit happens fast, traffic, no traffic, speed, no speed, wake boats, no wake boats…… Wear your jackets, wear your lanyard, keep your eyes up and be driving the boat 1/4-1/2 mile ahead at all times.
 

Outlaw Boat Transport

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Who said the driver hasn’t gone to a driving school? 🤦‍♂️

I tend to crank the wheel hard and throttle on through that turn in all the cigs I’ve owned like I’m at the inside marina turn during the Key west race. 😂 Never felt unsafe one time in any of them going through there. 😁 juuuuuust sayin.
yes but your boat is not a cat
 

Blackmagic94

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Weird. maybe it's the hull design or the fact that My boat isn't a big HP boat but I've never experienced anything particularly strange at that turn. I usually cruise through there at about 40 mph and the worst thing that's ever happened was when another boat crowded me over to the shallow side and the mud monster grabbed ahold of me.


That’s why you took the turn at a safe speed

The problem with that turn is the current creates a circular swell which can cause excess role rate on a cat or even a V. This is not a place to hot rod and it’s not a place to race because it’s always been dangerous.
 

Blackmagic94

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Tres Martin also teaches people not to not to turn the wheel Con continuously in a cat but makes small turns and then return back to 12 o’clock and then go back to 9 o’clock and then back to 12 o’clock etc. etc. etc. and that will keep a cat much more stable and less risk of an overturn
 

Fastdadtsmith

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Tres Martin also teaches people not to not to turn the wheel Con continuously in a cat but makes small turns and then return back to 12 o’clock and then go back to 9 o’clock and then back to 12 o’clock etc. etc. etc.
That's exactly how I remember my son telling the story after he took the class.
 

J DUNN

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Only way a 32 DW is barrel rolling on that turn is hauling ass.

The ONLY way?

Seeing as its opinion I can understand a probable way or possible way but the ONLY way? This thread has 2-3 posts of issues there that were NOT at high speed.

It would be interesting to see a list of probable factors in order of greatest probability posted by an expert like the aforementioned Tres Martin. Which is probably part of the info you pay for in his class.
 

prorider

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Yes the only way. You couldn’t turn a 32 DW over under 40 if you tried. I have taken that corner from 40 -90 in cats for 20 years. You feel the current but it’s no big deal.
 

dave29

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In my 25 I trim all the way down and round it like at 40 pumping away at the steering wheel like tres taught me. Even then the water feel sketchy.
I meant to respond to this comment not the previous one just above from me.
 

Ziggy

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Tres Martin also teaches people not to not to turn the wheel Con continuously in a cat but makes small turns and then return back to 12 o’clock and then go back to 9 o’clock and then back to 12 o’clock etc. etc. etc. and that will keep a cat much more stable and less risk of an overturn
I've heard someone use the term "dailing in" for this process.
 

NeedlesRat

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Glad to hear everyone is going to be ok. I’d be very interested in knowing if everyone was wearing jackets. Boat shouldn’t be terribly hard to fix provided nothing structural weird happened.

Slower isn’t always better, especially in a cat in my opinion. Who knows the circumstances, maybe we never will.

I can tell you that corner in a twin OB 25 Daytona will 100% get your attention if you aren’t on your game!

Shit happens fast, traffic, no traffic, speed, no speed, wake boats, no wake boats…… Wear your jackets, wear your lanyard, keep your eyes up and be driving the boat 1/4-1/2 mile ahead at all times.
Couldn’t agree more. We have a Mach with twins and that turn every time will get your attention. Natural current/flow from the turn, rollers from people coming on/off plane to go into/out of sand bar, and rollers from boats coming and going makes for an interesting feel. Gets my attention every time. The DW is my dream boat and they truly have the perfect set. I can only imagine it was a fluke incident for this driver and happy they are all alive and what sounds to be recoverable. Just an ego dent is the best outcome.
 

FlyByWire

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If you think this is bad, you should see the comments on RiverWhips…

Probably from people who’ve never even seen one in person.

Id love to own a boat like that someday.

I think I know who this is, and if I’m right he’s got a lot of experience in the boat.

That corner makes me uncomfortable every time I take it and I don’t have a high performance boat in the least.

Hoping for a speedy recovery for all.
 

RiverDave

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Everybody jump to conclusions and pretend your conclusion with zero first hand experience is better than everyone else’s that wasn’t there. 🙄
If you think this is bad, you should see the comments on RiverWhips…

I haven’t really seen a lot of that in here.. to the point which comments are you referring too?

RD
 

Happy Smitty

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Probably from people who’ve never even seen one in person.

Id love to own a boat like that someday.

I think I know who this is, and if I’m right he’s got a lot of experience in the boat.

That corner makes me uncomfortable every time I take it and I don’t have a high performance boat in the least.

Hoping for a speedy recovery for all.
Same here, that corner makes me feel uncomfortable. Not so much in my 19 foot boat, the 22 jet just a bit, my 29 is a lot of boat and I slow for the turn and power through it.
 

Englewood

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Is this the turn going up-river before the sandbar?
 

HullofaTime

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I’ve been drinking with Dave all night and now that he went home I’ll give a little update lol.

Rob, the driver, blood alcohol level was zero, he is out of surgery with some new hardware in the legs. All these nonsense comments on river whips is just ignorant comments, Rob knows that boat very well. Hell he even fishes off of it on an any given Wednesday, the river was blown the fuck out and accidents happen. Pretty much everyone can put this to bed. The amount of stupid comments on all platforms is hysterical at this point. We are all boating people and no alcohol involved, we shouldn’t be bashing an accident as if it couldn’t happen to anyone else.
 

JFMFG

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I’ve been drinking with Dave all night and now that he went home I’ll give a little update lol.

Rob, the driver, blood alcohol level was zero, he is out of surgery with some new hardware in the legs. All these nonsense comments on river whips is just ignorant comments, Rob knows that boat very well. Hell he even fishes off of it on an any given Wednesday, the river was blown the fuck out and accidents happen. Pretty much everyone can put this to bed. The amount of stupid comments on all platforms is hysterical at this point. We are all boating people and no alcohol involved, we shouldn’t be bashing an accident as if it couldn’t happen to anyone else.
People love to speculate. Glad everyone is ok. It’s just one of those things. Shit happens.
 

FlyByWire

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Damn, what do you consider “high performance boat” because I think yours is definitely a high performance boat to me….

Ehh. I think I compare everything to cars.. what I consider to be high performance would be the boats that pack a lot of air or run pretty fast (a corvette or Ferrari etc). Id compare what I have to a Buick station wagon with a big motor or something. Sure it’ll bite you if you drive it off the road or into a tree..but it’s not going to blow over and you’d probably have to fuck up big time to get it to roll.
 

4Waters

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Ehh. I think I compare everything to cars.. what I consider to be high performance would be the boats that pack a lot of air or run pretty fast (a corvette or Ferrari etc). Id compare what I have to a Buick station wagon with a big motor or something. Sure it’ll bite you if you drive it off the road or into a tree..but it’s not going to blow over and you’d probably have to fuck up big time to get it to roll.
So you have a Vista Cruiser with the 455 in it🤣

High performance is relative. I have a Caliber 1, it's considered a "performance" boat and will run just over 70 but I wouldn't consider it "high performance". Now someone that has only been on a basic Searay or Bayliner type boat may consider my boat "high performance".

I would consider a boat high performance at 90mph plus but someone like @Bullhead bully would consider a boat that runs 90-95 a cruiser 🤷
 

Ziggy

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I’ve been drinking with Dave all night and now that he went home I’ll give a little update lol.

Rob, the driver, blood alcohol level was zero, he is out of surgery with some new hardware in the legs. All these nonsense comments on river whips is just ignorant comments, Rob knows that boat very well. Hell he even fishes off of it on an any given Wednesday, the river was blown the fuck out and accidents happen. Pretty much everyone can put this to bed. The amount of stupid comments on all platforms is hysterical at this point. We are all boating people and no alcohol involved, we shouldn’t be bashing an accident as if it couldn’t happen to anyone else.
Thanks for the update👍 Awesome to know they're all mending.
I'll say that this particular thread did not negatively go off the rails like most in the past have & if anything it brought up discussion about a bend in the river that has unique characteristics many have felt or been surprised by in their own boats.
 

MonkeyButt70

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Overall I thought this thread is informative. Anytime there is a incident it is helpful to hear all the different angles of possibilities these accidents can happen. We can all learn from both negative and positive comments to do our best for keeping our occupants and other boats from getting hurt.
 

Rajobigguy

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So you have a Vista Cruiser with the 455 in it🤣

High performance is relative. I have a Caliber 1, it's considered a "performance" boat and will run just over 70 but I wouldn't consider it "high performance". Now someone that has only been on a basic Searay or Bayliner type boat may consider my boat "high performance".

I would consider a boat high performance at 90mph plus but someone like @Bullhead bully would consider a boat that runs 90-95 a cruiser 🤷
Mine is more like the Wagon Queen Family Truckster with the CB and optional rally fun pack.
Damn. by the stds. that you guys set for a performance boat I guess I'm piloting the equivalent of an old Checker Marathon.
 

oldman

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So you have a Vista Cruiser with the 455 in it🤣

High performance is relative. I have a Caliber 1, it's considered a "performance" boat and will run just over 70 but I wouldn't consider it "high performance". Now someone that has only been on a basic Searay or Bayliner type boat may consider my boat "high performance".

I would consider a boat high performance at 90mph plus but someone like @Bullhead bully would consider a boat that runs 90-95 a cruiser 🤷
Throw experience to the mix, and that turns an average boat into a complicated mess, I don't consider my Family truckster deck boat a high performance craft, It probably runs 78 trimmed up. But I've run it for twenty years and I still don't know every scenario.

Now throw my son at the wheel who's probably driven it twice, suddenly its a rocket, between trim and tab controls a lot is going on under water And I could see him upside down on a weekend like this.

I've been quiet through all of this, One I don't boat out of Havasu, and don't know that stretch well, also speculation can be the worst. Sorry to hear about the accident, And hope everyone heals up well.
 

monkeyswrench

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I think there are a ton of variables that some of us don't fully comprehend. I had a conversation here with a known "performance" boat owner years back. It was about the difference between two boats, both cats, equivalent power and size. To me, two names but they looked "the same". He said the handling characteristics were vastly different. From "hop" to turning, two completely different animals, and both capable of 100+mph :oops:

I've never owned a cat. The only one I've ridden in/driven is what I would consider a "family" cat...a Magic deck with a 496. I love that boat, but it's far from a "knock your socks of" kind of battleship. Add in a lighter hull, twin outboards and this "packing air" thing, and it's a different world, I'm sure.

Fast boats are probably a lot like fast cars. They can all be fast, but do it differently with different attributes. Accidents happen at race tracks, with cars driven by the best drivers, taking precautions to not die at least. Variables are just that, variable. Sometimes they can bite you in the ass.
 
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